Post by: intervalkid on October 22, 2006, 02:33:43 AM
I have been upgrading my studio components over the last few months so I can get him tracks that will end up sounding as good as a major label act (Godwilling) production wise.
I have so far a 3.2 Ghz 2GB RAM 250GB HD HT P4
A MOTU 1224 upgraded by Black Lion (pending)
A SmPro upgraded by Black Lion (pending)
a Shure KSM44, CAD E-100, SM57's and 58's
Valley international 400 mic channel
Valley People Dynamite compressor
2 Ted Fletcher Joe Meek MQ3's
Aphex 107 dual mic pre
Aphex Dominator II multi band compressor
ART Pro Channel
Now these items should handle the instruments okay.
I really want to capture his voice superbly but haven't much money to spend.
I'm looking at a few single channel preamps such as
the Groove Tubes Brick
the True Systems P-Solo
Grace 101
all around the $500 mark. Do any of you have any experience with these preamps?
I'm probably going to use the KSM44 for vocals (ya never know though).
The vocalist has a natural high tenor. Any suggestions or input on the aformentioned preamps?
Post by: Teddy G. on October 22, 2006, 09:28:29 AM
The Grace Designs is the most likely to be found in a major label studio, of the choices you offer. Does that mean much? Well, it's been out the longest.....? And, BTW, that "ART" thing? Ahhhhh? Hide that in the closet when you're telling your clients about your "major label sound", ey? May be "fine", but, hide it. Let's move on.
"500 each" sounds like such ALOT of money, doesn't it?!?! It's one of those "break points"... $1000, is another... Alot of money...... It is, among other things, the "break points" that seem to seperate those of us who "fool around", from those of who try to "make a living" to those of us who make enough that they no longer worry about "break points", as equipment cost is such a small part of their budget/life... Unfortunately we ALL want to "sound big time"(Like "major label") without spending the coins - mainly when we don't have it... Sooner or later... if we really DO want to be "big time" we've just got to...... start.
I suggest getting that start - here - now - with your mic pre's(As good a place as any, better than most.). Consider getting even "just one" mic pre of superb/unquestioned quality -- the kind of pre you just don't have to ask anyone "which of these 3???".
When you get to something like these(Just an example):
http://www.mercenary.com/johharmicpre.html
you are "there". Of course there are others - The Millenia Media solid state pre's are some I can personally recommend, for instance - I've used them with everything from Senn 421's to the most expensive Neuman's made today and yesterday - this "grade" of pre just doesn't get in the way(Doesn't make the 421 sound any better, but, that's what we're looking for, ey?). There may be better pre's, at times, for special occasions, but, that's another topic. Any major label would be proud to offer these in their studios, for use on any project, for any client(And do!).
Now, today, 2006, your "break point" is $1000 to $1500 per channel -- but, it is THIS break point(Let's call it $1,500 and be "safe".), at or above which there is almost nothing left TO argue about(Cherry wood or Walnut finish???) - and that's a great "point"! At this level you no longer have to worry about your gear! Now you can begin to seriously worry about what you're recording. Yes, a very good point.
Another nice thing. Once you get above the "final break point" there are less questions -- there just plain aren't as many to choose from! Also nice... easier on the head.
Still, to "break" from pre's, for just a moment, I'd rather START with this "list", in this order:
The "Room" - the recording space. The recording and mixing space(s) will, pretty much, determine "the sound". Without starting here not only may you never get "the sound", you are quite likely to never be able to hear what you ARE getting, no matter the gear. Start with the room - put ALL your money/effort/study/questions into it - then ANY gear you put in it will give you it's best - you'll KNOW "it's sound" - and THE BEST gear will have an opportunity to get you that "major label sound" - once you learn how to use it! It will be so much easier to learn when you are not hopelesly constricted by a poor environment.
Next on the list - Software(Possibly sad, but, it is 2006.): The software you're going to use determines everything! From which computer to which "everything" to follow.
Interface/soundcard: Having the largest/most colorful/most frequent ads in the magazines should not be the "determining factor". We all see the big companies(Often the conglomerates who just bought everything they could and now are just trying to make their investments pay-off at any cost, usually "our" cost...) who dominate the magazines, don't we? We all have "stuff" from them, some of it good... However, it would serve you well to "dig in", look around, see what's REALLY being used by those "major label" types... You've got to know and go after whatever "it" is. Happily, one need not go far above the "break point", for now, as all of that stuff "up there" is "hand made" just for those who have no idea what else to spend their money on - even they can't really hear the diference, but they don't care... And that's a good thing, too.
The "pre's" for mic/instrument. Considering that computers and software and sound cards darned well better not have "a sound", the pre's should be the first point to "listen for". Yes, pre's can have "a sound", but this is for later. First up, we want pre's that add or subtract as little as possible - the basic, "perfect" tool(Used to be called "straight wire audio", which meant you couldn't tell if it was in or out, it just raised or lowered the volume, if anything.), which we can build around. Unquestioned quality, handles any mic very well indeed, with as few "variables" as possible(Yes, I realize this, pretty much, leaves out ANY "tube" gear. Holler if you must, but we ALL know this - tube gear, today, is
AN ASIDE---With rare, all-high-priced, exceptions! My favorite mic in the world is a tube mic, but "the tube" is only part of it's wonderful design and construction AND it is priced at DOUBLE the "break point" dicussed here and I DON'T NEED IT to do "major label work"(Good idea to dump this "major label sound" crap, as much major label stuff sucks. Let's call it "pro gear") I'D WANT IT! But, that's another topic---
indeed a "specialty item" with "a sound" - may be great! But... cannot be part of our initial "standards", not today.). Your "rocks" your "standards" will never need upgraded to anything "better". They will allow you to compare/contrast any other piece of gear - even(Especially!) if the other piece of gear is some "exotic" piece - even another pre - with "a sound" -- how you gonna' know if you have no "base"?
Speakers or mics next??? Probably speakers. Yeah, speakers(Gotta be one or the other, I choose speakers! Da##it!). Speakers are "arguable" points, themselves. Speakers all have "a sound". There are no "flat" speakers, no speakers that don't add or subtract something. Best thing(Maybe the only thing?) we can do is to get past that "break point", LEARN THEM and forget them. Strangely(?), get above our first breakpoint of, say $1,500 per channel(A PIECE) and we're probably good to go. Comparing 1500 PER PAIR speakers(Or below) is like comparing $500 or $50 pre's - hopeless. Some good parts, some bad parts, none with all good parts, none reach the "break point" of unquestioned quality where "a sound" or "features" or the veneer on the cabinets, determine their "differences", none of which are important in getting a "good - pro - recording".
MIcs. Well, now that "we're here"(Bathrooms around to the left), we no longer have to worry about mics. Sometimes you'll want to use a capsule from a 1950's telephone handset that you found at a yardsale for a quarter, sometimes a KHE Brauner, which you picked up for 10 grand(Probably MORE, now that they are no longer being produced.). But, NOW, it will always be, simply, "the sound", no head scratching wondering if it "really sounds that way, or it's just my system", never "the gear" or at least never a question of "which one of these things is the right one for me to get that major label sound"? IT'LL ALL DO THAT!!!!!! If you have it in you.
TG
Post by: intervalkid on October 22, 2006, 03:37:48 PM
Now I understand that 1500-2000 bucks is the point of truly pro channels, (and yes the ART is not very good, its just the first thing I got and I haven't reason to get rid of it yet) but in the short time I have until this recording project I cannot afford the UA LA610 I am going to get some time next year. Say what you want about them being colored etc. I love the silky sound they produce.
I am working from a very tight budget as of now and cannot afford 2000 pre's at the moment. The Grace, as you said, may be my choice when I make the purchase, but I might just go for the extra $250 to get the UA solo 610, if it falls within my means. I would rather not do this as I would end up selling it after purchasing the LA610, but it would probably be worth it.
As far as software I have Sonar 4 (I'll probably upgrade to 6 after tracking for mixing), Waves Diamond bundle, Kontact 2, and Reason (which I probably won't use).
Yes, eventually, after I get on as a Fire Fighter (GodWilling) I will get Apogee Rosetta 16x converters, Manley, Vintech, UA, Massenburg, etc. channels, maybe a Midas board, Neumann, Manley, Gefell, Sony mic's etc., A slew of good plug ins (though I'd rather use outboard as much as possible), build a beautiful hardwood floor live room, get a bunch of gobo's, and have at it! But right now I'm dong what I can delivering pizza!
The recordings I've made so far in 16 bit on a Compaq Athlon 1.2 GHZ, 512MB RAM laptop, using only Cool Edit 2, an M-Audio USB Omnistudio interface, Waves, the ART, Mogami cables and the KSM44, being mastered professionally at Inpulse Mastering, lack the following qaulities when compared to albums such as "R" by Queens of the Stone Age; presence, detail, seperation, depth, and a little volume (though I will be recording in 24 bit). I'm not so worried about the volume, but having upgraded every link in the signal path, (except cables) I think it will significantly improve these attributes of my recording. Though the mic pres I have purchased are not in the 1500 category, they are better than the ART, and having different channels to combine different mics with will help seperation significantly (I hope). The software and converters/interface will help as well I am sure. So with a little Grace (no pun intended) I believe I can do the job.
God Willing.
Thanks for the input
Post by: Ricey on October 22, 2006, 10:45:03 PM
Post by: Thomas Lester on October 23, 2006, 10:43:02 AM
Then you can also book some more experienced engineering staff to help you.
This will go A LONG WAY toward getting that "pro" sound.
-Tom
Post by: Fibes on October 23, 2006, 01:17:59 PM
| Thomas Lester wrote on Mon, 23 October 2006 10:43 |
If you are going to be in Chicago, I'd just go ahead and book time at a studio. Steve is offering up his place for dirt cheap these days. See if you can book some time over there. If this guys is in fact super talented, then you probably don't need to book that much time. Then you can also book some more experienced engineering staff to help you. This will go A LONG WAY toward getting that "pro" sound. -Tom |
It seems like there are more and more people who think the gear makes the recordings and wherever they put the gear it will work wonders.
They stockpile while learning the ropes which IMNSHO is a bit of a dishonest approach.
I wish more people would spend the time doing pre-production on their "home-rigs" and figuring out their sound, arrangements, approach, strengths, weaknesses and poker skills as a precursor to going in and making a great room work for them than trying to do it all at home.
I didn't say all people.
But a great sounding room can be the difference between good and great recordings, even if the room is made of mud.
Did I mention how important the room is?
How about the guy operating the gear?
In a business where timing is everything, getting the stuff done NOW without a four-10 year learning curve seems like a better option.
Post by: Teddy G. on October 23, 2006, 02:17:14 PM
I have my own stuff, it's "fine", I'm "fine", for most projects I get offered to do, but, when it REALLY needs to be good, I happily turn my back on myself and go elsewhere......
Teddy G.
Meantime, the Grace will be more than good enough. As suggested, with it's rather low price, almost embarassingly so... And, it does look very "pro-ey", too. You may find you have to go w-a-y up the ladder to find one "better", and even there probably just for it's, desired, coloration... Still and all, you did say "3 or 4" are needed??? Maybe I read that wrong....? Anyway, for 2 grand or a bit more you can have at least 3 channels of John Hardy, as well... Decisions, decisions, decisions......
Post by: intervalkid on October 23, 2006, 10:07:37 PM
He has different musician's to perform on different tracks and we have to work around his work schedule. Booking time in a studio is not an option. I'm building the studio anyway.
Yeah yeah, the room. I understand Beck's "Mellow Gold" is still selling.
I have 17 years of experience recording. I have been recording as long as I have been a musician. This is my first gig recording music that I am not involved with, not my first gig.
I'm not "piling up gear while I learn the ropes" as you put it. As if the gear doesn't make a difference. Sure if you don't know what your doing it aint gonna help much, but if you do, then it will make the imperative difference.
I am bringing an experienced engineer with me who used to work at Triclops in Atlanta GA. Just cause I'm po' don't mean I'm stupid. As far as the room goes, I'll work with what I have. If the room sounds like trash then I'll dampen what mic's I can and add reverbs. I think it will be fine though.
As far as the Grace goes, forget it. I just bought a Rupert Neve Amek pure path channel in a box for $550!
Hahahahahahahahah!!!!!!
Post by: Fibes on October 24, 2006, 11:53:00 AM
| intervalkid wrote on Sun, 22 October 2006 02:33 |
Hi, I am preparing for my first big project as a producer/engineer. |
Pardon me for confusing the statement above with 17 years experience.
Don't worry about the gear, worry about being able to communicate clearly as a producer/engineer.
BTW for someone with 17 years experience you shouldn't need to be asking the questions you are asking.
A great room has no substitute.
Post by: intervalkid on October 24, 2006, 05:29:06 PM
If I haven't used them, I haven't used them. Regardless of how long I've been recording.
You are making alot of assumptions.
Never said there was a substitute for a great room.
Said I'll deal with what I have to, and that you can still make pro recording's without a fantastic room (ala Beck's album).
Anyway, I think I'll be all set. I am very hopeful and excited about this project! Noah's unique and skilled voice, sophisticated writing and pop sensibility are one of a kind.
God Willing it will go tops!
Post by: imagineaudio on October 25, 2006, 05:45:20 PM
Post by: intervalkid on October 26, 2006, 02:17:48 AM
When did that become taking something a bit personal?
Even, if I was taking things personal, so what?
I am passionate about music and it is a very personal thing, unless of course you are a business type(which the record industry seems to be flooded with nowadays). Which is, of course, why the music is going down the toilet.
Post by: James Duncan on October 26, 2006, 11:34:51 AM
[ignore]
Post by: intervalkid on October 26, 2006, 05:23:35 PM
I think it's pretty rude and arrogant to say things like "I hate when people pile up on gear when they are just learning the ropes." and "For someone with 17 years of experience you shouldn't be asking the questions you are asking."
I can see that we have a cliqueish attitude going around here.
If you want rude I can give it to you.
I'd rather not, but if you are so audacious as to call anybody who defends themselves after being belittled for a few questions, "rude and arrogant" then you have a sychphantic follow the pack mentality that should have been expelled out of the gene pool 1000's of years ago!
Post by: George_ on October 27, 2006, 01:30:13 AM
| Quote: |
God Willing it will go tops! |
no, not God Willing.. a lot of connections, a good "pop"song (if there is any), good songwriting and a mix that has no big problems will get you to the top.
If I am allowed to step in your little world, listen to the mixes of the Lord Alges brothers, a bit of old Led Zepplin.. analyze it/compare them.. and then start praying (if you like to).
go ahead, buy whatever you want, but please please educate yourself before buying something..
cheers
Post by: James Duncan on October 27, 2006, 11:36:54 AM
| intervalkid wrote on Thu, 26 October 2006 17:23 |
Rude?! Arrogant? When was I rude and arrogant? |
Well, it is possible that I misread your intentions, as sometimes it is difficult to interpret someone's emotions from the typewritten word as there are no "tone of the voice" or facial expressions to read. As I go back and re-read the thread, I still get "the impression" of arrogance, but I guess I can also see where I might have missed your intent.
If I have missread you, then I apologize. It just came off to me as arogant on first read.
Do you have a right to ask for opinions on different mic pres? Of course! Because you ask does that mean that you are somehow less of an engineer? Of course NOT! You just have no experience with the pres in question. I'll give you that one.
Maybe the use of more emoticions like
would help us (me) intepret your mood a bit better.I can also see where Fibes missunderstood you when you say this is your "first project" (or words to that effect) and then are asking about low-to-mid level gear, but want it to sound like a professional recording. Also, your current gear list reads like a home recording enthusiest that thinks they can get major label sounds from low-end gear in an untreated room. What else was he to think? If you had explained your background better early on, this would have helped.
I have to agree with Fibes that the sound of the recording has more to do with the room *than anything else*. A great room with a great performance is key. It sounded to me that he was offering good advice based on the information we all had at hand.
Then it sounded like you went off telling everyone how great you are with 17 years of experience, and how rude Fibes was for suggesting otherwise.
Maybe you are not rude, but just lack forum etiquette skills?
Best of luck with your search.
Post by: intervalkid on October 27, 2006, 04:33:20 PM
What, may I ask, do think I was doing asking people about their experience with these pre's?
I've been studying zeppelin recordings for 12 years.
Why is there some assumption that I am some bumbling idiot?
Why don't you click on my link below. Listen to "Rat's Snakes, Thieves and Wolves" (the only Pro mastered track listed)realizing first that it was recorded with only Cool Edit 2, an M-Audio USB Omni-studio interface, the ART preamp channel, and a KSM 44, Reason's Redrum, Blue Jay single hit drum samples, and Waves reverbs, in my bedroom. This is of course besides instruments.
Then tell me I won't be able to get pro-qaulity sound with the upgrades I have listed. Then be helpful and tell me why, instead of taking some air of superiority as if you were obviously and without question leagues beyond my skills and education and I couldn't possibly understand.
Everything is up to God's Will. If you think otherwise then that is your error.
Post by: Fibes on October 27, 2006, 05:32:22 PM
| Quote: |
Yeah yeah, the room. I understand Beck's "Mellow Gold" is still selling. |
Then later intervalkid wrote:
| Quote: |
Never said there was a substitute for a great room. |
Hmm, I'm getting mixed signals.
Those who know what a great room, deck and console can do understand the vitriol.
There was much good advice offered within this thread although I'm not sure if very much was taken, except to throw out of hand.
BTW Buy a 500 series rack and all the Adesigns pres you can fit into it. That's what my arrogance is doing now.
Post by: George_ on October 27, 2006, 05:48:42 PM
| Quote: |
Everything is up to God's Will. If you think otherwise then that is your error. |
now we are in the market about serious religious discussion again. you didn't understand ANY SINGLE WORLD of your favourite book..
and Fletcher is right. Whatever works for you.. works for you, and if your focus is limited to "witch preamp is better then the other" I am very sorry for you.
Go.. and fight the fire.. do you take Soda or normal water?
cheers and out
Post by: Andy Peters on October 27, 2006, 07:33:45 PM
| intervalkid wrote on Fri, 27 October 2006 13:33 |
Everything is up to God's Will. |
Then why even bother?
Just sit around on your ass, and wait for the Rapture.
-a
Post by: intervalkid on October 28, 2006, 01:53:54 AM
I said that I have 17 years of recording experience because it is a fact, not to boast of how good I am. Just that I understand the fundamentals of recording. I never said I had 17 years exerience recording in rich studios with loads of great gear and that I was expert at using it all. I said I had recorded my own bands.
The URL I have listed shows exactly how good or bad I am, given the gear and room that I recorded it with and in. Nothing more or less.
As far as me not understanding a word of the Bible, I don't see why you would make such an assumption, unless you think that just because we have free will, and bad things happen to good people it negates God's Will (God being Ultimate and Perfect Good). The Bible is as much an instruction on what not to do as it is what to do.
I suppose you haven't spent much time meditating on Eternal Existence vs. temporal existence. Eternal Exitence (where God is, though the Eternal can exist in the temporal, the temporal cannot exist in the Eternal) everything might as well for the sake of perspective, have already happened to those outside of time and living in Eternal Existence. Think of a scientist who knows the reaction between chemicals that he is going to mix. The chemical reaction seems to be instantaneous to the scientist, but on sub atomic levels there is much moving and changing. Equate this to our existence. God being the scientist, temporal reality being the chemical reaction, the elect being the product and the damned beng the waste product.
Bear in mind of course, that God is of Infinite perception and intelligence as well as all other virtuous attributes. We are manifesting ourselves into actual reality while the seemingly real is only temporal illusion, actual reality is Eternal.
So sitting on your ass all day, is not a viable option as what must be done must be done. Sure there are people who sit on there ass all day but I don't see how that is relevant to God's Will as factual reality. I suppose that is what they choose to do. From our perspective in time, the choices and accountability of our actions are our decisions. From a non-temporal/Eternal perspective, though the choices are already made, we still made them and are accountable. This however ends in the outcome that God intends.
Does that clear things up?
Peace
Jesus!
Post by: Andy Peters on October 28, 2006, 02:24:35 AM
| intervalkid wrote on Fri, 27 October 2006 22:53 |
(snip religious psychobabble) Does that clear things up? |
Yeah, completely.
Lighten up, Francis.
-a
Post by: Larrchild on October 28, 2006, 04:20:02 AM
Post by: Fibes on October 28, 2006, 11:38:05 AM
..
Post by: George_ on October 28, 2006, 12:41:34 PM
| Quote: |
Does that clear things up? |
yes completly.. take your medicine now and get well soon.
there are a lot of crazy people out there.. more crazy than I am.. that scares me.. and I am not talking about Fletcher cu in hell boy
cheers el dick from dickland 666
Post by: James Duncan on October 28, 2006, 12:47:59 PM
You are a poor representative of The Kingdom.
You have a crappy attitude and a chip on your shoulder.
Best of luck to you in your (temporal) life... you are going to need it.
I'm done with this thread.
P.S. I listened to the links too... everybody thinks they are a rock star.
Post by: intervalkid on October 29, 2006, 01:15:25 AM
Why am I a poor example of the Kingdom? Beaucse I care enough to try and explain to someone who beckons a religious discussion my understanding of God's Will? How does this make sense? In my own defense I might add. Would Jesus not do the same?
I'm sick of the abuse I'm taking here for actually asking questions and not acting like I know everything.
The Shi'its are having an uprising just as God told me they would 2 years ago (the week Sadaam was captured) I posted it on the 10Wise/Myspace Blog entitled "Uprising +" wit another Prophecy He gave me.
http://profile.myspace.com/10wise check the date of the post
(Dec 17 2005) when there was absolutely no indications that a Shi'ite uprising would occur. In fact at that time the Sunni's were causing all of the trouble and the Shi'ites were working with us at the head of the Iraqi govenment. So I would have to say all evidence points to the fact that God disagrees with you on that point. He trust me enough to speak to me and comfort me and guide me to all Truth and to knowledge of things that will come.
So take your hypocritical accusational judgements and attitude and actually study the Bible for once in prayer and consistency forsaking man made dogma.
Post by: intervalkid on October 29, 2006, 01:21:07 AM
Thanks for not attacking me.
Post by: Larrchild on October 29, 2006, 01:24:51 AM
It's really not as much a prophecy as a "No Brainer", there, Kreskin.
Post by: intervalkid on October 29, 2006, 01:37:27 AM
Whether what you say is true or not I will check.
Maybe when the relics of the catholics are destroyed you might believe.
The only real advice I got on here, excepting a few of the first posts before I landed the Amek, has been basically to give up and try to book into a studio, which is completely contradictory to my intention and outside of my means, and to concentrate on getting performances, which I fully intend to do.
I suppose if I had put up some of these
, maybe people would have understood that most of the beggining posts, before the Amek and attacks, was light hearted. I'm just not used to using them. I suppose I will more in the future.
Post by: Larrchild on October 29, 2006, 01:58:09 AM
Post by: intervalkid on October 29, 2006, 01:14:12 AM
Post by: neve1073 on October 29, 2006, 01:16:44 AM
Post by: intervalkid on October 29, 2006, 01:42:09 AM
, I just was looking for advice on the pres. I wish I could grab me a nice console and 16 track 2" 3M recorder (and a baddass room! )!I looked up the Colin Powell "Pottery Barn memo" and found nothing about Shi'ites, or uprising in particular. Just
"You're sure?" Mr. Powell is quoted as asking Mr. Bush in the Oval Office on Jan. 13, 2003, as the president told him he had made the decision to go forward. "You understand the consequences," he is said to have stated in a half-question. "You know you're going to be owning this place?" You are going to be the proud owner of 25 million people,' he told the president. 'You will own all their hopes, aspirations, and problems. You'll own it all.' Privately, Powell and Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage called this the Pottery Barn rule: You break it, you own it."
and statements alluding to it in recent news such as
"Apparently not."
Donald Rumsfeld, with what sounds to me like a hint of resignation, says that "the time has come for ordinary Iraqis to realize that they — not the Americans — will ultimately decide who prevails in this conflict."
and
"In my discussions with them in recent weeks, several have brought up Colin Powell's absurd argument about the Pottery Barn rule: if you break it, you own it. Well, yes, we broke Iraq, but we don't own it.In my discussions with them in recent weeks, several have brought up Colin Powell's absurd argument about the Pottery Barn rule: if you break it, you own it. Well, yes, we broke Iraq, but we don't own it."
These apparently attribute recent occurences as a testament to the falsehood of his statement rather than a backing of it.
I have no opinion on his statement one way or the other.
Anyway, thanks for the positivity and consideration (rather than blatent ridicule) of my witness.
Peace
Post by: Andy Peters on October 29, 2006, 01:10:49 PM
| intervalkid wrote on Sat, 28 October 2006 22:15 |
The Shi'its are having an uprising just as God told me they would 2 years ago (the week Sadaam was captured) I posted it on the 10Wise/Myspace Blog entitled "Uprising +" wit another Prophecy He gave me. |
G-d gave you a prophecy when Saddam was captured stating that basically Iraq would degenerate into sectarian civil war?
Funny: the experts who study and understand the Middle East (in other words, NOT the fucktards actually running the war) were saying that in 2002, before we invaded Iraq. Did G-d appear before them and give them the same prophecy?
And even better: back in 1991, the decision to NOT march to Baghdad and topple Saddam was made because it was understood that it'd be the start of a long occupation, fraught with sectarian violence. Did G-d appear before G. H. W. Bush and tell him what to do?
And how does this all square with Dubya saying that G-d tells him what to do? Does G-d have two faces?
And this same G-d is telling the Shi'ites to kill the Sunnis, and the Sunnis to kill the Shi'ites, and both of them to kill the Kurds, and the Americans, and ...
The contradictions are innumerable.
Next thing, you'll tell me that G-d favored the Cardinals over the Tigers. (Or my Mets.)
| Quote: |
So take your hypocritical accusational judgements and attitude and actually study the Bible for once in prayer and consistency forsaking man made dogma. |
Funny, the bible was written by men. Men with an agenda. Hence, the Apocrypha and the various other books deleted from the canon.
Face it, in some hopefully not-to-distant future, humans will look at the stories of the G-d of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Jesus, Mohammed and Dubya in the same way we look at the stories of the ancient Roman and Greek and Incan and Mayan gods -- as myths.
After all, who could possibly believe that a G-d who allegedly loves all of his children equally could command them to fight each other to the death?
The contradictions abound.
-a
Post by: wwittman on October 29, 2006, 02:01:45 PM
what POSSIBLE reason is there, other than blind superstition, to type "g_d" instead of 'god?'
Post by: intervalkid on October 30, 2006, 01:21:42 AM
God said the Shi'ites would have an uprising. Not that the Sunni's (who had been consistently rebelling) and Shi'ite government would have scurmishes. Not that there would be sectarian violence. A full scale uprising.
Who predicted that the Shi'ites would take over a city? Noone was saying anything about non-governmental Shi'ites doing anything against the US until they did. That is, except God to me, and me to anybody I could tell (as far as I know, maybe He told others). Just wait. You'll see.
I know it's God, there is no doubt about it.
Post by: George_ on October 30, 2006, 01:31:03 AM
stop taking drugs mr
oh yeah, and you should buy 2 germaniums from fletcher (www.mercenary.com).
cheers kurt cocaine
Post by: intervalkid on October 30, 2006, 02:00:31 AM
Yet if someone wrote a book about Hitler or Ghandi now, through researching, not knowing the men or even being intimate with people who do, would you question its acurracy as critically as you do the Holy Bible?
The problem is mainly with preachers who have been taught authoritarianism which has stretched down from the siezure of the Church by Rome around 200 AD. This authoritarianism leads to many false interpretations and contradictory dogma as well as absolutely anti-Biblical practices in many cases.
Even though the translations are somewhat flawed and slanted at times, if you get a Strong's Bible dictionary, you can clear up alot of the mess if you really get into the meat of it. Even without a Strong's if you really think, compare and contrast scriptures and your own experiences with veracity, the apparent contradictions actually function as checks and balances leading to a deeper knowledge of the Truth. The Bible doesn't spoon feed you like many philosophies or religions. It gives you guidelines and markers, examples and characters, personalities and relationships of vast differences, but with the same underlying message of Integrity, the Love of Truth, plain Reason, and Devotion to the Eternal and Loving God.
God wants you to think and to understand from the inside.
The exclusion of alot of the apocrypha is warranted because they have little or no concurrent validation and contradict plain statements made in absolutely authentic scripture.
I'm sure the Vatican may have more scripture stored up that hasn't been released, but the Bible as is more than sufficient. Of course it takes a little faith.
Have you even read it? Don't let hypocrites dilineate your perception or opinion of things. This leads to a missing out of those things most excellent.
Post by: neve1073 on October 30, 2006, 03:41:07 AM
Post by: Larrchild on October 30, 2006, 04:29:37 AM
Post by: JGreenslade on October 30, 2006, 07:22:35 AM
Joe can get things done...
Justin
Post by: Fibes on October 30, 2006, 10:35:12 AM
King James was a murderous vile man with a HUGE agenda, so, if that's what you are reading you are as wrong about "no agenda" as you are about Marklar.
Post by: intervalkid on October 30, 2006, 04:12:35 PM
I'm done.
Post by: intervalkid on October 30, 2006, 04:16:07 PM
Post by: neve1073 on October 30, 2006, 04:20:43 PM
Post by: wwittman on October 30, 2006, 07:13:50 PM
| intervalkid wrote on Mon, 30 October 2006 01:21 |
... Noone was saying anything about non-governmental Shi'ites doing anything against the US until they did. .. |
actually every Mid-East expert said so...
it's only the neo-con talking point people (like Bill Kristol) who lied and said otherwise.
Post by: Larrchild on October 31, 2006, 12:20:08 AM
We removed a Baathist regime from Iraq that was hostile to Iran.
We invaded Afghanistan and removed the Taliban who were hostile to Iran.
We installed a Shia regime in Iraq that is favorable to Iran.
We made Iraq a great place for previously unwelcome Islamists to have like a "Terrorism College".
We gave Shia fundimentalists their own Arab country for the first time.
I don't receive prophecies, but my magic 8 ball has "Could be Trouble" floating to the suface when I ask it.
Post by: Fibes on October 31, 2006, 10:06:45 AM
They keep the room warm at night.
Much comfort in the P-1.
Silky.
Yes, I used a buzzword.
Post by: wwittman on November 01, 2006, 04:52:12 AM
| Fibes wrote on Tue, 31 October 2006 10:06 |
With all of this crap going on in the world I'm just happy to stare into my A-designs mic pres as they lay there underneath the Neve 33115s, GTQ-2, API 512s and stare down on the VMP-2 and Demeter Pres. |
I feel the same way about my cats.
Post by: Invisible Member on November 01, 2006, 10:04:26 AM
| Andy Peters wrote on Sun, 29 October 2006 10:10 |
Funny, the bible was written by men. |
So was HTML, and yet it has provided mankind with both blessings and cursings depending upon the hearts of those who use it.
Should people therefore cast it aside because of it's inventor?
Mic pre's are like HTML....
What you put into it matters most...
Post by: Fibes on November 01, 2006, 11:20:30 AM
| Invisible Member wrote on Wed, 01 November 2006 10:04 | ||
So was HTML, and yet it has provided mankind with both blessings and cursings depending upon the hearts of those who use it. Should people therefore cast it aside because of it's inventor? Mic pre's are like HTML.... What you put into it matters most... |
Hahahahahahahaha!
Freaking brilliant.
I promise i won't tell.
Post by: PookyNMR on November 01, 2006, 11:48:13 AM
| intervalkid wrote on Mon, 30 October 2006 00:00 |
The exclusion of alot of the apocrypha is warranted because they have little or no concurrent validation and contradict plain statements made in absolutely authentic scripture. |
My friend, I say this with all due respect, but please stop talking until you read a few history books on the subject. There are a number of things that you are saying that do not even come close to the scholarship of historians, scribes, and translators over the past 2 millennia.
And to top it off, Steve's forum is not the appropriate place for such a discussion.
Peace.
Post by: intervalkid on November 03, 2006, 01:28:08 PM
I have and much of it is obvious bullocks. Some of it may very well be legit.
However, you are correct that this is not particularly the place to discuss such things (if there is any place where you shouldn't), I was not the one who started the dicussion. I simply said God Willing and was rebutted for it, and it blossomed out from there.
Now to get back to mic preamps. Anybody every used a Gates M5530? If so what did you think of it?
Peace
Adrian
Post by: Fibes on November 03, 2006, 02:48:16 PM
Not even worth going there here.
Ain Soph.
Post by: intervalkid on November 03, 2006, 03:09:46 PM
What of the Gates?
Peace
Adrian
Post by: maxdimario on November 04, 2006, 05:39:43 PM
after listening to the link with the highest star rating, I feel that the mic pre quality is not going to make a relevant difference, due to of the experimental quality of the
arrangement.