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R/E/P => Mastering Dynamics => Topic started by: bblackwood on July 20, 2011, 09:02:54 am

Title: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: bblackwood on July 20, 2011, 09:02:54 am
I have some ideas bouncing around right now, so tell me - how would you describe your ultimate EQ? Describe it however you wish, tone characteristics, topology, number / type of bands, etc. Doesn't have to be your only EQ, just the ultimate if you could have it...
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: SafeandSoundMastering on July 20, 2011, 11:14:05 am
8 band (built into 2 x 3 u 19inch racks one above the other)
+ HP/LP filters top and bottom 12/18/24/32/48 dB per octave.

Top and bottom 2 band switchable between shelf and parametric.
Band bypass. Full bypass.
Gain I/O trims.
Passive circuit and Active T-Filter circuit (yes they sound good) switchable per band.
Stereo ganged, switched goes without saying on here.
Switchable transformers in / Switchable transformers out.
M/S/Stereo switchable per band.
Neutrik gold plated connectors.
Totally shielded over specced torroidal PSU
Costs £1,000.00, lol

The silkiest top end know to man, rare I need an eq to dirty stuff up at the top end.
Firm controlled deep discrete low end. Just want control here not colour.
Mids that are not overly 3d enhancing i find this annoying sometimes, change tone but not width.

That'll do.


Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: jdg on July 20, 2011, 12:37:07 pm
lots of overlapping frequency choices ala MEA2

6 bands, HPF and LPF

and most importantly, NO BLUE LEDs
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: aleatoric on July 20, 2011, 05:20:53 pm
Keeping it simple I'm going to say a Sontec MES-482 (use to be called MES-462) with the addition of individual band bypass switches and stepped HPF/LPF.  If I wanted to get nutty I'd say a dual mono version of the MES-482 with a built in M/S Matrix as well.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: KAyo on July 20, 2011, 05:56:22 pm
I wish I could contribute with technical knowhow.. but, my feelings are as follows ..

Apart from conventional EQ type machines, I am really digging the tonality machines too.

Like the BX_Digital EQ concept with its tone control.
Or the Elysia – museq hypothesis.
Maybe even, the Abbey road stylization for tonality, such as the TG12410's Tone Control and Filter modules.

A hybrid of sorts aimed solely aimed at the Mastering fraternity, that would be an interesting concept and most importantly a competitive pricing and affordability. I mean, one could go and built the best fandangle EQ, but, how affordable is it going to be?  As one is now most definitely competing with superior quality plugs too and a perceived mind set in the public that plugs are the same. By that I mean, how many in the overall audio fraternity have now decided that attaining the UAD versions of the Manley incarnations are good enough to satisfy their Manley cravings or credentials. You get …


Ciao’
KAyo
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Ben F on July 20, 2011, 10:17:12 pm
Keeping it simple I'm going to say a Sontec MES-482 (use to be called MES-462) with the addition of individual band bypass switches and stepped HPF/LPF. 

And properly built!

Sound wise you would have to say the Sontec had stood the test of time. Ergonomically as well.

My 'ultimate' workhorse would be stereo ganged unit that was based on the winning Sontec sound, with overlapping frequencies like the MES-462, but with the addition of HP/LP filters that sounded like the BAX- fast and transparent. I would also have the shelves and filters separated into L/R, with one frequency knob and 2 gain knobs like the BAX. These could be switchable between L/R or M/S, but the rest of the EQ was in ganged stereo. That would cover most situations.

Not too fussed about a transformer option, there are too many variants (clean or coloured, and what type of colour?).

Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Ed Littman on July 21, 2011, 08:23:59 am
A while back before I got my Buzz I spoke to Burgess about custom applying the duo option ( Double set of electronics,ITI & Sontec)to the 432D9 with separate activation controls for each channel. The outcome would allow the ITI or Sontec modules to be chosen per channel independently if running the unit in a ms matrix. I don't know if this is the ultimate rig but Burgess was interested in builing one like this.

Ed
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Greg Reierson on July 21, 2011, 10:03:56 am
HP
LP
HS
LS
6 peaking bands
all bands out of circuit unless enabled
32 steps to allow for a wide and overlapping frequency range per band
Q = .5 to 3
dual concentric switches that can be used in stereo or dual mono
MS matrix
clean, clean, clean

I'm adding up the parts count in my head. Not gonna be cheap!


GR
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: SafeandSoundMastering on July 21, 2011, 10:53:24 am
You could always buy the plug in version, lol.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Gold on July 21, 2011, 11:17:44 am
I've been thinking it would be nicer to have a few smaller specialized EQ's rather than one ultimate EQ. I like having a very broad soft focus EQ like the QE's I use. No need for a Q control or many frequency selection points. It does what it does. I'd like to have a four band shelving EQ. No Q control needed for that either. Then six or eight parametric bands maybe broke up into two boxes at two points in the chain.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on July 21, 2011, 12:15:53 pm
Been there done that.. It's getting harder to do another same but different EQ.

Perhaps it's time to rethink the paradigm of EQ... Instead of turning a knob to get boost/cut, how about turning knobs to set a target or mask for a desired spectral result. Then the EQ would compare the input and equalize to get the target output.

Of course this would be more program dependent, that simply corrective for fixed path response errors that might respond better to simple EQ. 

Not a universal solution but perhaps has merit for some applications, in combination with conventional technology.

 or not...

JR

 
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: SafeandSoundMastering on July 21, 2011, 12:49:31 pm
There is no way I could operate without having both coloured and clean EQ's personally. Obviously the key being when and where they get used which makes all the difference.

Though simplification is good. You sure can have too much of a good thing.

I now know what I use the most and that is a good place to be for workflow.

Quote
Instead of turning a knob to get boost/cut, how about turning knobs to set a target or mask for a desired spectral result.

I think some passive / retro eq types have that covered.


Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: djwaudio on July 21, 2011, 03:56:49 pm
I think the Avalon has the right idea with the combination of active and passive filters on one unit. 

I could see taking this to another level.



Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Patrik_T on July 21, 2011, 04:14:06 pm
...
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Dave-G on July 21, 2011, 08:29:28 pm
Maselec controls and frequencies, NSEQ-F sonics ... bonus if it also dispenses pie.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: turtlerock on July 22, 2011, 07:50:28 am
i really like the mid and the high of the avalon
 the bottom of the pultec  the bottom of the  dyn eq weiss  and i am still searching the world for the low mids  :)

interestingly i just bought  a  focusrite red two again
 i had serial no # 3 first time around and used it successfully  for many years  but sold it to buy a massive passive  when they were new

i have always wished i still had the red 2 and now they are  "just an old rubbish eq " according to the net
i was happy to buy one back again for small change

i just sold the api 5500  - i have too much stuff  and  only ever used its low mid anyway  and even that isnt right

i would love an eq that did something  to the 240 -450 htz range that i could use

i have a custom  parkside sound eq with an elliptical eq on board  that is pretty close to most of what  across the board - but its not easy to talk about the sound of them  as there are only a few of them around and all a bit different
i got stung with the brand  when they fell over  and ended up buying it
put that down to stupidity on my part
interesting circuits though  and over engineered all day long

Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: SafeandSoundMastering on July 22, 2011, 08:47:03 am
I also do not comprehend the 5500 as a mastering eq. It was afterall a desk eq and it very much sounds like it IMO. Pretty unrefined sound to me. If you want to rough something up it might do the trick.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: turtlerock on July 22, 2011, 09:06:11 am
cant really agree with that barry
 it certainly fills all the needs of a mastering eq except i dont ever seem to turn it on
i can do what it does better

the thing is that it  IS NOT the same as the  api desk eq  even if they market it as such
 i put it up against a 550a and a new 550b
on my audio precision  test set

the 5500 curves are different ...  its a classy refined box
i guess  just dont like it  i dont like lots of stuff

i bought it because the low mids are fantastic   better then most things

i sold it 3 years later  because i had not  put in on a record in 6 months  and i am trying my best to simplify
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: SafeandSoundMastering on July 22, 2011, 12:02:25 pm
Well I cannot reconcile your 2 posts, sure seems like you have mixed feelings for it.

Quote
only ever used its low mid anyway  and even that isnt right

cant really agree with that barry

i can do what it does better

the 5500 curves are different ...  its a classy refined box
i guess  just dont like it  i dont like lots of stuff

i bought it because the low mids are fantastic   better then most things

I thought it seemed weakly built for a piece of kit falling in the high end category and did nothing any eq plug in could not manage with ease. I think it is priced interestingly i.e. a grand or 2 cheaper than other boxes that could be deemed mastering grade but I felt it was inflexible and could hear it would not be much use/good value/suitable for much material I work with.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: turtlerock on July 22, 2011, 06:18:51 pm
i guess my point is that its  a classy well made mastering eq , not  just  part of a console board
 and it  more the point ..it isnt what it "claims to be "  it is not a mastering  version 550b  -- the curves are different

 but i just wasnt using it - i have at least ten outboard mastering eq - when i say at least .. there are more but they are  up the back of my studio /warehouse awaiting use or sale or .... their time

there is so much stuff out there   nowadays
i would love a "ultimate eq "

i keep getting into a box for one sound - which has always worked out sonically
then you wake up one day look around and see the madness in it all

not conflicted  barry the api is about as good as any of it  - 
i guess i was just reacting to your  idea that it is a stepped 550 b - its not ... its better then that  !
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Cass Anawaty on July 22, 2011, 06:44:19 pm
Dig my 5500.  Actually bought it from another ME that wasn't using it much.   ;D

Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Nescafe on July 22, 2011, 06:55:47 pm
5 knobs & one switch

- 5 band peaking, fix frequency, proportional Q, no individual bypass
- stepped switch 0.5dB, 24 position is OK
- parrarel design
- band 1&2 (low) using discrete solid state amp
- band 3,4,5 (mid-hi) using tube amp
- bypass switch
- as high as possible headroom
- easy maintenance, wide availability parts







Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: turtlerock on July 22, 2011, 07:02:30 pm
i want mine in a choice of black or black
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Alécio Costa - Brazil on July 23, 2011, 04:57:06 pm
6 Bands per channel, M-S/Stereo, Tube and clean ( A cross between the Ibis, Buzz Audio and the Millenia).
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Mastertone on July 23, 2011, 05:41:47 pm
Right now i cant get the idea of a graphic eq á la Bernie G. out of my head.

~7 bands, vari Q, a few dbs cut boost...
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: masteringhouse on July 23, 2011, 09:57:25 pm
An Ibis with Fearn VT4/5 circuitry. Color control not needed (not that the Fearn is colorful, just have other methods of achieving this)
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: turtlerock on July 24, 2011, 01:22:47 am
Right now i cant get the idea of a graphic eq á la Bernie G. out of my head.

~7 bands, vari Q, a few dbs cut boost...

I seem to recall fletcher telling me that those things were made out of the little  ( urei or shure ) room eq modules  the ones with fixed freqs in little boxes  that you stacked together to make  room / pa eqs
  he told me something like for the japn BGM he had to buy them  every module he could find  !

can somebody help my memory on this ..?
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: jdg on July 24, 2011, 01:42:52 am
... bonus if it also dispenses pie.

of three types:
pizza, meat, fruit
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Viitalahde on July 24, 2011, 04:36:21 am
A Niveau filter with two parametric bands. That thing could do anything.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: masteringhouse on July 24, 2011, 11:51:49 am
A Niveau filter with two parametric bands. That thing could do anything.

Jaakko,

Not hardware, but have you tried this?

http://www.elysia.com/software/niveau-filter/

Or am I out of the loop on something.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: lowland on July 25, 2011, 04:04:46 am
Jaakko,

Not hardware, but have you tried this?

http://www.elysia.com/software/niveau-filter/

Or am I out of the loop on something.

I tried that, Tom, and although it sounded OK I found it fiddly to set with steps that were too coarse for mastering. I just left it after an hour or so because my instinct wasn't telling me to go with it, and I've learnt to trust that feeling.

This of course isn't to say that 1. a premium plug-in couldn't be designed to do the job well and 2. a Niveau filter wouldn't be a great thing to have - every so often I feel that ADT one calling to me with a Siren voice...
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: lowland on July 25, 2011, 04:08:15 am
i would love an eq that did something  to the 240 -450 htz range that i could use

Hi Rick,

I've found the Great River MAQ-2NV to be useful in that area - have you heard it? It does other good stuff too.

The MAQ is surprisingly close to my ultimate EQ, or maybe I'm just easily pleased. Great though would it be to have an extra band, more frequency choices and more bell settings in the upper and lower bands, I seem to get by and it has that paradoxical quality of being neutral but musical.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: bblackwood on July 25, 2011, 08:42:22 am
A Niveau filter with two parametric bands. That thing could do anything.
Hrmmm...

*strokes beard*
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Gold on July 25, 2011, 12:46:09 pm
Hrmmm...

*strokes beard*

Agrees. I think Jaakko may have won the contest. I'd add HPF/LPF. That would be a killer EQ.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Viitalahde on July 25, 2011, 03:48:30 pm
I've been interested in the Niveau filter for quite some time, now. I was *this* close to buying the ADT version, but I decided to postpone it and put the cash elsewhere.

Say, anchor point of 700-800Hz. +/-3dB max. I have no idea how does the classic "tilt EQ" circuit sound like: http://gilmore2.chem.northwestern.edu/projects/showfile.php?file=equal_prj.htm (http://gilmore2.chem.northwestern.edu/projects/showfile.php?file=equal_prj.htm)

Could be something to consider.

Parametric bands? I'd try Dove's CAPS filters, because I haven't tried them yet. I haven't tried Wein bridges either, but CAPS interests me more.

Paul has a point with LPF/HPF. I've began to use LPF's now and then. I'd make them 2nd order, Sallen-Key filters and Q=0,57.
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: dietrich on July 25, 2011, 04:55:11 pm
I like the idea of a semi-modular mastering EQ.

Sontec Low band module+Sontec high shelf
Focusrite 315 low band with transformer in/out switch
Two bands of tube mid freq eq modules
Bax low shelf
Bax filters
Neumann PEV mid band .5 steps
m/s in/out on all
NO WHITE LEDS!
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: DOMC on July 26, 2011, 02:15:20 am
I have no idea how does the classic "tilt EQ" circuit sound like: http://gilmore2.chem.northwestern.edu/projects/showfile.php?file=equal_prj.htm (http://gilmore2.chem.northwestern.edu/projects/showfile.php?file=equal_prj.htm)

It's in final testing phase will let you know soon :D
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Mastertone on November 14, 2011, 10:40:17 am
I seem to recall fletcher telling me that those things were made out of the little  ( urei or shure ) room eq modules  the ones with fixed freqs in little boxes  that you stacked together to make  room / pa eqs
  he told me something like for the japn BGM he had to buy them  every module he could find  !

can somebody help my memory on this ..?
Hmm, could it be based on the Urei 539 or 537?
Anyone know more about this?
Title: Re: Describe your 'ultimate' EQ...
Post by: Jerry Tubb on November 14, 2011, 11:26:49 am
Hmm, could it be based on the Urei 539 or 537?
Anyone know more about this?

More likely built from a classic Urei 530,
9 two octave bands on non standard centers 50-100-200-400-800 etc.
I only recently gave away a 530 that I'd had for many years.

JT