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Author Topic: Eq tests the results  (Read 4373 times)

aivoryuk

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Eq tests the results
« on: July 10, 2005, 07:59:09 AM »

Here are the results of the several eq plugins that i tested
sorry its a bit of a long topic and these are only my opinions of course.

plugins tested

Waves LinEq low and broadband
Timeworks Mastering Eq
JMS Hi resoultion EQ
TC Native EQ
Sonalksis 517 EQ
PSP MasterQ
Steinberg Q metric

Tracks tested on was one poor mixed track which needed a lot of surgical work, 2nd track was a average that just needed some touch up. 3rd track was a excellent mix, so just wanted to see if the plugins could add anything to it

the brief highlights are as follows

Waves Lin Eq: very good for surgical use and most transparent out of these choices. Even with the tracks that didn't need much surgical work it added definition to the low end. Not much sweet colour but I don't think it was designed for that. FLexible and good user interface.

Timeworks Mastering Q: seemd a bit lightweight and not refined enough. fiddly controls particulary the shelving controls. Did not seem to cope with surgical or sweetning

JMS hi re: not as transparent as the waves but was still pretty good, still defined in all areas, not harsh sounding, performed well on all tracks, more flexible than waves

TC native: not the most flexible as had no hi-low filters. not transparent and not colourful so not sure would consider as a mastering eq although did perform better than some of the others.

Sonalksis 517 EQ: this had been recommended by several people so had high hopes for this. its quite smooth but to my ears anything more than a 2db boost would push it in the harsh area particulary vocals. the low end seemed to suffer and the tracks sounded better without anything thing done to them. does have a good user interface and reasonably flexible

PSP masterQ: initially was impressed but when listening closer found a lot of the areas to to be smeared partculary the vocal area. sounded quite cold. the high end can sparkle and can really bring details out on recordings but when pushed it got a bit too much. fiddly interface is flexible but maybe to the point where there are too many options

Steinberg Q Metric: the most colorful out of all them but handles it in a nice way on all the tracks the low end seemed more solid and the mids sounded warm but without sounding harsh. The highs are a bit too coloured for my liking as i would prefer something a bit more smoother

conclusion:
I learnt a lot from doing these tests, and was a good listening test. there wasn't one plugin that was complete and I could find fault with at least element of it. So rather than just depend on one plugin I would use a mixture depending on what the track required ( i would prob imagine that most people that would do that anyway)
The ones that stood out to me were the Waves, JMS hi res and the steinberg q metric (the last 2 not being the most expensive plugins and i kept coming back to them). For the time being they have what i need to get on with. There are prob a few more out there that i need to try like the UAD ones and of course the algorithmix.

I would love to try a go analog at some point when i get more things under belt as im sure it may open up another world to me.

cheers Alex
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TotalSonic

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2005, 12:31:29 PM »

Hi Alex -
I use the JMS Hi-res EQ all the time for my mastering work - although usually I just use it for sectional touch ups after doing the "heavy lifting" with my analog eq's and really don't ever do large boosts with it.  At only $75 I think it offers extraordinary value considering that its sound compares very well with some of the best (and much more expensive) digital eq's out there.

One of the reasons I like it so much is that the interface works nice for me as I had a small part in its gui design as I was one of the main beta testers for it - and the SAWStudio version is completely & easily automateable.  Another nice thing is that its code has been extensively optimized also so that you can load multiple instances without dragging down your cpu.  

I think you might want to investigate the Elemental Audio stuff (eqium & firium) and the UAD stuff also - but I definitely can highly recommend the JMS Hi-res EQ.  

Best regards,
Steve Berson

Bob Olhsson

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2005, 12:33:08 PM »

What host were you using?

genericperson

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #3 on: July 10, 2005, 12:36:15 PM »

that was cool.  i like shootout stuff like this. Smile
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aivoryuk

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2005, 01:26:37 PM »

hey

Steve im pretty sure in a earlier post (couple of months ago) about favourite Eq's you mentioned about the JMS so i had to check it out and i was impressed and it does perform better than a some plugins that cost more.

I still really like my ole steinberg Q metric which i've had for a few years, i'd not used it in a while as i'd got a new system. I didn't think it would stand up to the newer plugins as its a bit old but it still sounded good to my ears.

i used wavelab 4 to test them all so its only direct x and vst plugins i have used
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Ronny

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2005, 06:56:25 PM »



Just curious Alex. Did you test the same eq curves, using the same boosts/cuts and Q factor settings, or tweaked each one for the best sound that you could get?
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aivoryuk

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2005, 07:17:35 AM »

Ronny wrote on Sun, 10 July 2005 23:56



Just curious Alex. Did you test the same eq curves, using the same boosts/cuts and Q factor settings, or tweaked each one for the best sound that you could get?


Hi Ronny

I sort of did both, reason being the Q factor settings were different for each plugin so for example the steinberg Q metric 0.3 Q setting is a wide Q, but on the JMS that would be a narrow Q (4.0 is its widest Q)

if i had done it just one way then that may not have been fair cause obv every plugin reacts differently

cheers

Alex

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Ronny

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #7 on: July 11, 2005, 08:10:25 AM »

aivoryuk wrote on Mon, 11 July 2005 07:17

Ronny wrote on Sun, 10 July 2005 23:56



Just curious Alex. Did you test the same eq curves, using the same boosts/cuts and Q factor settings, or tweaked each one for the best sound that you could get?


Hi Ronny

I sort of did both, reason being the Q factor settings were different for each plugin so for example the steinberg Q metric 0.3 Q setting is a wide Q, but on the JMS that would be a narrow Q (4.0 is its widest Q)

if i had done it just one way then that may not have been fair cause obv every plugin reacts differently

cheers

Alex




Ok, glad that you tested both ways. IIRC, technically Q is measured by the center frequency divided by the bandwidth at 3dB and it should be the same on all eq's (correct me if I'm wrong), but I notice with different digital eq's, when setting the same values on F,Q and G, that the curves vary and more than slightly on some. I'm wondering why that is. Is it a graphical error on the charts or just the pixel thing which sometimes makes computer graphs less than accurate, anyone care to comment?
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OTR-jkl

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #8 on: July 11, 2005, 09:31:11 AM »

Alex -
Did you use the PSP MasterQ in FAT mode?
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aivoryuk

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #9 on: July 11, 2005, 09:59:29 AM »

OTR-jkl wrote on Mon, 11 July 2005 14:31

Alex -
Did you use the PSP MasterQ in FAT mode?


yep certainley did and with all the lim and sat elements to it as well. like i said it did intially impress me but after further listening (my speakers, headphones, diff times of day, leaving it for days), even with just the gentlist of boost/cut i could hear frequencies smearing particulary in the low end (seemed to do more damage than good IMO)

Alex
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TotalSonic

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #10 on: July 11, 2005, 10:35:40 AM »

aivoryuk wrote on Mon, 11 July 2005 12:17



I sort of did both, reason being the Q factor settings were different for each plugin so for example the steinberg Q metric 0.3 Q setting is a wide Q, but on the JMS that would be a narrow Q (4.0 is its widest Q)




yeah - the JMS Hi-res is band width is labelled by octave instead of Q.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

aivoryuk

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2005, 02:27:48 PM »

TotalSonic wrote on Mon, 11 July 2005 15:35

aivoryuk wrote on Mon, 11 July 2005 12:17



I sort of did both, reason being the Q factor settings were different for each plugin so for example the steinberg Q metric 0.3 Q setting is a wide Q, but on the JMS that would be a narrow Q (4.0 is its widest Q)




yeah - the JMS Hi-res is band width is labelled by octave instead of Q.

Best regards,
Steve Berson


aah i see i understand that now cheers steve
also going to try out the elemental audio plugins and see how i get on with them

just tried the demo version of the trident hydratone that some people have recommended, seemed better than some but seemd to be really bright even with just a little db boost but i'll get more of a listen
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carlsaff

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #12 on: July 11, 2005, 02:44:45 PM »

Very hard to keep up with the EQ plugin market. The past year has seen the release of some amazing plugin EQs.

Missing from this list are excellent offerings from UAD (Precision EQ, Pultec Pro), Voxengo (HarmoniEQ, CurveEQ), TriTone (not available yet, but the upcoming AngleTone mastering EQ looks promising) and URS (Fulltec and BLT).

aivoryuk

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #13 on: July 11, 2005, 03:36:28 PM »

carlsaff wrote on Mon, 11 July 2005 19:44

Very hard to keep up with the EQ plugin market. The past year has seen the release of some amazing plugin EQs.

Missing from this list are excellent offerings from UAD (Precision EQ, Pultec Pro), Voxengo (HarmoniEQ, CurveEQ), TriTone (not available yet, but the upcoming AngleTone mastering EQ looks promising) and URS (Fulltec and BLT).


actually i did try the curve eq but haven't had the chance to dive into it.

would love to try the UAD but would mean upgrading my system and my main music system is on laptop, which i don;t think they have a firewire or usb card yet???
so i would really have to borrow a system to test them properly before i would be willing to spend on them for myself
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Technotechno

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #14 on: July 11, 2005, 09:33:59 PM »

Hi Alex,

definitely check out the voxengo curve and spend a little more time with it. Its not an instant grtification EQ, but bear in mind its a lot more than an EQ. The convultion samples can really add something special to a mix and the limiter is pretty tasty as well.

I have the curve EQ, and the Elephant astering Limiter. Of all the limiters I have used this is the best one imo. The dither and 4 time oversampling function really helps as well.

Smile
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Jerry Tubb

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #15 on: July 11, 2005, 10:23:59 PM »

Alex

Glad to hear you like the Waves Linear Phase EQ's.

They're working for me, good for corrective surgical applications.

And fairly transparent to boot.
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TotalSonic

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #16 on: July 11, 2005, 10:38:17 PM »

Technotechno wrote on Tue, 12 July 2005 02:33

Hi Alex,

definitely check out the voxengo curve and spend a little more time with it. Its not an instant grtification EQ, but bear in mind its a lot more than an EQ. The convultion samples can really add something special to a mix and the limiter is pretty tasty as well.

I have the curve EQ, and the Elephant astering Limiter. Of all the limiters I have used this is the best one imo. The dither and 4 time oversampling function really helps as well.

Smile


I haven't tried the Curve eq - but I did spend some time with "Elephant" - and I have to offer a dissenting opinion.  I was pretty unimpressed with it - to me it's limiting was pretty fairly obvious with lots of undesirable aritifacts - including some noticeable pumping.  Obviously ommv.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

aivoryuk

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #17 on: July 12, 2005, 07:29:14 AM »

JayTea wrote on Tue, 12 July 2005 03:23

Alex

Glad to hear you like the Waves Linear Phase EQ's.

They're working for me, good for corrective surgical applications.

And fairly transparent to boot.


hi jerry

yeah i do really like the waves linear phase and it will be my primary surgical plugin.

for my other plugs im going for the JMS hi res, its good all rounder which can add definition where needed. extremley good value for money i'm glad i tried it.

for my colour one im sticking with my steinberg Q metric, it may be old and only operate at the lower frequencey rates, but it had the sound i liked the most and when pushed still kept control.

These were the main things about these plugins they kept control and i kept coming back to them.

The newer ones that i tried seemed to run before they can walk

thats my opinion of course Smile
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carlsaff

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #18 on: July 12, 2005, 09:21:14 AM »

TotalSonic wrote on Mon, 11 July 2005 21:38

I did spend some time with "Elephant" - and I have to offer a dissenting opinion.  I was pretty unimpressed with it - to me it's limiting was pretty fairly obvious with lots of undesirable aritifacts - including some noticeable pumping.  Obviously ommv.


One of the problems with Elephant is that it has almost too many options. Some of it's settings can introduce the pumping you describe. However, especially in the 2.3 version, you can get very transparent results. The mode you choose makes all the difference (the cheekily named EL3 mode seems most kind to transients).

That said, I've been using UAD's Precision Limiter for 90% of my projects since I purchased it. Elephant is occasionally the better choice, but rarely.

Catalin Truta

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #19 on: August 18, 2005, 03:04:10 AM »

is anyone here using HarBal? i'm very interested in your oppinions as i think it's an amazing tool.

Ronny

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #20 on: August 18, 2005, 08:38:37 AM »

OMU wrote on Thu, 18 August 2005 03:04

is anyone here using HarBal? i'm very interested in your oppinions as i think it's an amazing tool.



I sold all of my mastering gear and use Har-Bal exclusively now.  Laughing
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bblackwood

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #21 on: August 18, 2005, 08:40:38 AM »

OMU wrote on Thu, 18 August 2005 02:04

is anyone here using HarBal? i'm very interested in your oppinions as i think it's an amazing tool.

If you search around you'll find that few people give it a thumbs up - it seems only those who simply don't know better like it...
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Jack Schitt

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #22 on: August 18, 2005, 12:26:33 PM »

Has anyone tried the Kjaerhus GEQ-7?
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Ronny

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Re: Eq tests the results
« Reply #23 on: August 18, 2005, 02:01:20 PM »

bblackwood wrote on Thu, 18 August 2005 08:40

OMU wrote on Thu, 18 August 2005 02:04

is anyone here using HarBal? i'm very interested in your oppinions as i think it's an amazing tool.

If you search around you'll find that few people give it a thumbs up - it seems only those who simply don't know better like it...



Absolutely and don't forget that the designer of Har-Bal was informed of one discussion on this forum dissing his prodcut, signed up to psw to address the dissing he was getting and dropped out of the discussion without answering bona fide questions.


Caveat emptor is something that applies to audio software as much as it does to buying used cars. It really sickens me when you have hard working people developing software over years and years that truly benefit the industry and than someone comes along, throws some ones and zeros together overnight and sells the miracle cure to unknowing newbies, undercutting the real product designers and trying to get a piece of the pie that they didn't earn.  

I demo'd Har-Bal when it first came out, I wouldn't have left it on my DAW if it was a freebie. Sue me.
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