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[whatever]

a project that i engineered just got mastered by a very well known mastering engineer at a very well known firm... i received the reference as a single 400MB 16/44.1 wav file via ftp.  when i open it in peak or import it into a session in protools, it is FULL of clipped peaks and there are audible clicks at some of the overs that happen in the quieter parts.  i just want to know if i need to yell at somebody or if something could have happened in the transfer from them to me (or if a lackey who was assigned the task of getting this stuff up on the internet could have fucked it up somehow).  the band's manager is having the mastering house check into it but i just thought i'd ask around...

also, does anyone know of any good forensics tools for mac osx?  i just want something that will count the clipped samples in this file for me....

thanks...

[bblackwood]

If the data had come through with patches of noise (like full scale noise), then I'd say you can attribute it to some sort of transfer error. The fact that it's happening at peaks leads me to believe you are simply the latest victim of the mastering mafia...

IME, FTP is a very stable method of transfer.

[dcollins]

whatever wrote on Fri, 08 October 2004 00:50

a project that i engineered just got mastered by a very well known mastering engineer at a very well known firm...

How well known?

I'm with B-rad that you got all the data you paid for.  FTP works.

DC

[whatever]

btw, i found the tool i was looking for, and between my math and its math i figure that, on average, there are 52 clipped samples for every second of audio.  is this the norm now?  

[whatever]

dcollins wrote on Fri, 08 October 2004 17:06

whatever wrote on Fri, 08 October 2004 00:50 a project that i engineered just got mastered by a very well known mastering engineer at a very well known firm... How well known? I'm with B-rad that you got all the data you paid for.  FTP works. DC

i'm not trying to tarnish anyone's name so i won't say who it is or who they work for.   but trust me when i say that it's one of the top names in mastering in the US.

just trying to figure out whether or not to put up a fight about this. the record has already gone to the plant and i would be starting a huge shit storm... but the manager of the band has told me that he will 'halt the presses' if it's really that important.  the problem is that normally i'm present for mastering and the engineer will hand me a reference... in this case all i have is this big wav file and i'm not sure that what i'm hearing is what is actually going to manufacturing.  so if i raise a big stink about it and it turns out to be nothing then all of a sudden I'M the jackass. also, i'm not the one paying for this.... my only stake in it is that my name is under the 'engineered by' credit in the record.  

hmmmm.

[TotalSonic]

First off - before getting steamed I'd give them the benefit of the doubt.  Maybe ask to get Fedex'ed a reference disc for approval just to be sure that you're not barking up the wrong tree.  Maybe something freaky happened when you opened the wav in PT.

2nd off - digital overs to the point where it causes clicks and pops is NOT acceptable work from ANY ME as far as I am concerned. If these do indeed do exist on the reference disc then I think the artist should ask them to redo the master at no additional charge to them so they aren't on there.  Plenty of the ME's posting here are quite capable of getting a loud master without even squaring off tops of wav forms and definitely without adding clicks and pops (a part of our jobs is to remove these things fer cryin' out loud!)

Best regards,
Steve Berson

[dcollins]

whatever wrote on Fri, 08 October 2004 14:52

i'm not trying to tarnish anyone's name so i won't say who it is or who they work for.

Even if they are doing crap work, in the guise of A List Mastering?  It's a potential public service!

Quote:

but trust me when i say that it's one of the top names in mastering in the US.

No doubt.  Although today, any guy in his bedroom can generate this kind of clipping.....

Quote:

but the manager of the band has told me that he will 'halt the presses' if it's really that important.

It's a tough call.  Clearly, if you have a chance to hear the  "real" ref, it's a good thing for your sanity.  As far as sales, this crackling-popping-brain-piercing distortion has never been shown to do anything but generate lengthy webboard discussions.

DC

[jazzius]

I'd let it slide.

But i've got to ask, why was this top-gun ME chosen if you don't like his style of mastering?

If the management or band chose the ME, and they don't hear the distortion or over compression/limiting, i'd definately let it slide if you don't want to make yourself unpopular. Sad but true.

[bblackwood]

whatever wrote on Fri, 08 October 2004 16:52

just trying to figure out whether or not to put up a fight about this. the record has already gone to the plant and i would be starting a huge shit storm... but the manager of the band has told me that he will 'halt the presses' if it's really that important.

Get a ref and if it is the same (which I'll bet it is), have them recut it. Regardless of who cut it, that's unacceptable.

I still insist we fight for sound quality - somebody's got to have standards and letting things slide will do nothing but perpetuate our current situation.

[turtletone]

How about just getting on the phone and calling the ME and voicing your concerns directly to him. maybe there is some kind of problem in uploading that they don't realize yet. Maybe the "parts engineer, or production engineer" screwed up the ME's work. There are a few things that could have gone wrong and maybe not necessarily on purpose, or maybe it was. The point is you'll never know unless you ask the man himself. I don't know any ME that won't pick up the phone if they know someone isn't happy.

[dcollins]

bblackwood wrote on Sat, 09 October 2004 04:59

Get a ref and if it is the same (which I'll bet it is), have them recut it. Regardless of who cut it, that's unacceptable.

Well, I agree, but it has certainly become acceptable.

On the way home from work tonight, the radio went from the new Alanis to Joni Mitchell, and I could see just how far we've come in  communicating music to the listener.  

One sounds like sssssszzzzzzzsssssstt (quiet verse) ssssszzzzzzzztttsssssss (quiet bridge) ssssssszzzzzzzst.

The other reached right of the speaker and positively _made_ you listen to it.

DC

[TotalSonic]

dcollins wrote on Sun, 10 October 2004 06:50

On the way home from work tonight, the radio went from the new Alanis to Joni Mitchell, and I could see just how far we've come in  communicating music to the listener.   One sounds like sssssszzzzzzzsssssstt (quiet verse) ssssszzzzzzzztttsssssss (quiet bridge) ssssssszzzzzzzst. The other reached right of the speaker and positively _made_ you listen to it. DC

Boy - the guy running the Optimod must have been asleep cause he was supposed to "fix" that Joni track too!  
   

[bobkatz]

TotalSonic wrote on Sun, 10 October 2004 02:40

Boy - the guy running the Optimod must have been asleep cause he was supposed to "fix" that Joni track too!

That is funny! But to add a serious note, the Optimods aren't going away, the cause of the problem is US. If mastering engineers keep on making this message:

IT WILL SOUND BETTER ON THE RADIO. IT WILL SOUND BETTER ON THE RADIO. IT WILL SOUND BETTER ON THE RADIO (subliminally repeated like a George Bush litany)

then eventually A&R and the musicians will get the idea.

I've been getting some praise lately from both the record company and the recording engineer of how nicely a salsa master I made is performing on New York Radio compared to its competition. So, DC is right, it can be done, if we "roll back".

BK

[Bob Olhsson]

dcollins wrote on Sun, 10 October 2004 00:50

The other reached right of the speaker and positively _made_ you listen to it.

I just keep telling people to compare VH-1 with MTV so they can experience how wimpy most new stuff sounds.