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[OTR-jkl]

Please give me some recommendations for a pair of entry level mastering-quality monitors.

I just found out how narrow (freq. spectrum - wise) my monitors are so I'm going to start the hunt for a decent pair to get started with. I don't have the budget or the room for anything top-end. I will likely need to get a desktop type. I have a Hafler P1500 amp I can use or if an active pair proves better then that might be the way to go.

All I really know of so far are models like the Dynaudio Acoustics BM6 or BM6A, ADAM P Series, B&W Nautilus 805 (doubt those are very entry-level).

Any others I should look at?
Thnx.

[Level]

http://www.4sptech.com

These tell you what you are working with. Flat to 30hz

[jfrigo]

Do you have a budget range? Quested H108 with a small REL Strata sub is a great setup.

Even if you are going to get small monitors, at least a little sub should be a serious consideration. You need to know what's happening down low for mastering. If a mixer gets his low end out of control becuse he's using small speakers in a less than optimal room, you can't compound the errors and hope to get it right. You need to catch the problems, not have the same ones.

Other names to consider for smaller monitors that are high quality include ATC, ProAc, and as you already mentioned, possible Dynaudio or B&W.

[Roland Storch]

After comparing a lot of monitors in that range I think more and more the PMC TB2 are great passive monitors for about 1000,-

[OTR-jkl]

Thanks for the input.

Jay - I agree with you about the sub. I will likely add one at some point. How do you know what will complement your chosen monitors? Also, I can't find anything about the ATCs you mentioned. Do you have a link or more specific info? My price range for the mains will have to stay under $1000 for the pair.

Roland - I looked at the TB2s and they look very interesting. How do they sound in comparison to others you tried? What do you like/dislike about them?

Bill - Those look impressive but are waaaaay out of my range for now...


Anyone have any other suggestions?

[Oldfart]

I doubt you'll find anything from ATC for your budget.

I'm working with the Dyns BM6As, and I know they're not for everyone, but they do work well for me. I must ad that I did ad the BX30A sub(more expensive then my BM6As!!), but that was purely personal. They were flat down to 36Hz in my room and down to -6 at 30Hz (with a "Smart" system analysis).

I did try the BM6s with my 4B, but prefered to sell my 4B and get the active version. Maybe you should consider selling your Hafler to help your budget for an active set of monitors? (just food for thought)

A few people who've visited have pointed out to me how they sounded very close to the B&W 605 but with a different sounding bottom end. And the main reason I bought the Dyn's was because of their resolution down there.

Hope this helps

Oldfart

[Level]

For your price range and to have full range sound, you can look at the offerings from Blue sky. 2 months ago I was introduced to the smaller set (5" 2 way with sub) and my material over them was very very close to what I am used to.

[jfrigo]

OTR-jkl wrote on Thu, 02 September 2004 15:15

can't find anything about the ATCs you mentioned. Do you have a link or more specific info? My price range for the mains will have to stay under $1000 for the pair.

I don't know what atc's website is, but here's a US dealer:
http://www.patkeoghsound.com/
I'm not familiar with the company, but they have atc info on the site. Unfortunately, atc is outside the budget you metnion, as are most of the other possibilities I mentioned. The speakers I might recommend in that range tend to be small and you'd really want a sub, or to get a larger speaker, you'd be into something with less resolution. There are compromises to be made. The lower end Dynaudios may indeed be the best option at this time, but they are a bit of a compromise as well. In the hifi world, a set of original Sonus Faber Concertinos would just fit the budget, but I think the newer model is more money and frankly not as good. The update goes more for a pretty sound than a true sound. Also, the Concertino is pretty small, though has impressive bass for its size. A site like Audiogon or even eBay may have a pair come up if you keep an eye out.

[ken_m]

Has anyone tried the Thiel line or Thiel CS2.2's?  

[Riccardo]

I'll second the Hafler TB2+ combination.
The + is for the new version with soft domed tweeter, revised transmission line (mostly the bitumastic material inside the cabinet) and revised crossover I believe.
Just personal preference of course. They are obviously far from being a full range system as they are nearfields but much clearer and truer than BM5, BM6 and even BM15, even if you do not like transmission lines.

[TotalSonic]

ken_m wrote on Fri, 03 September 2004 06:41

Has anyone tried the Thiel line or Thiel CS2.2's?

Soundbyte (which focuses primarily on editing/mastering classical) where I've done some work has Thiel CS3.5's.  Very very detailed, nice image, maybe a tiny bit forward on the highs.  Thiels tend to be harder to drive than a lot of monitors - so don't skimp on the amp with them - and I think they sound better in larger rooms - I wouldn't recommend them if you were in a tight space.  If you were primarily working with rock and hip-hop I think there are better choices out there as I don't think they handle dynamics of lots of low end as well as some other choices and they can be a little bit fatiguing in the highs. Still - I think they are overall pretty accurate.

Audiogon.com often has very decent deals on Thiels - if someone was on a budget I think  a pair supplemented with a subwoofer would actually make a nice mastering rig - although you might find you'd want to upgrade after a while.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

[jlarcombe]

I also use the TB2/P1500 combination, and have been very pleased with it. Obviously this is not a 'full range' solution but the bass feels well controlled and decisions seem to translate well. I've noticed a slight 'bump' in the lower mids but nothing too drastic and certainly something one can learn to accommodate (which seems fair enough at the price).

I haven't heard the TB2+. Has anyone compared them side-by-side with the older model?

James.

[ken_m]

Thanks Steve for the info on the Thiels.  Wasn't trying to hi-jack your thread OTR-jkl.  

Ken

[bblackwood]

Jeff, anytime you have a limited budget, something has to give,  but where you make that concession is a personal decision. In monitoring, the expensive aspects can be boiled down to two things, accuracy and extension. In your case, I would buy the most accurate small monitors I could afford and deal with the lack of low end by carefully listening on a variety of systems, learning your speakers and room, even the use of headphones. If you choose to spend your budget getting some 'ok' monitors so you can afford an 'ok' sub, you simply end up with a full-range system that won't grow with you.

My .02...

[OTR-jkl]

Wow! Thanks for all the input guys. I really appreciate the help.

bblackwood wrote on Fri, 03 September 2004 10:11

...I would buy the most accurate small monitors I could afford and deal with the lack of low end by carefully listening on a variety of systems, learning your speakers and room,...

Brad, that is my philosophy going into this. My small room size won't really allow the bottom end to fully develop anyway so I have to really listen close to whats going on down there and also take it with me to other places to see how it stacks up.

Quote:

If you choose to spend your budget getting some 'ok' monitors so you can afford an 'ok' sub, you simply end up with a full-range system that won't grow with you.

I've been w/o a sub so far and have been getting somewhat close with monitors that roll off pretty fast below 80Hz so I figure if I get some that are good down into the 40 or 50Hz range then I'm that much better off.

Brad, what do you consider to be 'ok' monitors? Do some of the ones mentioned fit into that category. Is it the price range I'm in that makes them just 'ok'? Given my situation and what you said, what would you suggest?


I'm getting more interested in the TB2s. How do they sound and translate? Is the TB2/P1500 a reasonably flat combo? Speaking of the P1500, how does it really stack up as a reference amp? Is there another choice that's better?

Thanks again everybody...