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Author Topic: C414 "Comb" version  (Read 3082 times)

gtoledo3

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Re: C414 "Comb" version
« Reply #15 on: August 19, 2021, 05:10:55 PM »

Point taken Klaus, and thanks David, Brad.

I was looking into something else today and happened to notice a document that clarifies something above:

https://www.akg.com/on/demandware.static/-/Sites-masterCatalog_Harman/default/dwab2b98cc/pdfs/CMSE.pdf

So, correcting/amplifying a point above; “E” stands for XLR connector, 100% certainty. 

At some point after the initial C451, the AKG catalogs begin to list AKG C451C as well as C451E, in addition to CB, EB, and 452 variants. The catalog description states that C in this position (post numbering) is a DIN connection, E is XLR.

I may put all of the substantiation of the points mentioned earlier in the thread, in a dropbox folder or on imgur at some point.

edit: Oh, I now see the attachment field I failed to notice earlier. Many points were covered, I’ll try to post some of the more relevant stuff in the near future. And it is nice to see even earlier examples David!
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David Satz

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Re: C414 "Comb" version
« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2021, 04:11:03 PM »

E = export = XLR
C = continental = Tuchel (back then)
L = Lemo for the ÖRF (Austrian national broadcasting network)

which could be combined with:
B = bass control (low-cut switch)

so EB = microphone with XLR output and low-cut switch

452 = 451 with one resistor different, so that current draw at 48 Volts would be somewhat reduced (it was about 5.5 mA for the C 451, back when the DIN standard was still 2 mA maximum). However, as a result the 452 requires 48 Volt powering, whereas the 451 could accept 9 - 52 Volts. And even the 452 required ca. 3 mA. Back then, AKG and Schoeps' Colette system were like "outlaws" until the DIN standard was revised to allow a maximum of 10 mA/microphone at 48 Volts.
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gtoledo3

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Re: C414 "Comb" version
« Reply #17 on: March 04, 2022, 09:52:07 AM »

I was reminded of this thread today when looking at these fraudulent Reverb listings for C4 heads and brass CK12.

The seller has obviously taken a red band CK12 from one of the C4 heads they have for sale, and is choosing to inaccurately describe it as from C12/251: https://reverb.com/item/51525768-akg-brass-ck-12-red-band-c12-251-capsule-1960s-brass

In my book these should be at a much lower price, and definitely not described this way.

And here are the C4 heads…for some reason with “Teflon” CK12. What a “coincidence”!

https://reverb.com/item/51541818-akg-ck-4-stereo-pair-figure-8-ldc-for-c28-c60-c61-451-pristine-mates-early-teflon-ck12
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panman

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Re: C414 "Comb" version
« Reply #18 on: March 04, 2022, 11:00:28 AM »

And here are the C4 heads…for some reason with “teflon” CK12. What a “coincidence”!

https://reverb.com/item/51541818-akg-ck-4-stereo-pair-figure-8-ldc-for-c28-c60-c61-451-pristine-mates-early-teflon-ck12

Oh yes, surely a "coincidence" just like the mad price.
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Esa Tervala

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Re: C414 "Comb" version
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2022, 02:00:32 PM »

Did the CK4 head ever come with brass ring capsules? I thought it only ever came with the nylon ones.

Either way that listing is taking the mickey. There was a seller on UK eBay a couple of weeks ago who auctioned three pairs of CK4 heads, I think only one of the auctions went above £1k.
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gtoledo3

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Re: C414 "Comb" version
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2022, 04:40:52 PM »

It’s my understanding that they only ever had brass CK12 though if you sent something back to AKG for repair they would often just replace it with the newer simple capsule.

I’m about 99% sure anyone takes the time to look through the catalogs and years they will also notice that the only time that a CK4 was available was for a very short period, and it was years before any akg mic came with the “nylon” simplified version. iirc.
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Peller

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Re: C414 "Comb" version
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2022, 05:27:28 PM »

The Saturn Sound website states that the CK4 had nylon ring CK12s, and I'm sure I have read that elsewhere too. Never seen one in the flesh though.

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gtoledo3

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Re: C414 "Comb" version
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2022, 06:51:56 PM »

I’m noting that I see C4 heads in the 1978 catalog, concurrent with models that had brass CK12.

By 1981, there is finally a 414EB-P48. There is also still the C4 head available.

The general thought is that the nylon capsule started with the P48, or the earliest maybe still had brass.

So there is possibly some overlap with C4 production and nylon capsule, possibly not.

The first years of production would not have been during the era where nylon ck12 were available with all due respect to Saturn Sound’s statement. When people first figured out that you could get brass CK12 out of C4 they went nuts. I have never heard of a nylon capsule being in there stock, but I guess it’s possible.

If anyone has an empty C4 minus capsule they’d like to get rid of for a reasonable price feel free to reach out. For awhile there was a company named Chameleon Labs which also made a compatible LDC head, but you rarely see them either.
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klaus

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Re: C414 "Comb" version
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2022, 07:28:44 PM »

Some historic AKG (capsule) facts:
The brass ring CK12 capsule which was installed in C414EB starting in 1976 was replaced in mid-to-late 1978 with the Nylon version for the rest of the model run.

As far as my records indicate, all other LD mics using a CK12 were also transitioned at that time to the Nylon version, therefore by definition the C414EB-P48, which was introduced in 1980 used the Nylon capsule.
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Klaus Heyne
German Masterworks®
www.GermanMasterworks.com

gtoledo3

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Re: C414 "Comb" version
« Reply #24 on: June 24, 2022, 08:49:58 PM »

Glad for the clarification on that.
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