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Author Topic: fiona apple's new record  (Read 11017 times)

j.hall

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fiona apple's new record
« on: August 15, 2005, 02:42:44 pm »

ok, i'm a big fan....if ya'll consider this a guilty pleasure then fine....

i think she's a great writer, and jon brion is always at his finest when working with her, and i'm a big fan of his.

this record was tracked and mixed a few years ago and her label gave her that "there's no single" crap.  she refused to write anymore and they sat at a dead lock for 2 or 3 years i think.

well.....it's finally going to see the light of day

check out the "single", which in this case is hilarious that the label is just releasing one song

http://www.myspace.com/fionaapple

the production is SICK!!!!
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CCC

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2005, 05:50:44 pm »

j.hall wrote on Mon, 15 August 2005 19:42

i think she's a great writer, and jon brion is always at his finest when working with her, and i'm a big fan of his.



Yea, he is absolutely the 'second coming' - true genius in an era where that term has been sadly diluted. I've been meaning to order his solo disc "Meaningless" - the clips I checked out were ridiculously good.
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nrosborough

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2005, 09:11:16 pm »

oddly enough, I just downloaded the album (torrent) on a whim after reading about the Jon Brion/Kanye collaboration.   The arrangements in the songs are incredible, and while this record may not 'play' on AAA radio or your 'alterna-crap' station, I can't believe the fact that there is such amazing music FINISHED from a star musician / star producer that has been shelved all this time. Shame on the record company. SHAME
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lord

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #3 on: August 16, 2005, 07:08:51 am »

When I went to the myspace link, it freaked out and started playing 2 copies of the single at the same time.

I was thinking that I could understand how this was too "out" for the label.

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CCC

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2005, 08:23:30 am »

j.hall wrote on Mon, 15 August 2005 19:42

i think she's a great writer, and jon brion is always at his finest when working with her, and i'm a big fan of his.



Whoops - hey wait a second - this record was produced by Mike Elizondo and Brian Kehew!

Brian is a regular poster - hey Brian - the track that is available on the myspace site is awesome. Would you care to tell us about it? It's a pretty cool kick sound, if you need somewhere to get started.... Comments?
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j.hall

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2005, 08:25:50 am »

if you read her myspace page it sites two other guys are producing the record other then jon brion.

i wonder if she finally caved and recut the thing with some one else.

i read a few years ago that jon brion produced the record, but now he's not being credited for the work.

i have a few "leaked" tracks from the jon brion sessions, maybe i'll post them.

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CCC

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2005, 08:31:38 am »

j.hall wrote on Tue, 16 August 2005 13:25

if you read her myspace page it sites two other guys are producing the record other then jon brion.

i wonder if she finally caved and recut the thing with some one else.

i read a few years ago that jon brion produced the record, but now he's not being credited for the work.

i have a few "leaked" tracks from the jon brion sessions, maybe i'll post them.




Sorry mate, I can't find the reference to Mr. Brion. It would suck if he was not credited for his work....for sure....

Just out of curiousity - I'm not, like, lecturing here, but don't you expose yourself to liability if you post those 'leaked' tracks? I dunno - just lookin' out for you bud.
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j.hall

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2005, 11:52:18 am »

not considering i downloaded them about 2 years ago off a few different websites.

if you do a few internet seraches you'll find the tracks all over the place.

what is anyone going to do to me anyway....ask me to pull the tracks down???
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CCC

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2005, 12:21:20 pm »

j.hall wrote on Tue, 16 August 2005 16:52


what is anyone going to do to me anyway....ask me to pull the tracks down???


Yep, that's about it. Somewhere in that not very well articulated statute y'all have called the DMCA the story starts with 'notice and take down'. I think the story ends with RIAA robocops at your door with truncheons (ask Dmitry Sklyarov).

Anyway - looking forward to hearing this material!
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Guasp

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2005, 12:30:18 pm »

hello, longtime lurker here,

to clear up the Jon Brion thing,

Jon brion produced the version of the album that was recorded a few years ago and is floating around the internet. Ms Apple has since scrapped that version and started again from scratch with producer Mike Elizondo. only 2 songs survived from the jon brion sessions.
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drumsound

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2005, 01:05:43 pm »

The Myspace version is different from the one that's been floating around.

What other songs besides "Oh Sailor" survived?  I hope "Please Please Please" is there.
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J.J. Blair

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2005, 01:27:52 pm »

Guasp wrote on Tue, 16 August 2005 09:30

Ms Apple has since scrapped that version and started again from scratch with producer Mike Elizondo. only 2 songs survived from the jon brion sessions.


To correct that, it's produced by Mike Elizondo AND Brian Kehew.

My two cents on Jon are well known.  First, a disclaimer: Jon taught me so much about music and how to listen to it, that I would not be half the musician, producer or engineer I am without his influence.  He is one of the greatest guitar players alive, a ridiculous keyboard player, drummer, and even kills on double mallet vibes.  His ear, understanding of harmony and musical memory for detail are mind numbing.  I'd give my left nut to have his musical abilities.  Even though I do have a personal axe to grind with him (a different story), I think I can still be completely objective in my opinion.  

That being said, I don't care for him as a producer, and I don't care for his newer songs as much as his older songs.  I think as a producer, he gets too 'clever'.  I honestly feel that on the first Rufus album as well as just about everything else, there's times where it's more about 'notice how clever this is,'  rather than 'notice how well this serves the song.'  That same self indulgence goes to his writing and letting the artists he works with meander too much in their writing.  I'm all for artistic integrity and idealism, but the reality is that people these days have a "next" button available to them.  When Yes made Close To the Edge, kids would smoke some pot, put on a record and listen with headphones ... patiently.  You can't ignore the fact that people listen differently these days, so if you are going to let Sony hire you, go over deadline and over budget, you owe it to the artist and the label to make a record that people are going to want to buy.  Is it too much to at least ask for one radio single, then you can do Pet Sounds and pump organ solos for the rest of the record?  

A producer's job is to produce a finished master to the label.  This means that you actually have to finish it and you can't decide to fly to Abbey Road to do a third string arrangement because it seems like something cool to do.  Jon seems to be unable to commit to a creative decision, and constantly retracks stuff in different ways.  I would have more respect for his production if he had more focus.  I know a little bit about what Fiona went through, and I feel for her.  I don't think it's fair for the producer to take that long, go that far over budget and hand in a record that the label doesn't want to release.

Jon is a genius.  And like many geniuses, he suffers from severe myopia.  I mean, it's REALLY extreme.  I lived with the guy, so just take my word for it.  However, I think letting somebody that myopic be in a position as a producer, unchecked, can be a bad thing.  Also, I don't know what good being that genius is if all your records don't sell well and those artists never want to work with you again, let alone talk with you.

I'd really like to see Jon have some success as a producer in terms of sales.  Maybe his Kanye West thing will do that for him, partially because Kanye has oversight and final say.  So many of us believed in Jon and recognized his talent when nobody knew who he was, and he didn't even have money to eat sometimes.  I let Jon stay on my couch for half a year, and let the Grays use my rehearsal place for free during the period that they didn't have a deal.  I think all of us hoped for a day when people everywhere would recognize his talent, which thankfully they now do.  The flipside of that is I think they over indulge his talent.  It's like this line I remember from a movie where somebody was talking to a grade school art teacher and commenting on how amazing all the children's paintings were.  She asked the teacher how she taught them to paint such beautiful pictures, and the teacher said, "I didn't.  I just knew when to take their brush away."  Well, I think Jon would benefit greatly from having somebody who knew when to take his brush away.

Now I know you guys are all going to jump to his defense and flame me, so let's hear it.

EDIT: If you love Jon's music, buy Rusty Anderson's (McCartney's guitarist) solo record, Undressing Underwater.  It's not in stores yet, but it is on iTunes.  It reminds me so much of Jon's stuff 15 years ago, especially songs like "Hurt Myself".
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j.hall

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2005, 01:34:03 pm »

so, she caved to the label pressure.  i don't blame her, she held out for a LONG TIME.  i think it was around 3 years she fought with them.....

does anyone have the entire jon brion record, sequenced, that might be willing to get it to me....i only have two songs.

i'll pst the two i've got in a minute.
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J.J. Blair

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2005, 02:05:12 pm »

I don't think it was a matter of caving.  I heard Sony just plain said that they weren't releasing it.
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studio info

They say the heart of Rock & Roll is still beating, which is amazing if you consider all the blow it's done over the years.

"The Internet enables pompous blowhards to interact with other pompous blowhards in a big circle jerk of pomposity." - Bill Maher

"The negative aspects of this business, not only will continue to prevail, but will continue to accelerate in madness. Conditions aren't going to get better, because the economics of rock and roll are getting closer and closer to the economics of Big Business America." - Bill Graham

j.hall

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Re: fiona apple's new record
« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2005, 03:48:23 pm »

Fiona Apple

two tracks off the jon brion record.

it would be interesting to hear her comments on this whole thing.  it seems odd that an artist would hire jon brion after working with him as the producer on her 2nd record, and hiring him to play tons of stuff on her first record, then end up unhappy with the final product of her thirda album.  you'd think she knew exactly what she was getting into, and you'd think she hired him for exactly that reason.

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