Post by: mcsnare on December 05, 2006, 09:05:29 PM
Dave
Post by: Jerry Tubb on December 06, 2006, 02:38:43 PM
I've enjoyed our NSEQ-2 (the sexy black mastering version) for about 5 years...
~ a little history ~
I remember the first day I used it on a session, I was so proud that I left it out of the rack, prominently displayed on a pedestal of sorts, for all the honest world to see. The client (a Christian Rap producer) was very impressed by the visual bling factor, glossy black enamel, all those detented knobs, and a beautiful array of lights... he said "WOW, look at that!", like it was some kind of ultra hip sports car, or a control device from a top secret black manta aircraft kept at area 51.
The sound was different than anything I had heard, especially the top end at 16k or 21k bell or shelf... a ~ pristine ~ quality that got the attention of some well known MEs including the late great Denny Purcell. I've added exactly that half dB of 21k to many CDs over the past few years.
The predominantly striking thing about the sound of the NSEQ-2 was it's ~ transparency ~, not much color at all.
Not exactly sure why, but using the unit over time, I had developed certain habits, mostly for corrective EQ-ing...
LF shelf was good for reducing some subsonics, esp -1dB below 20-50 Hz, tighten up the low end.
LF parametric band good for boost/cut some 50 or 60 Hz, or 100-120 Hz, cut some mud around 160 to 220 Hz.
HF parametric band good for cutting sibilance at 7 or 8kHz, edginess at 3kHz, or cloudiness down at 250 Hz.
Boosting or cutting a half dB or so, many times on narrow Q's, and of course adding a bit top end at 16k or 21k bell or shelf.
Sometimes I'd use it in a totally different way, depending on the program material, but that's roughly it...
I was happily entrenched in well worn ruts with the NSEQ-2, and could find usable settings almost instantly.
But... with digital audio sometimes a little musical color can be nice to warm things up... couldn't really find a a good "warm" setting on the unit (except for the tube side, which was usually too much), so I'd use another EQ later in the chain for contour, shaping, and color... the GML 8200, and eventually the Sontec 432.
So when you first mentioned Fred's new mod board a few months back, I got ~ very ~ interested, basically a marked man, just living for the moment to get my grubby little hands on it : - )
~ Moving on to the NSEQ-F ~ (I think Fred likes that name)
About a month ago we installed the new board, carefully following Fred's detailed instructions.
First impression was WHOA! this is totally different, but in a great way !!!
Silky highs, punchy lows, big warmth, precise control, sounds great with wide or narrow Qs, giant boosts or deep cuts, all good, hard to find a bad setting, easy to find a good setting... much like a big dog Sontec, with a unique musical character all it's own.
No harshness, mudiness, or cloudiness... it sounds so good, it's tempting to over-use it on everything!
Set the "TT" switches out to Balanced, yoohoo! no more 6dB level loss!
Set the Range to 6dB, so each click of the knob yields about 1/4 dB of boost or cut, talk about your fine tuning!
Highly recommended, a greaaat sounding mastering EQ, for an amazingly affordable price !!!
Here's a link to the upgrade info: http://www.forsselltech.com/EQ%20Upgrade%20PCB.htm
I shot some tones thru it and mapped the freqs of the parametric bands, will post later.
My Impression after a month of daily use... A Complete 10.
Cheers - Jay Tea
Post by: carlsaff on December 06, 2006, 02:44:48 PM
Post by: Gravity 8058 on December 06, 2006, 08:14:22 PM
How long did it take you guys to install?
Post by: Jerry Tubb on December 06, 2006, 10:15:10 PM
| Gravity 8058 wrote on Wed, 06 December 2006 19:14 |
How long did it take you guys to install? |
Hey Doug,
It was a fairly easy job, took us about an hour and a half, just because we were being careful about static, and a few precise soldering points.
Austin audio guru Chet Himes actually did the soldering, Nick Landis helped, and I "supervised".
JT
Post by: jfrigo on December 09, 2006, 12:01:56 AM
| carlsaff wrote on Wed, 06 December 2006 14:44 |
I'm trying desperately to wait and save up for Fred's new design. My hope is that it will be everything the modified NSEQ-2 is and more. But the wait is tough! |
Tell me about it. I've been going on about this for years. Lucky he hasn't sent hit men to silence me...
Can't wait!Post by: FredForssell on December 09, 2006, 04:43:33 PM
| Quote: |
Lucky he hasn't sent hit men to silence me... |
At least as far as you know.... It's hard to find good help these days.
Post by: dave-G on December 09, 2006, 05:42:29 PM
| FredForssell wrote on Sat, 09 December 2006 16:43 | ||
At least as far as you know.... It's hard to find good help these days. |
My NSEQ-2 should have arrived yesterday for its procedures, Fred.
If you give me a break on the price, I'll take care of Frigoletto for you.
Do you want it should be quick and painless, or do you want to "send a message" ?
-dave
Post by: jfrigo on December 10, 2006, 02:57:42 AM
| FredForssell wrote on Sat, 09 December 2006 16:43 | ||
At least as far as you know.... It's hard to find good help these days. |
I know a guy, who knows a guy...
Hey, wait a minute, you're talking about me!
| dave-G wrote on Sat, 09 December 2006 17:42 |
My NSEQ-2 should have arrived yesterday for its procedures, Fred. If you give me a break on the price, I'll take care of Frigoletto for you. Do you want it should be quick and painless, or do you want to "send a message" ? -dave |
As someone of 100% Italian descent, I find that comment offensive...
Of course it should always be to "send a message!" Geez, don't you watch the Sopranos? You're gonna give goons a bad name. (D'OH!)
Hell, if he gives me a break on the mastering EQ when it's done, I'll break my own leg.
Post by: Adam Dempsey on December 11, 2006, 08:18:12 AM
| mcsnare wrote on Wed, 06 December 2006 13:05 |
Hey Jay Tee, and Tony, how are you guys liking the FF board for the NSEQ? I saw a comment by JT on Fossie's board, care to add anything since you've had a little more time to use it? I'm still lovin' mine. Now if I could just get a decent power cord for it.... Dave |
I can't speak for Tony other than I know he's lovin' it. I'm still sinking my ears into it and with less experience in having used the stock version I can't honestly say how it compares. It's very clean and I love its precision, although not yet used to matching sweepable freqs on bands 2 & 3. Used on last project for a little air and a subtle low shelf cut but then feeding the Massive Passive for its low end tightening. Horses for courses (but let me say I'm very fortunate to have the options!)
Post by: dave-G on December 22, 2006, 06:24:56 AM
Got my "NSEQ-F" back last week, and I'm really loving it.
It's been transformed from a good (if not unsexy), clean, utilitarian equalizer to something that can really make things beautiful. I won't bore you with further fruity descriptions, as there are not a lot of good words for this. However, even if this thing cost more than the combined cost of an NSEQ-2 and the upgrade, it would still be an easy choice over other equalizers I've auditioned.
Now I see why Jay is willing to sacrifice his leg for Fred's upcoming mastering EQ. I'll gladly sacrifice his other one when the time comes.
Thanks, Fred.
-dave
Post by: carlsaff on December 28, 2006, 07:36:37 AM
Hopefully this will be the ideal complement to my Massive Passive. I still want an API 5500, but those will be around for a long while, whereas this upgrade may not. Also, I'm unlikely to be able to afford Fred's "from scratch" EQ when it materializes, so... it was an easy decision.
I can't wait to hear this thing.
Post by: djwaudio on December 29, 2006, 02:41:39 AM
I went with a Prism MEA-2 recently, because of it. I'm happy with the choice, but now I'm curious with all the buzz. Previously, I never considered the NSEQ seriously because it seemed handcuffed.
Do you get in the cracks with something else, or does it somehow always work out?
Post by: Patrik T on December 29, 2006, 04:09:45 AM
| djwaudio wrote on Fri, 29 December 2006 07:41 |
Do you guys using the NSEQ find the limited frequency range of the low (20 - 270 Hz) and high bands (4.8kHz - 21kHz), in six steps a problem? |
Limitations are good! I recently carried out a small mastering work (7 tunes, 55 minutes) for an electronica duet using only and exclusivey the following avaliable filters in a Neve-ish outboard box.
HP: 50Hz, 80Hz, 160Hz and 300Hz
Low Shelf: 35Hz, 60Hz, 110Hz and 220Hz
Mid Bell, no adjustable q: 350Hz, 700Hz, 1kHz, 1.6kHz, 2.4kHz, 3.2kHz, 3.9kHz, 4.8kHz, 7.2kHz, 10kHz
High Shelf: 8kHz, 10kHz, 12kHz, 16kHz
Apart from this eq, the only other processing was TPDF. I love limitations. They encourage flexibility and innovative thinking. Classical values. Clients very, very happy. Joy all over the place.
The NSEQ might be a piece of gear that wants people to sweat it. Very nice indeed if that is the case. Limitations are beautiful by their nature.
Best Regards
Patrik
Post by: Jerry Tubb on December 29, 2006, 10:38:22 AM
| djwaudio wrote on Fri, 29 December 2006 01:41 |
Do you guys using the NSEQ find the limited frequency range of the low (20 - 270 Hz) and high bands (4.8kHz - 21kHz), in six steps a problem? |
Hi Dana,
I suppose if the NSEQ were your only EQ, the limited freq selection could be a problem on challenging material that required lots of EQ correction.
I generally use it in tandem with another EQ, such as the Sontec or Z-Sys.
90% of the time, I use 21k or 16k on the top band, either shelf or bell, and possibly a little roll-off below 20Hz on the low band.
More choices, such as 12.5k or 14k on the top, and 80Hz on the low band would be nice. I think Fred is planning more flexibility on his future mastering EQ.
The NSEQ-F sounds fantastic despite any band & freq limitations.
The Prism MEA-2 is obviously a great professional choice.
The two are really different animals.
JT
Post by: mcsnare on December 29, 2006, 08:47:06 PM
Dave
Post by: carlsaff on February 18, 2007, 09:15:33 AM
I agree with pretty much everything Jerry and Dave have already said. Definitely will be my go-to EQ for work in the extreme frequencies. Incredible high shelving. I still prefer the Massive Passive in the mids a lot of the time.
Also, having never used an NSEQ before this weekend, I have decided I don't really like the way the NSEQ is laid out. The fiddly little frequency and Q knobs bug me, and I have a hard time seeing quickly where the everything is set at a glance. Im sure I'll get used to it, but at the same time, if Fred's from-scratch EQ is laid out more ergonomically than the NSEQ (please -- labeled, clickable frequncies, Fred!), I'll be very tempted to swap this EQ for that one.
But you can't beat the sound. Really incredible.
Post by: Jerry Tubb on February 18, 2007, 10:54:44 AM
As to the ergonomics, you get used to it... basically you memorize the freqs.
I used a whiite editall pencil to mark the knobs for easier reading. I think BK used white paint on his. We'll see what Dave sez as well.
I shot pink noise and tones thru the unit to an analyzer, made a chart as to what click is which frequency, although I really set it by ear, it's still nice to have the chart around.
If you like I'll post my chart, but I think it's better to do it yourself as an exploratory mission of sorts, getting to know the EQ.
Enjoy - JT
Post by: mcsnare on February 18, 2007, 12:27:35 PM
Dave
p.s. J.T. I wouldn't mind seeing what you came up with for what the freq knobs REALLY do...
Post by: dave-G on February 18, 2007, 05:21:27 PM
| mcsnare wrote on Sun, 18 February 2007 12:27 |
I realized a long time ago, the markings on the freq knobs don't seem to have much to do with what I hear. If you can get over the psychological hurdle and just use your ears, I think you'll find more usable options in the mids. |
| carlsaff wrote on Sun, 18 February 2007 09:15 |
having never used an NSEQ before this weekend, I have decided I don't really like the way the NSEQ is laid out. The fiddly little frequency and Q knobs bug me, and I have a hard time seeing quickly where the everything is set at a glance. |
| Jerry Tubb wrote on Sun, 18 February 2007 10:54 |
I used a whiite editall pencil to mark the knobs for easier reading. I think BK used white paint on his. We'll see what Dave sez as well. |
Well, speaking as a Dave, I don't really look at the knobs to see where they're set until I'm done turning them, or zeroing afterwards. So .. is the implication here that the new board's actual frequencies don't match what's legended on the faceplate? I'll have to check that out. Or is it just a the same gripe that there are so few of them specifically marked (and a bunch of numberless lines) in the mid-bands?
Regarding "at a glance" looks -- are you talking about the 'where-are-they-pointing'-ness of the knobs? Or is it again, the small number of frequencies actually labeled on the faceplate? Correlation of clicks to lines??
If it's just the knobs themselves, I remember seeing someone who changed out the round, knobs on the black one for the tapered ones that ship on the platinum one. I saved their picture of it (can't remember whose it was) .. but ... Maybe do that if you like the look?
Meanwhile, I'm still loving the sound of this thing.
-dave
Post by: FredForssell on February 18, 2007, 05:42:27 PM
| Quote: |
So .. is the implication here that the new board's actual frequencies don't match what's legended on the faceplate? |
No. The mod main board has no effect on the filter boards at all. They are what they are and remain so after the mod main board is installed.
I designed the circuitry in the NSEQ-2 intending it to be a tracking or recording EQ, NOT a mastering EQ. The mod main board moves a NSEQ-2 a step closer to what I consider to be a mastering eq. It does this by allowing one to select lower max boost/cut gains (reducing the step size in the boost/cut controls), by vastly improving the sonic quality of the NSEQ-2 (IMO,YMMV), and adding other features important to most MEs. That's about all it does.
The Mastering EQ I am working on now is designed soley with MEs in mind, but it is still a long ways off (sorry guys).
Cheers,
Post by: carlsaff on February 18, 2007, 07:25:10 PM
JT -- LOVE to see that chart.
mcsnare -- I don't *always* prefer the MP in the mids... but I'm very used to how they sound, and still want that sound a lot of the time. I have a long, long way to go towards really knowing this EQ. These are just my (generally very positive) first impressions.
dave-G -- "At a glance" meaning... are the two sides set the same? And "how do I log this exactly?"
Post by: Jerry Tubb on February 18, 2007, 08:14:10 PM
| carlsaff wrote on Sun, 18 February 2007 18:25 |
JT -- LOVE to see that chart. |
I'll post it late tonight when go by the studio, it basically maps the two parametric bands, both at regular and the x10 settings.
Agreed, the marks are good for logging your settings for recall.
The mids really do sound fabulous on the unit.
Often I use the HF bell rather than the shelf.
Fred - I found your comments interesting WRT the filter section remaining the same.
My old "chart" (before the mod) and the new chart (after the mod) showed slightly different centers,
but it may have been pilot error!
Cheers - JT
Post by: mcsnare on February 18, 2007, 09:25:44 PM
Dave
Post by: jdg on February 18, 2007, 10:54:52 PM
/goes to hunt on evilbay
Post by: Jerry Tubb on February 19, 2007, 12:49:04 AM
| mcsnare wrote on Sun, 18 February 2007 11:27 |
J.T. I wouldn't mind seeing what you came up with for what the freq knobs REALLY do... |
As requested:
Please feel free to double check my results, the hardest ranges to accurately check on my analyzer are the sub-lows and ultra highs.
JT
Post by: Jerry Tubb on February 19, 2007, 01:39:10 AM
| mcsnare wrote on Sun, 18 February 2007 20:25 |
J.T., since you got the 432, I'm curious as to how your use of the NSEQ might have changed. How would you use it in conjunction with the 432, if at all? Dave |
Interesting question Dave.
Wish I had some cool esoteric answer, but no, it's mainly a matter of function & utility, but with high quality.
After getting the NSEQ-2F mod I like the overall sonic quality much better now, especially usable in the mids, and the highs are smoother.
Would be totally happy using either one of the EQs (Sontec 432 or NSEQ-2F) alone, as long as I had some sort of precise "corrective" EQ in front to address problem areas that you can't quite get to with either of these analog EQs... for deep notches, HPF, etc... any of that surgical stuff. For that task I use a Z-Systems digital EQ, or even a TDM plug-in (gasp!) if needed.
My particular Sontec 432C is limited to 1dB steps, and the High shelf is fixed at 10k. So a quarter & half dB boost/cut on the NSEQ-F comes in handy. The 432 works great for broad brush strokes, contour, color, etc... like +1dB at 16k, 420Hz, 70Hz. If I need just a half dB cut at 2.8k, 8k, 220Hz or whatever I'll reach for the NSEQ.
In tandem they offer analog color galore... some tandem examples:
HF... boost 16k on the Sontec, but cut a little at 8k on the NSEQ to control the hi-hat brightness, in lieu of using a de-esser.
LF... cut 1dB 50Hz Lo-shelf on the Sontec, but cut a little more at 20Hz on the NSEQ to reduce more subsonic rumble.
Mids... boost 420Hz or 340Hz (wide Q) on the Sontec for vocal warmth, but cut 165Hz on the NSEQ to keep the bass strings on the acoustic guitar from getting boomy, and cut a little 650Hz to reduce any vocal honk.
Sometimes leave the 432 set to "flat" (but in the chain), & use the NSEQ for the EQ work. Just depends on the situation & following my gut instincts.
With the three EQs (432, NSEQ-F, Z-Sys) there's virtually no EQ problem you can't get at one way or another. Of course a real man shouldn't need more than one EQ, one compressor, one limiter ...at times I'll take that approach to see how much can be done with the Sontec -or- NSEQ alone.
Sometimes less is more, but sometimes more is more : - )
You know how it is out here in Indie-land, a lot of the mixes we get are less than perfect, so having an arsenal of EQs within easy reach can be handy.
Oops, I think I hear the Long-Rambling-Post alarm going off, so I'm signing off for now.
Cheers - JT
Post by: carlsaff on February 19, 2007, 08:20:02 AM
And I agree -- I can easily get it done with very few tools, and prefer to when possible. I'm wondering if I'll buy another analog EQ unless it's something REALLY special. Truth be told, I felt like I could've gotten by on solid plugin EQ in conjunction with the Massive Passive indefinitely... but the NSEQ-F definitely brings some nice flavors to the table. A luxury to have it next to the MP, really.
Post by: Sonovo on November 13, 2008, 04:09:47 PM
I just fired up my Forssellified NSEQ-2/F.
Actually, this is the second Forssellization I've made on the unit. A few years back I had all the original op-amps swapped out with some custom jobbies Fred had designed, and really liked the results. Better bass, more open high end, more focused overall. It also seemed more precise after the op-amp swap. I've been living with it that way for around 3 years, and found myself using the valve (tube) side less and less. On some projects it's exactly what is needed, but it seems those projects are appearing more and more seldom. So I think today I could figure out another way to deal with those particular mixes, should one show up tomorrow.
Anyway, after all my whining the last year about getting a Sontec and the recent world economic crash (with resultant exchange rate going through the roof), together with Brad and others' comments that there are viable alternatives at a friendlier price point, mixed with all the fantastic reviews it's gotten from people with ears I trust (mostly
) here and on the Gearslutzs forum, I figured why not. It's a better EQ than the NSEQ is stock, the valve side I can learn to live without, and if it improves things as much as simply swapping out a few op-amps does, well, there's my instant upgrade.Improves things it certainly does! Wow, again I've got a new EQ. Guess I'll have to throw out all those old recall sheets, 'cause this is a different EQ than what I was using a few days ago...
From my short session trying it out this morning, it seems to be even more precise and focused than before. Especially in the bass. The 180Hz setting is actually usable now, before I usually ended up using the Weiss if I needed a nudge there. It's still clean, but really seems to grab on to the audio in a positive manner, and adjust the sound without adding artifacts. It's not pristine, but nor is it ballsy. I had a bit of a Sontec moment when I cranked several frequencies to the max and swept around - no harshness, no breaking up, just added signal where it was dialed in. It might have been my imagination, but I felt that the unit had a bit more weight and solidity (esp when working in the bass frequencies) when run balanced (i.e. 2 op-amps per channel) as compared to unbalanced (1 op-amp per channel), where it seemed a bit more 'transparent' and open. The air is still there, and it's better than before (less texture, more sky ).
So far I'm really liking it. The first mod with new op-amps was an improvement over the stock unit, but still recognizable as an NSEQ-2. I'm not sure about things now with the new mainboard. It's not a completely different beast, but it's not really an NSEQ either, rather improved in all aspects to such a degree that it's kind of it's own thing.
Highly recommended!!
Now, what am I gonna do for a Sontec....
Any recommendations for an 'attitude' EQ? I think I've got 'neutral' covered.
Cheers,
Thor
Post by: jdg on November 13, 2008, 04:16:37 PM
Post by: Sonovo on November 13, 2008, 04:24:15 PM
Thor
| jdg wrote on Thu, 13 November 2008 19:16 |
mine new -F board is coming tomorrow! |
Post by: Jerry Tubb on November 14, 2008, 01:12:07 AM
| Sonovo wrote on Thu, 13 November 2008 15:09 |
I just fired up my Forssellified NSEQ-2/F. |
Congrats Thor !
The NSEQ-2FF is one fine sounding Equalizer, a real pleasure to use everyday.
JT
Post by: Alécio Costa - Brazil on November 14, 2008, 10:09:45 PM
Do you have a price quote for your new product?
Will it be similar to the Ibis EQ price?
I ask this because I am waiting for the dollar to calm down and pick a NSEQ2 to marry my Ibis EQ.
Also, will this product be sold on stores or only directly with you?
I can wait until next year.
A guy very far from your door,
Thanks
Post by: Sonovo on November 28, 2008, 02:58:59 PM
Post by: Alécio Costa - Brazil on November 29, 2008, 12:17:17 AM
Fica em Florian
Post by: 24-96 Mastering on June 10, 2010, 04:10:35 PM
| dave-G wrote on Sun, 18 February 2007 23:21 |
If it's just the knobs themselves, I remember seeing someone who changed out the round, knobs on the black one for the tapered ones that ship on the platinum one. I saved their picture of it (can't remember whose it was) .. but ... Maybe do that if you like the look? Meanwhile, I'm still loving the sound of this thing. -dave |
Has anyone here done the above (exchange knobs from the round to the pointy ones)? Was it an improvement in usability?
To solve the problem of 'having to count the clicks' whenever channel matching / noting down / recalling boosts&cuts, I made some markings on the big knobs themselves. Worked a treat, though I'm considering having those stickers printed so they don't look as improvised.
Post by: dave-G on June 10, 2010, 05:24:52 PM
Hm .. maybe apropos to my thoughts on the subject that "manchinist" looks a little like "masochist" when typed.
For the meantime, I'm still counting clicks. The thing does lack in mastering ergonomics, but it certainly sounds good.
-dave
Post by: hnewman on June 10, 2010, 06:39:36 PM
Post by: 24-96 Mastering on June 10, 2010, 06:47:37 PM
| hnewman wrote on Fri, 11 June 2010 00:39 |
I had someone make new knobs for mine, they work great but were a little pricey. He'd be willing to do more I think. |
I'd be very interested to see them. Can you post a photo?
Post by: dave-G on June 10, 2010, 10:25:04 PM
| hnewman wrote on Thu, 10 June 2010 18:39 |
I had someone make new knobs for mine, they work great but were a little pricey. He'd be willing to do more I think. |
Pics, or it didn't happen.
(heh)
-dave
Post by: hnewman on June 10, 2010, 11:29:09 PM
Post by: Roland Storch on June 11, 2010, 03:50:05 AM
www.adebar-acoustics.de
Post by: 24-96 Mastering on June 11, 2010, 06:19:27 PM
| Roland Storch wrote on Fri, 11 June 2010 09:50 |
We plan to have a modified NSEQ-II with the NSEQ-F board as demo unit in germany. So you have the chance to compare the modified version to your original NSEQ-II. www.adebar-acoustics.de |
In case that's directed towards me, I'm afraid mine is an NSEQ-F. I just bought it second hand already modified. A demo unit would still be a good idea though, the sound of the unit will definitely make some sales...
Post by: hnewman on June 14, 2010, 11:29:20 PM
I think this is on the verge of turning into a "for sale" post, I need a couple more days to decide for sure. If you fall in love, let me know...
Post by: zmix on June 22, 2010, 10:41:55 AM
| hnewman wrote on Mon, 14 June 2010 23:29 |
Here are the custom knobs. They are machined aluminum. I originally asked my friend to just modify the existing ones, but he was pretty sure they were going to get trashed in the process so he just made new set. I think this is on the verge of turning into a "for sale" post, I need a couple more days to decide for sure. If you fall in love, let me know... |
Post by: Bonati on June 22, 2010, 08:28:33 PM
Post by: hnewman on June 22, 2010, 09:24:25 PM
Post by: TotalSonic on June 22, 2010, 10:12:31 PM
| Bonati wrote on Tue, 22 June 2010 20:28 |
Are those stock NSEQ knobs really that bad? I don't own one but I have the HV-3D mic preamp and they're the same knobs. Pretty nice, I think. There are far worse offenders. How come no one has made any nice black anodized aluminum front panels for the Dangerous Music stuff? Or am I volunteering? |
Got to say when I checked out Dave McNair's NSEQ-F over at his old digs at Masterdisk I was seriously impressed by the sound - but looking at the ergonomics in terms of recalls - my immediate impression is that with those tiny fiddly knobs for Q and Freq - let alone the click counting with the gains - that I'd get pissed off at that thing p.d.q. (and I certainly put up with truly mediocre recallability on my MEP250EX & Medici - but at least the stock knobs on these let you read what you're setting things at!).
I definitely like the replacement knobs for the "Greymarket" version - very "diesel"!
Best regards,
Steve Berson
Post by: mcsnare on June 23, 2010, 09:24:04 AM
You should try and find the time to come by.
I have better knobs now.
Dave
Post by: dave-G on June 23, 2010, 12:55:16 PM
| mcsnare wrote on Wed, 23 June 2010 09:24 |
Steve, You should try and find the time to come by. I have better knobs now. Dave |
I hate to say it twice in the same thread, but ...
"Pics, or it didn't happen"
This EQ is definitely a sound/ergonomics love/loathe box. I'd love to see what you've done.
-dave
Post by: TotalSonic on June 23, 2010, 01:52:14 PM
| mcsnare wrote on Wed, 23 June 2010 09:24 |
Steve, You should try and find the time to come by. I have better knobs now. Dave |
Dave -
Thanks for the invite!
I definitely want to stop by soon and check out your new digs hear the Revels as well! So - are the plans to put your NSEQ-F's guts into a new chassis with all controls on switches on hold for now?
Best regards,
Steve Berson
Post by: jdg on June 23, 2010, 02:07:59 PM
| mcsnare wrote on Wed, 23 June 2010 06:24 |
Steve, You should try and find the time to come by. I have better knobs now. Dave |
did you just re-knob it, or finally re-box it?
Post by: mcsnare on June 23, 2010, 05:20:07 PM
I went back to N802's as well. I still really like the Revels but somehow they just didn't work in this room as well as the B&W's. The bass impact of the 802's is more of what I need to hear. Go figure.
Dave
Post by: TotalSonic on June 23, 2010, 05:38:55 PM
| mcsnare wrote on Wed, 23 June 2010 17:20 |
No plans to do anything new to the NSEQ. One of the techs here Phillip Sztenderowicz, bestowed me with a 430B that takes that classic circuit farther than I think anyone else has gone. It still has the Sontec sound but his tweaks make it quite a bit cleaner. Think warm but no softness. I use the Forssell now only occasionally for one more band and such. I went back to N802's as well. I still really like the Revels but somehow they just didn't work in this room as well as the B&W's. The bass impact of the 802's is more of what I need to hear. Go figure. Dave |
Dave -
No recall problems with the 430B! (although it would be nice to have more hi-shelf freq points than it comes with stock - is there a mod for this on yours?).
Interesting that you went back to the B&W's after all your time with the Duntechs and then the Revels - guess I need to stop by Alan Silverman's to hear them then.
Are you running a sub with the N802's or sub-less like I am?
Best regards,
Steve Berson
Post by: mcsnare on June 23, 2010, 05:55:16 PM
Dave
Post by: tom eaton on June 26, 2010, 02:13:13 PM
Post by: Matt_G on June 28, 2010, 10:49:12 PM
| mcsnare wrote on Thu, 24 June 2010 07:20 |
No plans to do anything new to the NSEQ. One of the techs here Phillip Sztenderowicz, bestowed me with a 430B that takes that classic circuit farther than I think anyone else has gone. It still has the Sontec sound but his tweaks make it quite a bit cleaner. Think warm but no softness. |
Hey Dave, I'd be interested to know what sort of mods Phillip did to your 430B? I've heard that the 430B was a bit 'softer' sounding than the 432C that I have. Have you compared your modified 430B to a stock 432C? be an interesting comparison... either way Sontecs rock!
| Quote: |
I use the Forssell now only occasionally for one more band and such. |
Wow I remember this was your favourite go-to EQ for so long... which high end do you usually prefer now you've got the Sontec?
| Quote: |
I went back to N802's as well. I still really like the Revels but somehow they just didn't work in this room as well as the B&W's. The bass impact of the 802's is more of what I need to hear. Go figure. Dave |
Just goes to show you have to get the 'right' speakers for the room & that may not necessarily mean the speakers with the best specs.
| TotalSonic wrote on Thu, 24 June 2010 07:38 |
No recall problems with the 430B! (although it would be nice to have more hi-shelf freq points than it comes with stock - is there a mod for this on yours?). |
Enter the 462.. which are scarce in their 'original' guise & ridiculously expensive.. or you could always go the Buzz REQ-2.2. Have you tried an REQ yet Steve?
Matt
Post by: TotalSonic on June 28, 2010, 11:11:21 PM
| Matt_G wrote on Mon, 28 June 2010 22:49 |
you could always go the Buzz REQ-2.2. Have you tried an REQ yet Steve? |
Nope. I do really want to get to Ed Littman's to hear it sometime though. Based on folks reports of it I'm sure it sounds excellent.
Anyway - I'm really trying not to do any processor shopping at this point. Between my Medici, MEP250EX, SPL SX2 (all of which have gotten modded to make them more to my satisfaction) - plus my API 5500 and Sonoris EQ's as well - there's not anything I really feel I can't get done eq wise (including having lots of high shelf choices already) - although the recalls/side matches are indeed on the mediocre side (you can get close but not exact) with both the Medici and the MEP250EX. Ultimately it would be nice to get the ergonomics happening a little more as well - and if there was an improvement in sound over what I'm using now then that'd be a big bonus.
The next upgrade here will probably be an ADC - but I'm kind of not getting really giddy from the idea of spending more cash on studio gear right now the way I was a few years ago when I was first outfitting my place.
Best regards,
Steve Berson
Post by: Ed Littman on June 29, 2010, 08:26:18 AM
| TotalSonic wrote on Mon, 28 June 2010 23:11 | ||
Nope. I do really want to get to Ed Littman's to hear it sometime though. Based on folks reports of it I'm sure it sounds excellent. Best regards, Steve Berson |
It sure does & your welcome to come by any time. Let me know when your going to Daves I'd like to go heckle him with you.
Ed
Post by: mcsnare on June 29, 2010, 09:58:21 AM
| Matt_G wrote on Mon, 28 June 2010 22:49 | ||||||||
Hey Dave, I'd be interested to know what sort of mods Phillip did to your 430B? I've heard that the 430B was a bit 'softer' sounding than the 432C that I have. Have you compared your modified 430B to a stock 432C? be an interesting comparison... either way Sontecs rock!
Wow I remember this was your favourite go-to EQ for so long... which high end do you usually prefer now you've got the Sontec?
Just goes to show you have to get the 'right' speakers for the room & that may not necessarily mean the speakers with the best specs.
Enter the 462.. which are scarce in their 'original' guise & ridiculously expensive.. or you could always go the Buzz REQ-2.2. Have you tried an REQ yet Steve? Matt |
All the rooms at Sterling have 430B's, so I think that makes about 8 or 9 in total. I assume the old timers prefer the sound of the 430B versus the 432C. I've used both but not side by side. The 430B sounds even less like an 'eq' than the 432C. It completely melds with the music and never sounds like it is 'sitting on top' of the music.
In 2010 any stock 430B that you'd come across is not going to sound like a new one so it's hard to make an evaluation of a 35+ year old piece of gear. The 430B I used at Masterdisk was tired and soft sounding but I think it was more age and spec of components than the basic design.
Because it is the primary eq for most of the engineers' at Sterling, the tech dept. has made a serious commitment to the box. I can't tell you all the things that Phil has done but it's pretty extensive and is not just a few component swaps here and there. He is still tweaking it and I'm sure will be something that evolves according to what the different guys want to hear.
On most projects, I use the 430 and API's together. As I said, the NSEQ just occasionally for another band. The sound of the 10K shelf on this Sontec is unbelievable! More shelf freqs would be nice but I use the Algo Blue a lot for that. The thing that I liked about the NSEQ over most Sontecs was the transparency, but now with the 430B I have now, it's easily as transparent as the NSEQ and with the Sontec curves to boot!
The 462 I used in Scott Hull's room is indeed a very nice sounding unit. Only bummer is no sum and difference options.
Dave
Post by: Ben F on June 29, 2010, 10:35:37 PM
| mcsnare wrote on Tue, 29 June 2010 23:28 |
On most projects, I use the 430 and API's together. As I said, the NSEQ just occasionally for another band. The sound of the 10K shelf on this Sontec is unbelievable! More shelf freqs would be nice but I use the Algo Blue a lot for that. The thing that I liked about the NSEQ over most Sontecs was the transparency, but now with the 430B I have now, it's easily as transparent as the NSEQ and with the Sontec curves to boot! The 462 I used in Scott Hull's room is indeed a very nice sounding unit. Only bummer is no sum and difference options. Dave |
Hi Dave, we have a re-issue 432 and had 7.5 and 12kHz shelves fitted with a switch, next to the 50/100Hz switch. I used to really like the low end on the API, especially the 200Hz shelf!
Post by: zmix on July 02, 2010, 09:03:00 AM
| mcsnare wrote on Wed, 23 June 2010 17:20 |
...I went back to N802's as well. I still really like the Revels but somehow they just didn't work in this room as well as the B&W's. The bass impact of the 802's is more of what I need to hear. Go figure. Dave |
Now that's news, Dave. We should have a beer soon and discuss...!
Post by: mcsnare on July 02, 2010, 10:47:16 AM
Dave
Post by: Jerry Tubb on July 03, 2010, 11:28:33 AM
I use a simple white china marker spot on the back of the knobs near the chassis to give me a visual.
It's a such great EQ, coupled with my Sontec, and occasional surgical tweak from my Z-Sys the job gets done nicely.
JT
| tom eaton wrote on Sat, 26 June 2010 13:13 |
I posted this somewhere around here last year... just a straight scribe on the stock NSEQ knobs, done by my landlord in his machine shop. Easy job, I think. |
Post by: zmix on July 03, 2010, 12:31:07 PM
| mcsnare wrote on Fri, 02 July 2010 10:47 |
Lately with the weather so awesome, I've been walking down 8th from Penn to the studio. I always think of you when I pass your building. You should come by soon and listen. Dave |