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R/E/P => R/E/P Archives => j. hall => Topic started by: twonky on July 26, 2004, 05:33:19 pm

Title: Weird issues recording Keys thru Amp
Post by: twonky on July 26, 2004, 05:33:19 pm
Gents-

I am experiencing a strange aural phenomenon while trying to record an Alesis Andromeda thru a Carvin keyboard amp.

I will give a little info- I am tracking through a Mackie 1604VLZ into Samplitude. I am tracking w/ a band right now KBD, Bass and drums. The keyboard amp has direct outs that I have been using mostly, they sound really good. But the other night the keyboard player wanted to a different sound from one of her tracks, something less DI sounding. So I though “no big deal, the amp sound really good I will just throw up some mics and voila! cool mic’d sound.” I was quite wrong. The amp has 2 10” speakers and a 15” and a little tweeter up top. So I put a 57 in one 10 and a Sennheiser 421 on the other (to compare later),  a beta 52 and an AT atm25 on the 15”. I also put a ADK A51 (lrg diaphragm condenser) about 2’ back from the amp AND ran a stereo DI signal.

The DI signal as usual sounded really good. But each mic either together or by itself sounded very phasey and muddy. So I tried reversing phase on the channels in different combos and they all sounded bad and phasey no matter what. Totally unusable. So after an hour of moving them around and rerecording them I finally gave up and just put up my two Earthworks TC30k’s (matched pair), thinking that these are the best and most neutral mics I have, I set them about 6’ away from the amp in an XY pattern, recorded it and got the same results weird phasey dull keys.

I mean, we are very happy w/ the DI sound but this has become a bit of a personal issue at this point, I should be able to record this amp!

Am I totally missing something here? Is there some physics anomaly that I am not taking into consideration?

Any help is GREATLY appreciated

Twonky
Title: Re: Weird issues recording Keys thru Amp
Post by: Thomas Lester on July 26, 2004, 06:17:07 pm
I think your first effort, you WAY over did it.  That was like 5 or 6 mics on a single source and you are wondering why it sounded "phasy".  

I'd keep it really simple...  Take a R-121, or if you don't have one of those, try a large diaphram condensor of your liking.  I'd imaging something like a U67, M49, AT4060 or the like would sound good.  

Just take one, back it off some....  maybe 3-4 feet (play with it).

Also... here's what I often do with keys.  I'll record with a DI.  I'll then pump the keys back into the live room through the studio speakers (or a amp).  Then I blend to taste.

Also...  ditch the keyboard amp...  get a hot guitar amp of sorts and run the keys through.  Play with that for a fun sound.

Good luck.

-Tom

PS...  let us know if you find something you liked.
Title: Re: Weird issues recording Keys thru Amp
Post by: Fibes on July 26, 2004, 06:44:42 pm
YEAH too much...

Try getting the amp off the floor and watch for early reflections from surrounding walls. I assume the amp sounded fine in the room before any of this.
Title: Re: Weird issues recording Keys thru Amp
Post by: craig boychuk on July 28, 2004, 10:06:24 am
I've had great results on many separate occasions with a 414 set to cardiod like an inch from the grill, on axis, and maybe a couple inches down from the center of the cone. You'll probably want to use the pad on the mic, also. This way you can eliminate any room reflections, and IMO the 414 sounds pretty awesome for keys.  Any other mic will work, of course. Large diaphragm condensers seem to be a good idea. Check the phase with the DI, and yer dancin'!
Title: Re: Weird issues recording Keys thru Amp
Post by: drumsound on August 05, 2004, 11:43:18 pm
If you don't but the amp on a chair, put a peice of carpet under the froms and the mic stand .  That will eliminate reflections form the floor.