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Author Topic: ME Gear Snobbery  (Read 14761 times)

Jerry Tubb

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ME Gear Snobbery
« on: May 13, 2005, 11:14:02 AM »

What about the Expensive Gear -to- Actual ME Skills Ratio ? or more simply put...

I have better Gear than you, so I must be a better Mastering Engineer than you?

example:

I have B&W Nautilus 802s and you don't...

I have Lavry Blue DACs and you don't...

I have a Weiss EQ1 and you don't...

So I must be a better ME than you...

...a touchy subject ...that needs to be "aired out" a bit    Very Happy
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bblackwood

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2005, 11:39:54 AM »

I dunno, not a lot of steak-swinging goes on around here...

We certainly don't encourage it.
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Brad Blackwood
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aivoryuk

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2005, 11:41:29 AM »

well i must admit I do get frustrated but some ME's snobbery to equipment

on other forums that i go onto people will reel off there equipment list and say

'yeah I'm a mastering engineer and have all this equipment and that makes me better than you'

I don't think there there is one piece of audio equipment that makes somebody better than you apart from you ears as if you can't hear whats going on no piece of equipment is going to help you.

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Trillium Sound

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2005, 11:47:21 AM »

aivoryuk wrote on Fri, 13 May 2005 11:41

well i must admit I do get frustrated but some ME's snobbery to equipment on other forums that i go onto people will reel off there equipment list and say 'yeah I'm a mastering engineer and have all this equipment and that makes me better than you'


Just like in every domain, there are dumb people everywhere. Just forget about them if they make you sweat.

Regards,

Richard
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bigaudioblowhard

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2005, 12:05:30 PM »

I'm with Brad on this one. I work in a 'cough cough' PRO LA mastering studio and

I almost never hear of that kind of stuff. Maybe a little Gear Envy goes on. Could

that be the source of your question?

In this business, we're judged more by our client list than anything else, not to

suggest this is right either. Its just that way.

You're not as good as the LAST thing you did,

you're as good as the BEST thing you did. (please excuse poor semantics)

sincerly bab



.

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2005, 12:56:31 PM »


With Snobby people it's always ME ME ME Laughing


I think Gear Snobbery and Envy has to do more with our insecurities as people. Society in certain areas of the country are more Status oriented so they worry about the Jones' I used to be really insecure about my gear but....

If there is one thing I've learned in the last few years is that results matter. If your gear gets you/client results then you should never have to defend your choice of gear.

Peace,
Dennis
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Noiseflaw

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #6 on: May 13, 2005, 01:10:12 PM »

It seems to me to be a moot point.

If I were to set up in business as an ME  I would strive to buy the best equipment out there, I would garner the opinions and expertise of the Pro's and then write a wish list and proceed to save my pennies and borrow as much as reasonably possible.

A lot of the equipment would likely last for many years.

The world of the Mastering Engineer does not particularly stike me as a sneering gear snobbery one, quite the contrary.

I mean Pro Tennis players buy the best equipment that is available they all do - any snobbery tends to creep in with the amount of success they acomplish using their tools.   I guess this would relate to the success of Masteing Engineers also - it can be applied to any profesional field.
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Peace...

chrisj

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2005, 01:20:42 PM »

I could see ME snobbery over monitoring. In my experience (I make my own speakers so I can't be snobby because nobody gives a rat's ass) when I've had my monitoring screwy, I could not work worth a damn. The closer I got to good monitoring, the more I could do good work.

As for the processing, it's much easier to take any flexible piece of equipment and make it sound bad than make it sound good, so it's a moot point. I've just finished trying to wreak havoc on the WIMP project with literally $30 worth of software. I had to do a lot of workarounds. I was peak limiting by selecting them one by one in the wave editor and reducing them to 80% volume, over and over and over... it's so much more about 'what you're trying to make the sound do' than 'what you have in your chain' that the chain is ALMOST irrelevant.

That's why they say 'Driver, not car'.

My rule of thumb is, if they're going on about the chain but don't devote a thought to speakers, they aren't MEs, they're mixers. If they have expensive monitoring but haven't done a thing for room treatment, they're not great MEs. It's as simple as that. And you can make room treatment VERY cheaply, so this is not a matter of needing mucho dinero.

I envy Brad's Nautilus- but they wouldn't work in my room. I don't have enough space for a radiation pattern like that. Nearfield first-reflections would kill me. I'm running very directional horns and firing them at a strongly diffusive back wall with spot absorbers all over the nearfield-reflection spots. That's MY snobby-factor- and there's lots better out there, but I know to make the most of what I got.

lucey

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2005, 03:46:45 PM »

JayTea wrote on Fri, 13 May 2005 10:14

What about the Expensive Gear -to- Actual ME Skills Ratio ? or more simply put...

I have better Gear than you, so I must be a better Mastering Engineer than you?

example:

I have B&W Nautilus 802s and you don't...

I have Lavry Blue DACs and you don't...

I have a Weiss EQ1 and you don't...

So I must be a better ME than you...

...a touchy subject ...that needs to be "aired out" a bit    Very Happy


I've never seen this.  Never ever actually.

Maybe you feel insecure because you long to own the big names too?  I know I wanted to hear it all and try it all, and now that I have what I feel is 'the best' in many categories, my work is truly better.  Is it better then yours?  Dont know.  What's "better" anyway?


I think the MAIN gear for MEs is the monitoring, and this is 1/2 room and 1/2 picking the speakers that work for our taste and room.  So there's really no snobbery available in that category.  If the monitoring works, it works.



What I have seen is good old macho BS and superiority complexes based on supposed knowledge or supposed experience, which is funny coming from Mastering Engineers!

Experience is not quanitifyable, so there is no place for judgment there ... and knowledge is not as powerful as wisdom, so again ... a silly flex.

Men will be men I suppose, but where are the girls to impress?   Oh Baby, you know chicks LOVE the ME's .. mmmm, yea!  Very Sexy.  Rolling Eyes
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Brian Lucey
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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #9 on: May 13, 2005, 04:22:27 PM »

Oh darn!  I didn't really need to go into hock for Lavry, Weiss, Dunlavy, Legendary Audio Neve, Z-Sys, Algorithmix, TC6k.  Really, a dbx 166, a Mackie board and an L1 would have been just as good.  I guess I took the fact that artists trust me with their babies too seriously.  
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JackJohnston

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #10 on: May 13, 2005, 07:57:10 PM »



We've all heard horrible crap from people who had nice gear. With that said, there is pretty much no chance in hell that someone with mediocre gear is going to do as good of a mastering job as DC or a few other top ME's. It doesn't matter how good they are. If you have Jeff Gordon in a car race with Tony Stewert, whom ever has the better car is likely going to win. And if it's a Pinto vs a GT40 it's not going to even be close.

Jack

Ronny

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #11 on: May 13, 2005, 08:03:03 PM »

JayTea wrote on Fri, 13 May 2005 11:14

What about the Expensive Gear -to- Actual ME Skills Ratio ? or more simply put...

I have better Gear than you, so I must be a better Mastering Engineer than you?

example:

I have B&W Nautilus 802s and you don't...

I have Lavry Blue DACs and you don't...

I have a Weiss EQ1 and you don't...

So I must be a better ME than you...

...a touchy subject ...that needs to be "aired out" a bit    Very Happy



That's like saying I play guitar as good as Clapton, because I have a Stratocaster.
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bblackwood

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #12 on: May 13, 2005, 08:13:59 PM »

JackJohnston wrote on Fri, 13 May 2005 18:57

If you have Jeff Gordon in a car race with Tony Stewert, whom ever has the better car is likely going to win.

Bad example. As much as I despise him, Tony is the best NASCAR driver out there right now. The guy is just SICK.

Otherwise a good point...
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Brad Blackwood
euphonic masters

dcollins

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #13 on: May 13, 2005, 09:58:43 PM »

bblackwood wrote on Fri, 13 May 2005 17:13


Bad example. As much as I despise him, Tony is the best NASCAR driver out there right now. The guy is just SICK.



But if you want to extend the "driver not the car" analogy, you have to be able to qualify!  Or you just get to watch the race...

Is NASCAR the one where a bunch of guys swing their t-shirts around over their heads and shout "WOOOOOO!"

DC

bblackwood

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Re: ME Gear Snobbery
« Reply #14 on: May 13, 2005, 10:14:53 PM »

dcollins wrote on Fri, 13 May 2005 20:58

bblackwood wrote on Fri, 13 May 2005 17:13


Bad example. As much as I despise him, Tony is the best NASCAR driver out there right now. The guy is just SICK.

But if you want to extend the "driver not the car" analogy, you have to be able to qualify!  Or you just get to watch the race...

Sure, but his comparison is like comparing you to the deaf guy.

Scratch that, maybe the deaf/mute.

Fine, it's like comparing you to the dead guy.

Quote:

Is NASCAR the one where a bunch of guys swing their t-shirts around over their heads and shout "WOOOOOO!"

Well, yeah. But it's "WOOOOOOOHOOOOO"...

That and the good stuff, like Coors Light...
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Brad Blackwood
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