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Author Topic: help needed moving from ITB to OTB !!  (Read 4966 times)

blackfinder

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help needed moving from ITB to OTB !!
« on: October 22, 2013, 02:47:08 PM »

hello guys, here Fausto from Italy !
planning to move to fill ITB setup to OTB hybrid environment, so i would get your fair POV about my actual prevailing plan of action...

let's go, that's actually i have:

preamp...
forssell SMP-2
avalon 2022
mc audio lab PE1 http://www.mcaudiolab.com/index.php/...item/123-pe1tp
hand built custom tube ch strip from Sicily's friends, with lundhal in/out, DI, and pultec style eq

eq...
api 5500

comp...
avalon ad 2044

mics...
pearlman TM1, 2x akg 414 xls, 2x sm 57, akg D12 60ohm, md412 old model, neumann km84i

converter...
apogee symphony 8 analog I/O, 8 digital I/O, actually used by usb connection.

speakers...
eve audio sc207
big pair of infinity K series 8.2i (4ways, 30cm woofers) with proton preamp/poweramp for hi-fi reference.

daw, soft and plugs most used...
mac with 2 x 22" displays, euphonix control+mix, using mostly logic pro and PT10, sonnox, altiverb, softube tube tech, slate VBC + VTM, xln addictive drums,

room, 4 x 4 x 2,7 mt, not really ideal room but i heavily treated and not so bad, also for that big infinity woofers.


so now the moves i would make...
i'm considering to getting some stuffs from a lab that builds classic gear clones and more:

preamp...
sell avalon 2022
keep forssell SMP-2
keep mc audio lab PE1 tube ch strip, and maybe get a second one (due to great price)
add 2x neve 1073 style preamps, top list are heritage audio DMA73 (preamp only) and aurora GTQ2 mk3 (that has also EQ!)
add 2x api 512 clones
reason: would have 4 main flavors: clean detailed forssell, versatile tube sound, neve sound, api sound

eq...
keep api 5500
add a pair of hand built pultec eq
add a hand built 8200/barry porter/sontec 250 clone
reason: would have tube passive eq, character full api eq, neutral "tight" sounding eq

comp...
sell avalon ad 2044
get a pair of hand built 1176 rev.D clone
get a thermionic phoenix similar beast, hand built half the price, vary-mu style comp
get a LA2A hand built replica
get a SSL bus comp hand built replica with DBX black cans
get a pair of chandler LTD2 enhanced version (2254 style)
get a used api 2500
reason: the most evident difference i heard around of ITB compression is that it sounds like a "good picture of reality", but "eat always something! the real compressor is more 3D, deep and mirroring better how reality is... correct me if i'm wrong :-)

mics...
keeps all (pearlman TM1, 2x akg 414 xls, 2x sm 57, akg D12 60ohm, md421 old model, neumann km84i)
add some mics but not sure what! :-))
i'd like to record drums with not so many mics (6-8), record room is small so...
reason: i'm a bit confused here!, so really good advices needed here !! read below about "ROOM"...

converter...
keep apogee symphony 8 analog I/O, 8 digital I/O,
get another 8ch symphony card, or a affective low budget modded behringer ada8000
reason: would switch OTB to a 16ch summing box made upon neumann 475 card, so i think 16 ch is better than just 8 ch when summing complex mixes.

speakers...
keep eve audio sc207 (translating well considering my room)
keep infinity K series 8.2i for hi-fi reference (i always note that on a 4way system it's very hard to let them sound balanced, but when you do it, every mix really sings !
add avantone active pair, sometime i miss the "radio box" sound to check what happens...does them will avoid me keeping to go in the car to listen for few adjustments ? :-))

daw, soft and plugs...
keep mac with 2 x 22" displays
keep euphonix's
plugs: maybe sellimg some plugs i dont need anymore due to the hardware i getting ? please advice me!
reason: i just build up a clone of sterling modular artist series console to housing outboards and daw controllers... great job of a carpenter friend!

room, 4 x 4 x 2,7 mt,
keep calm on it for now, cause i planning to treat and use the adjacent room (almost same size, just not so 4x4 mt) as recording space and actual room as control room.
due to small size, that's why i suppose use many mics on a drum set.
so there will have 2 separate spaces connected by a patch bay.


last but not least, a note about music: i will produce pop rock blues, with real acoustics and also VSTi instruments, probably not more classical and jazz music...
further i would make a decent finalizing mastering process on site, reserving to send more important projects to a great friend mastering engineer.

i tried to be most coincided as possible...
hoping my english was good enough to well expose my ideas, i hope not have u annoyed too much!

please feel free to post your surely competent feedback and advices !
cheers
Fausto
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Jim Williams

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Re: help needed moving from ITB to OTB !!
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2013, 11:24:33 AM »

Got console?
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blackfinder

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Re: help needed moving from ITB to OTB !!
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2013, 12:39:42 PM »

u mean a console to make the summing master bus, or to completely mix on it, without the outboards i listed ?
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Fletcher

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Re: help needed moving from ITB to OTB !!
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2013, 01:57:33 PM »

Jim means -- do you have a full "console"? ...or are you planning on using a "summing buss" outboard thing [I didn't see either listed on your list].

With the amount of outboard you have a full "console" would probably have better facilities for ease of use [like an integrated patchbay]... but you can always configure a patchbay for a "summing buss" [however -- any automation moves you make in the computer will mess with any DAW "post fader" compression applications as you'd be moving the input level to the compressor.

Make sense?

Peace
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CN Fletcher

mwagener wrote on Sat, 11 September 2004 14:33
We are selling emotions, there are no emotions in a grid


"Recording engineers are an arrogant bunch
If you've spent most of your life with a few thousand dollars worth of musicians in the studio, making a decision every second and a half... and you and  they are going to have to live with it for the rest of your lives, you'll get pretty arrogant too.  It takes a certain amount of balls to do that... something around three"
Malcolm Chisholm

blackfinder

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Re: help needed moving from ITB to OTB !!
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2013, 02:24:02 PM »

ah ok... nope, no console here...

i talked about the summing thing into "converter" ...
keep apogee symphony 8 analog I/O, 8 digital I/O,
get another 8ch symphony card, or a affective low budget modded behringer ada8000

reason: would switch OTB to a 16ch summing box made upon neumann 475 card, so i think 16 ch is better than just 8 ch when summing complex mixes.

maybe i should edit the post making a separate line about this point...
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Fletcher

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Re: help needed moving from ITB to OTB !!
« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2013, 12:11:05 PM »

Probably better... if the Neumann cards are set up correctly they should do the job without a struggle.

Peace
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CN Fletcher

mwagener wrote on Sat, 11 September 2004 14:33
We are selling emotions, there are no emotions in a grid


"Recording engineers are an arrogant bunch
If you've spent most of your life with a few thousand dollars worth of musicians in the studio, making a decision every second and a half... and you and  they are going to have to live with it for the rest of your lives, you'll get pretty arrogant too.  It takes a certain amount of balls to do that... something around three"
Malcolm Chisholm

blackfinder

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Re: help needed moving from ITB to OTB !!
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2013, 02:36:26 PM »

what u mean "if the Neumann cards are set up correctly" ?   ???
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Jim Williams

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Re: help needed moving from ITB to OTB !!
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2013, 12:07:20 PM »

Ut oh.
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Fletcher

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Re: help needed moving from ITB to OTB !!
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2013, 01:27:58 PM »

what u mean "if the Neumann cards are set up correctly" ?   ???

I mean like getting the passive network correct [as in load to the input to the summing amplifiers]… grounding, if there is a way to bias the amplifiers, getting that right, power supply [!!!], etc., etc., etc.

Who ever is building it for you will hopefully know what they're doing and get it right on the first try.

Peace
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CN Fletcher

mwagener wrote on Sat, 11 September 2004 14:33
We are selling emotions, there are no emotions in a grid


"Recording engineers are an arrogant bunch
If you've spent most of your life with a few thousand dollars worth of musicians in the studio, making a decision every second and a half... and you and  they are going to have to live with it for the rest of your lives, you'll get pretty arrogant too.  It takes a certain amount of balls to do that... something around three"
Malcolm Chisholm
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