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[j.hall]

so, as i've been working the past few weeks on a bunch of "test" mixes.  i started sub grouping again.

i sort of abandoned this method of mixing a few years back but though i'd give it a try again.

i've also stopped compressing so hard and started using more automation moves to set things up the way i want.

anyway.  are you guys subgrouping your tracks down?

and if so, are you compressing those stereo subs.

i've been setting up a drum buss, guitars, and vox.

i've also been sending the bass to the drum buss that's being compressed about 4 db.  makes a pretty big difference in how the bass sits with the drums.

so now i'm seeing the need to more stereo buss type comps, where i never really thought i'd get into that much.

what are you guys using?

[drew]

I'm currently mixing all ITB. I have a Vari Mu and a Smart C2. One on the drum sub, the other on the mains. Which one goes on what depends on the source. i will sometimes group vox together and put either a Waves ren comp or the BombFactory 1176 on it.
drew

www.drewmazurek.com

[craig boychuk]

I'm a big fan of an 1176/78 on just about anything...

the Focusrite Red is also a very versatile stereo comp. They just drastically dropped the prices on those (Focusrite)things , so I dunno if that means that the new ones are made differently, but the older ones kicked ass. They work well on the 2mix also, if you're into that sort of thing. They can be very transparent if you want 'em to be.

Here's a neato drum subgroup trick: bus everything but the overheads and room mics to a subgroup, and put the OH and room on another sub. This way, you can slam the fuck outta the first sub without having the cymbals pump like crazy. I find this technique to be very useful in many situations. Just watch out for phase! I was doing this once, and somehow one of the groups got phase reversed...it took me quite a bit of time to figure out why everything sounded strange. Ha.

Orange County made (makes??) some interesting boxes...super gritty sounding stuff, but they can be a neat character tool.

I find that if I'm mixing in the box, I use way more subs than I would if I were mixing analogue, just because it's real easy to set up...on an analogue console, you have to run tone through everything to make sure that the L&R of each bus is balanced, blah blah blah calibrate calibrate yada yada. The computer has spoiled me rotten. Sigh...



-craig

[j.hall]

calibrate???????????

what is that????????????????

i don't cal the sub groups.  screw that.

i buss everything before i even hear a sound and start working off that.  if the guitars are low i just turn each on up the sub.

what i do do is pass a cal'd tone from my mastersection to each sub group comp and do a really fast unity gain cal.

then as i work i know if something is clipping if i'm driving it too hard to the comp, or if i'm simply hitting the 2mix too hard

minimizes my trouble shooting time

once i get the subgroup comp dialed in "for good" i cal it once more (just the make up gain).

i like the separate groups from cymbals.....

try running your bass guitar to the drum group.  without chaning anything, just route it over there.....thus far, i've really liked it....glues it to the drum kit beautifully.

[jkmixer]

Longtime Lurker...thanks for all the info over the years.

I set-up a lot parallel and subgroup compression. I like the sound and it helps me to save on PT DSP resources since my system is quite challenged.

I agree with what J said about bussing bass w/ drum comp. Really glues and locks them in together. I have lately been doing this as a separate group for all drums, parallel drum comps and bass and it's parallel comps. All of these feed this new comp buss and that goes to the 2-buss.

I seem to be able to get more of the sound I want for the bass in the mix with less bass compression and/or mults. Also seems to help my bass EQ- less need to fit it in. It started from not liking my 2-buss comp changing other aspects of the mix, but i liked what it was doing to the bass and drums. Oh, and mostly from not knowing what I am doing.

Jim Kinney
Cincinnati, OH

[craig boychuk]

j.hall wrote on Wed, 03 November 2004 13:55

calibrate??????????? what is that????????????????

I have to adjust level pots for the L and R of each subgroup to make sure that when I route something that is panned dead center to the sub, it stays in the center. Maybe the console needs cleaning or something, but I always have to check this 'cause there's always one or two subs that are a wee bit lopsided. I guess it's an idiosyncracy of my gear. Probably other consoles (like yours) are a little more easy-going. Frankly, I don't see why there is even the option to adjust the gain of each side independantly. So far I can't think of any practical use for it, other than adding an extra step of cal for me. Whatever.  

Anyway, I will try this bass trick of yours right away. Seems like maybe it could be a good problem solver for many situations.
Do you tend to be hitting the comp on the drum buss pretty hard, or not so much? Do you find that routing the bass over works well no matter what the compression settings?

[bloodstone]

I used to avoid mixing with subs and compressing subs like the plague.  Then my group did a CD with a producer and he mixed everything with subs.  I got exposure to it, but still wasn't convinced.  I went off on a compress the channel rampage for quite some time, and got the best results I've ever gotten.  But I only have about 10 channels of compressors I really like, so I've been experimenting with group compression.  Tried the limiter of a DVC on a drum group, then assigned the snare uncompressed to the main buss.  That worked pretty well. I've also experimented with Drawmer 1969, RNC & a pair of Joe Meek VC6Q on groups.  Decent results, but I think if you have enough comps, it's better to go the channel route.  At least for me and the way I work.  I have been getting excellent results putting an Avalon 747sp on the main out before I send it into the PC to print a 24 bit wave file.  

[j.hall]

my dbx 162 is fixed.....my 162 is fixed!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

my drum sub will be happy!!!

[jkmixer]

Congrats on the 162 repair. It always seems when a piece of gear returns I like it even more.

What comp and/or feel do you try to get on get guitars?  I have been trying to get an 1176-type thing I read Jim Scott talking about when tracking a Tom Petty record for the clean to fairly dirty/overdrive guitars?

Thanks,

Jim Kinney

[j.hall]

i like opto compression on guitars.

LA-3's are the coolest for a guitar buss.

but that's just me.

to me opto's are very smooth and that's good for guitars.  i just give it a few db of comp and let it do it's thing.

[Joel Hamilton]

If I use a 2 mix comp it ismy 33609. If I wind up with a drum sub at all it is in mono and run on a send, out to some compressor (the EH NY2A has been kicking butt lately for me) and I will nail the crap out of the center image stuff like the kick and snare, with maybe a little bit of the toms in there. This enables me to get a sum/difference box type thing happening with the phasey stereo information out at the "edges" of the stereo feild without smearing the center image. I have been really digging the NY2A for this a lot, just kicking the crap out of the kick and snare. Amazing.

[drumsound]

I do a lot of parallel groups.  A drum group (often an RNC on normal mode), an electric guitar group (often a Joe Meek SC2.2).  Acoustic guitar on an ART Pro VLA, which?s something I tried this week and it worked great.  Bass group (DI and Mic I'm liking Ashley SC-50--Thanks J Hall).  I've even been doing a vocal parallel with the VLA, the Meek or a Mindprint T-comp.