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R/E/P => R/E/P Archives => Fletcher => Topic started by: onekid on April 22, 2004, 10:48:49 PM

Title: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: onekid on April 22, 2004, 10:48:49 PM

What current mics would you use to record standup bass in a jazz situation?

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Fletcher on April 23, 2004, 12:00:26 AM

Depends on what else is happening and what else is in the room.  I've used everything from RCA 77's to tube 47's to an EV RE-15 in the peg to a Klaus Heyne modified M-49 with an M-269c in figure 8 in and "MS" configuration.

I reckon like anything else, it's a judgement call for what is thrown at you and what you have to throw back.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Nathan Eldred on April 23, 2004, 12:23:11 AM

I'm really into my Neumann KM86's, sometimes I combine with a ribbon depending on how much bleed is appropriate for the music.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: jazzbass on April 23, 2004, 04:37:39 AM

People bash the M147 a lot as a vocal mic but I've found it often works beautifully on upright bass.


bob

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: otek on April 23, 2004, 04:52:21 AM

Like Fletcher said, depends on what else is going on in the room.

I have used DPA 4011, Brauner Valvet, AKG C414TL-II, even a Sennheiser 441. I believe the best upright tone I have gotten was with the Valvet, but then the player was extraordinary.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Jan Folkson on April 23, 2004, 02:12:20 PM

I've had great success with a 421 or an 87 for picked and a 414 or tube 47 for bowed depending on the instrument, the player, the room and what's left in the locker.

Recently I did a live date with an audio technica atm35 clip on that sounded great.  I've been meaning to try it in the studio but haven't gotten to it yet.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Fibes on April 23, 2004, 02:32:52 PM

M269c, U95 or U89 with an occasional 84 or 184 at the fret board.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: malice on April 23, 2004, 02:46:05 PM

Been lucky with m269c, U48, U47 ...

and

a CAD, can't remember the model, not the big blue one, the one just a bit cheaper  (metal and black)...

Fletcher coul find the exact ref ...


malice

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: hargerst on April 23, 2004, 02:52:40 PM

Just recorded an upright bass a couple of days ago, using the T.H.E. KP-6M omni - sounded wonderful.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: balanceman on April 23, 2004, 05:28:38 PM

every uprite I"ve ever tracked has sounded different. Every uprite player has been different. I usually start at the bridge and go from there.
U87, Lawson47, Neum tube 47. 451 on the fingers, schoeps on the fingers, km 140 on the fingers.
watch for phase shift combing finger and bridge mics.
Oh yeah km 83 taped on to the tail peice.

so fuggin' hard to get the right combo  with any sort of time efficiancy.

small rooms make it really hard to get a nice tone on such a big insturment.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: echorec on April 23, 2004, 06:08:25 PM

I have had good luck with KM84i and U47

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: atticus on April 23, 2004, 06:48:17 PM

I'm a fan of the THE KR-25A on upright bass, but then again I haven't found a lot of things that mic isn't really great for.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Carnac on April 23, 2004, 10:07:45 PM

My only standup session to date was within in a quartet (2 classical guitars, drums w/brushes in iso) doing some bossa and sambas. I partioned everyone somewhat with gobos and miced Mr. Bass with a Lawson 47MP blended with a little grit and tone of the bridge pickup during mixing. I think it worked!... even for my novice AE abilities. I have a couple of those KR-25As I've used for the classical guitbox. Never thought of using it for the bass. Must get those jazzers back in here to try it.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: mcsnare on April 24, 2004, 12:21:14 AM

If the guy has a good sounding bass, a 421 aiming at an F hole is fine. If you have a U47, that's even better. I have gotten a great sound with an AKG 451....go figure.
Dave

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Family Hoof on April 24, 2004, 04:43:15 AM

EV RE20 at the bridge/f hole hasn't been mentioned yet. Don't be afriad to get too close. I wouldn't use this for solo upright but it's pretty fool proof for ensemble recording. Better isolation than an LDC and it probably beats out a lot of them that can't hang with the U47 crowd. Just my two cents (I'm in a dynamic-loving, LDC-neglecting phase right now).

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: wireline on April 24, 2004, 09:45:01 AM

I've gotten good results with an AT4051 3ft back from the treble side F hole, and a direct feed from a Fishman transducer...blended to taste...

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Jason Phair on April 24, 2004, 06:07:51 PM

Go PRO

Stick a 57 on it.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Knastratt on April 25, 2004, 01:54:27 PM

malice wrote on Fri, 23 April 2004 20:46

Been lucky with m269c, U48, U47 ... and a CAD, can't remember the model, not the big blue one, the one just a bit cheaper  (metal and black)... Fletcher coul find the exact ref ... malice

Perhaps you're aiming at the CAD E-100 (or E-200)!

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Jan Folkson on April 25, 2004, 08:20:54 PM

Just used my Gefell UM70 on bass this afternoon.  Very nice  

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Aardvark on April 26, 2004, 11:24:44 PM

Usualy a sdc up top and a ribbon or ldc for the bottom.

Three mitigating issues.

The situation...in the room with a bluegrass band means mic choices with rejection in mind...ergo certain ribbons no go. Overdub or iso recordings are another, less tricky matter.

Next. Tone of the bass. 95% chance the instrument has massive inconsistancies with eveness..hence two (sometimes three) mics.

Final. Amount of dig vis-a-vis right hand and left. This approach to technique can make a world of difference to the tones and "bumps" in the sound of a doghouse.


Mics I use on Top (as in in my locker etc...)

Km 84/74
B&K 4011/4004 (4003 on occassion...there are some things that are different besides spl handling on these)
451's/ck
One side of an sm2 in cardiod
Sm81...yes this can work on certain toppy axes.


Bottom mics.
4038
Rode classic..the first edition.
DX77/DX77D
VL1 in wider cardiod
U48 in fig8 (room dependant)


Non locker mics I have enjoyed are the Lawson 47 and the Nuemann 149.

There are a few others that have worked but these are the go to choices in my little world.

Cheers,
Aardvark

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: John Etnier on April 27, 2004, 09:52:44 AM

A BLUE Bottle with B7 capsule was my mainstay for quite a while, but I'm now stuck on a Klaus-modified 414EB.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Brad Lunde on April 29, 2004, 12:53:41 PM

otek wrote on Fri, 23 April 2004 09:52

Like Fletcher said, depends on what else is going on in the room. I have used DPA 4011, Brauner Valvet, AKG C414TL-II, even a Sennheiser 441. I believe the best upright tone I have gotten was with the Valvet, but then the player was extraordinary.

Chuck Ainlay told me on the last Mark knopfler record (which never made it to print) that the Brauner Vm1A was the best upright bass mic had had ever used.  I was kind of bummed out by that, because I think its good for so many other things to be stuck there!    
Brad

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: Han S. on April 29, 2004, 02:35:08 PM

A good sounding upright: LDC aimed at the bridge and a SDC at the fingerboard.

A 'boomy' sounding bass: ribbon!

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: holm on May 04, 2004, 07:33:19 AM

Haven't tried that many but out of U87 (pretty much everywhere you can imagine), 414TLII, 441 and 451 in flat mode the winner was actually RE 20. It was almost like "point it anywhere and it still sounds good".

I also liked 451, U87 seemed to be lacking the real low end and compensating it with a proximity boost somewhere over 100 Hz, which was kinda ok, but not that good. 441 and 414 did nothing for me, D112 was much better...

RE20 also had a good thing that it did not bring in so much of our not so good room.

The same player also got a killer tone using Neumann M149 a few feet away from the bass in a deadish room.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: David R. on May 05, 2004, 12:55:53 PM

I've used an RE20, 77DX, and an AT 4050, all with good results.  

Fletcher really nailed it, depends on what is left after putting up mics for the rest of the band and what the room is like.  Stand up bass is one of those instruments that is rarely recorded alone, from my experience, and the last thing I want on my bass track is banjo.  Well, I just did another bluegrass gig, but for jazz it is the same idea.

If available, I always take a line from the pickup and blend in the mix.

Title: Re: Stand up Bass Mics
Post by: bloodstone on May 07, 2004, 11:56:45 AM

My best results have always been with an AKG 414 BULS, 12-18 inches away, aimed roughly at one of the f holes about the height of the bridge.