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[Arf! Mastering]

Yannick Willox wrote on Sat, 25 June 2005 10:22

Listening blind does not work for me - living with it for a few weeks is much more interesting.

You need to do each type of listening - long-term as well as blind.  The blind test is always enlightening, humbling, or both.

[Ronny]

AlanS wrote on Sat, 25 June 2005 10:27

Yannick Willox wrote on Sat, 25 June 2005 10:22 Listening blind does not work for me - living with it for a few weeks is much more interesting. You need to do each type of listening - long-term as well as blind.  The blind test is always enlightening, humbling, or both.

Exactly, neither is better than the other and both are better than one. It pays to confirm your testing in the blind though, because the blind listen does not lie and it's the way the consumer hears your work. People are going to hear accumulative difference in the long term listen, but the longer the evaluation the more chance that human elements will sway the results. You also have build up and break in time factors on some gear that can sway the short term listen, that's why both are essential for a full and complete evaluation.

[dcollins]

zetterstroem wrote on Sat, 25 June 2005 00:47

no.... it has two 6922 tubes in the analog stage.... but a tube psu.... 6x something rectifier and two ob2.... no digital filtering..... just a 8412 reciever chip that goes into the 1865.... then 18dB/oct analog filtering.... oh... yeah.... it's 18bits!!   truncated

6922 and 6DJ8 are the same thing.  I can't believe they would waste money on an anti-image filter!  Who needs it?

DC

[zetterstroem]

 

[Noiseflaw]

Yannick Willox wrote on Sat, 25 June 2005 10:22

Listening blind does not work for me - living with it for a few weeks is much more interesting.

Very very good point.

[michal @ mytek]

Nathan Eldred wrote on Fri, 24 June 2005 15:28

If the differences weren't so startling and obvious IMHO I think the opinion would be completely off base, but it seems to be the general consensus of those who are actually putting the three in front of their ears instead of just reading forums.

I think Nathan hit the nail on the head. If there are enough differences, like in mentioned units, you can hear them non blind. But it's good to do a blind test just in case. Also you can't do it too fast and you have to listen for particular sounds not just broad frequency. As with anything it takes time and experience to get good at it. I myself don't have a natural talent of a golden ear but through the years have learned what to listen for from a real golden ear. As a matter of fact we always do the tests with at least one pair of golden ears.

Michal www.mytekdigital.com

[dcollins]

michal @ mytek wrote on Wed, 29 June 2005 22:17

As a matter of fact we always do the tests with at least one pair of golden ears.

How exactly does one become a "Golden Ear?"..................................

Do they claim to hear small changes in the barometric pressure?.....................

Or leave the room entirely at certain density altitudes.........................

Phwoar,  it's harder than I thought to just go stream of consciousness and ellipsis where we might otherwise have actual content......

About Whales.........................

DC

[dave-G]

dcollins wrote on Thu, 30 June 2005 01:46

michal @ mytek wrote on Wed, 29 June 2005 22:17 As a matter of fact we always do the tests with at least one pair of golden ears. How exactly does one become a "Golden Ear?"..................................

It all starts with a horrible smelting accident.

-dg

[Gold]

dave-G wrote on Thu, 30 June 2005 05:44

It all starts with a horrible smelting accident.

I haven't had a pile of smelt and beer in a few years. Maybe that's why I don't hear so good anymore.

[Ronny]

dcollins wrote on Thu, 30 June 2005 01:46

michal @ mytek wrote on Wed, 29 June 2005 22:17 As a matter of fact we always do the tests with at least one pair of golden ears. How exactly does one become a "Golden Ear?".................................. DC

There is a difference between Golden Ear and Golden Ears.

First you have to take the Tin Ears course, than you have to graduate from the Silver Ears course and if you are real lucky and pass the entrance exam, you can get accepted into the Golden Ear program. I'm still working on my Tin Ears diploma, but hope one day that I can be a Golden Ear. My left ear is my best one, once I get it to pass as a golden ear, I'm going to work on my right one and get the full degree.

[Noiseflaw]

Quote:

There is a difference between Golden Ear and Golden Ears. First you have to take the Tin Ears course, than you have to graduate from the Silver Ears course and if you are real lucky and pass the entrance exam, you can get accepted into the Golden Ear program. I'm still working on my Tin Ears diploma, but hope one day that I can be a Golden Ear. My left ear is my best one, once I get it to pass as a golden ear, I'm going to work on my right one and get the full degree.

Lol,  

But I notice you are a Gold Member of thir forum,  One day Grasshopper, you will be a Gold member with 2 Golden Ears!

[Ruairi O'Flaherty]

dcollins wrote on Thu, 30 June 2005 06:46

michal @ mytek wrote on Wed, 29 June 2005 22:17 As a matter of fact we always do the tests with at least one pair of golden ears. How exactly does one become a "Golden Ear?".................................. Do they claim to hear small changes in the barometric pressure?..................... Or leave the room entirely at certain density altitudes......................... Phwoar,  it's harder than I thought to just go stream of consciousness and ellipsis where we might otherwise have actual content...... About Whales......................... DC

Careful Dave, you've been hanging around with Poyser for too long!

[Ronny]

Guy Holden-Isles wrote on Thu, 30 June 2005 16:38

Quote: There is a difference between Golden Ear and Golden Ears. First you have to take the Tin Ears course, than you have to graduate from the Silver Ears course and if you are real lucky and pass the entrance exam, you can get accepted into the Golden Ear program. I'm still working on my Tin Ears diploma, but hope one day that I can be a Golden Ear. My left ear is my best one, once I get it to pass as a golden ear, I'm going to work on my right one and get the full degree. Lol,   But I notice you are a Gold Member of thir forum,  One day Grasshopper, you will be a Gold member with 2 Golden Ears!

Yes, I'm quite thankful I have a golden member.  

[Yannick Willox]

On our 6 model AD converter shootout, the initial blind test differences seemed more important than became apparant over a two week period.

Also, attention shifted from the WOW this is great blind responses, to the living with/working with 'this actually sounds the most natural, most transparant' observations.

The one that jumped out as the most 'live'&natural (during blind testing) actually revealed itself as the most inaccurate AD converter ever seen here !!!

IMO blind testing gives very biased results, as one WANTS to hear certain differences - even if they are not there. They are only usefull as a reference.

The working with period actually convinced us NOT to buy the sexy, initially best sounding AD converter.

We bought the very one we were (initially) not at all interested in.
Three units.

Several projects later it is becoming clear that the quality of these units is indeed far better than expected.