There are many consoles that can use modification of the center section... SSL's and Neve's included... so I wouldn't let that creep you out to much.
The used Neotek isn't a bad way to go so long as its a Neotek "Elite", which at least has a decent frame. You can reinforce the frame on a "Series IIIc" which is also a great sounding desk, but if you don't it can be intermittent [like leaning on it could turn off a channel]... same with the good sounding Ameks [like the 2500 series... forget the "dead guy" consoles].
The ATB is pretty solid desk and Toft showed their latest version of the 80 Series at AES this year. While I haven't had a chance to play with the new version of the 80 Series, I've known Malcolm for 15 or so years and know he is seriously committed to quality.
In my old room we had a Yamaha PM-2000 which is an old sound reinforcement desk that has GREAT headroom through out... yet we still felt compelled to modify the thing by adding a "2 Mix Summing Buss" that used Forssell 993 op-amps [which are like Hardy 990c's as they run on
deda wrote on Mon, 02 November 2009 12:11 | Why the need for a summing mixer?
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FX returns, things like that. I've found [at least in my work] that it is rather difficult to get a full 24 track song mixed with 32 faders... I've found I usually need more like 48-50 inputs. I use quite a few effects, usually a bunch of delays, couple of different reverbs and very often a fair bit of parallel compression which I bring up on separate faders [or on the summing mixer] and blend them to taste [often I will do the "blend" (level of the effect in relationship to the original sound) from the output knob on the device used for parallel compression]
Peace.
Fletcher wrote on Mon, 02 November 2009 08:59 | There are many consoles that can use modification of the center section... SSL's and Neve's included... so I wouldn't let that creep you out to much.
The used Neotek isn't a bad way to go so long as its a Neotek "Elite", which at least has a decent frame. You can reinforce the frame on a "Series IIIc" which is also a great sounding desk, but if you don't it can be intermittent [like leaning on it could turn off a channel]... same with the good sounding Ameks [like the 2500 series... forget the "dead guy" consoles].
The ATB is pretty solid desk and Toft showed their latest version of the 80 Series at AES this year. While I haven't had a chance to play with the new version of the 80 Series, I've known Malcolm for 15 or so years and know he is seriously committed to quality.
In my old room we had a Yamaha PM-2000 which is an old sound reinforcement desk that has GREAT headroom through out... yet we still felt compelled to modify the thing by adding a "2 Mix Summing Buss" that used Forssell 993 op-amps [which are like Hardy 990c's as they run on
Are you sure about that? I have a friend who was looking for like 3 systems [120-140 faders] and mentioned that he had to try to find them used [I don't believe it was a "budget" issue, but I could be wrong].
Here you go . . . http://www.martinsound.com/pd_fly.htm
They call me about every 30 days to see if I want to upgrade to the new system.
Deda,
It does not say where you are located - So I can not suggest where--- However- Marcel Steered you right - A Neotek is what you need imo-
You can get a smaller NEW one and rock a summing mixer- Or find a Used Elan- Not sure why Fletcher did not mention the Elan as it is perfect- Do your homework though as some of the frames are bad-- Early 90's Elans have Metal frames though.. Some of the consoles had Switch problems but that was from an earlier era..
Elites are great but I would prefer a newer Elan to an older Elite..
http://www.gearslutz.com/board/attachments/so-much-gear-so-l ittle-time/14014d1136304202-my-new-neotek-elan-here-stormklo udstudios_pics_0-edited.jpg It should look like this one-(Older ones are Grey newer ones are razor pimp BLACK)
I would prefer it to an Amek.
If you want to go new here is your axe:
http://www.sytek-audio-systems.com/products/consoles/elan2-t t/
Good Luck!
j
Thanks so much for these links they are so much help. I'll be spending the day checking out all I can find on your recommendations.
My location has been a problem for the last year of looking. I'm from 100 west of Dallas/Ft.Worth Texas. This location is about 300 miles south of the dead center of the country. This has caused shipping/frieght issues because I want to pick up and hopefully audition any board.
From where I am in the center of the country and over the last year it seems all consoles are in Miami or Bangor Maine or Vancouver or San Diego. All of which are 2,000 plus miles, ONE WAY. This has caused me to pass on some good candidates.
Thanks again to all, regards ,,deda,,
,,deda,, Tim Porter wrote on Tue, 03 November 2009 13:56 | This location is about 300 miles south of the dead center of the country.
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Now that is a very interesting twist on being from the middle of nowhere!!!
Here Deda-
http://www.sugarhillstudios.com/home.html
or you could find one in Dallas I am guessing there is one- People are generally awesome about letting others check out their boards--
Good Luck!
j
Fletcher wrote on Tue, 03 November 2009 14:58 |
,,deda,, Tim Porter wrote on Tue, 03 November 2009 13:56 | This location is about 300 miles south of the dead center of the country.
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Now that is a very interesting twist on being from the middle of nowhere!!!
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LaCrosse, Kansas - the affore mentioned center
edit
Good post Deda and fantastic input on an interesting problem.
My situation is similar to Deda's, I'm on a RADAR 24 Nyquist OTB but I do completely mobile recording. My setup fits in a trailer on my F350/truck-camper and I go to the acts and interesting venues to record.
Since I originally started out just tracking bands, I picked up an A&H ZED-428 28 input board to mainly do rough and cue mixes on. Now, my ears are not golden by any means but I find this relatively cheap board able to make some decent mixes because I am paying attention to getting the source sounds to be right before recording them. I think that extra effort makes mixing much easier. Right now, I'm very limited on my FX returns but it's something I'm able to live with since my track counts are relatively low.
I thought seriously about upgrading to a decent really good sounding board that is portable and the only thing that I think fits this bill is the Toft ATB32. I was scared away by the stories of poor build quality in the first series thinking that it would never hold up in a flight case in a trailer going down some gravel roads. I'm wondering if they've improved the build quality at all with subsequent models.
If I'm missing some options here other than the Toft, please speak up! And thanks for reading.
Keith
Keith, have you thought about building the system into the trailer rather than just hauling it around? ...then you could get a desk that doesn't need to be in a road case all the time.
Just a thought... not necessarily a good one.
Peace.
Thanks Fletcher, that idea has crossed my mind but my style is to work with the musicians in the same room.
Thanks, Keith
Why? You can't use monitors then and headphones aren't my idea of ideal monitoring . . .
Of course you can use monitors when you're working in the same room as the "talent". Its harder to make critical listening decisions, but it can certainly be done. You can get a good idea of mic selection and placement but I've always been loathe to go anywhere near an equalizer in those situations.
Peace.
http://www.remoteaudio.com/high_noise_headset/
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