R/E/P Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: 1 [2]  All   Go Down

Author Topic: How to clean up this M7 capsule  (Read 7416 times)

gkippola

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 27
  • Real Full Name: gerald kippola
Re: How to clean up this M7 capsule
« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2011, 05:21:16 pm »

Alcohol, water, should never be used for cleaning diaphragms. Trichloroethane is a non-polar solvent that has been used for decades as a cleaner for sensitive electronics, removes organics, water, oils, grease--  Anyone here have experience with it for mic capsule component cleaning? 
Logged

Tim Campbell

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 23
Re: How to clean up this M7 capsule
« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2011, 08:00:09 pm »

Do you mean methyl chloroform or vinyl trichloride? Trichloroethane is a name used for both of these substances.
Demineralized water is THE most used liquid for cleaning capsules. Most of the debris deposited on membranes arrives there suspended in one form of water or another and unlike the gold that you don't want to remove is water soluable.
Logged

gkippola

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 27
  • Real Full Name: gerald kippola
Re: How to clean up this M7 capsule
« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2011, 03:15:00 pm »

I have seen gold fall off with the use of water. 1,1,1,TCE is a proven solvent for fragile electronics and many types of film, and film plastics. Very delicate stuff.  There are new solvents vying for the replacement of TCE, because it has been discontinued because of ozone depletion restrictions. Can't blv there isn't a better understanding of this stuff, it is very frustrating. Those in the know won't speak.
Logged

klaus

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1604
Re: How to clean up this M7 capsule
« Reply #18 on: November 27, 2011, 06:25:35 pm »

You responded quite strongly to one person's negative opinion of this solvent. I have used it for many years, and quite successfully, in the course of capsule cleaning.

But the looming issue of ozone depletion is one that needs to be investigated further. For example, can 111 TCE  be properly re-used, cleaned, and in the end recycled? What is the absolute harm to our ozone layer of this chemical in comparison to say, ozone depleting chemicals used in air conditioning?

The one feature that is so attractive about 111TCE is also the one feature that now causes environmental headaches: its volatility.
Logged
Klaus Heyne
German Masterworks®
www.GermanMasterworks.com

Tim Campbell

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 23
Re: How to clean up this M7 capsule
« Reply #19 on: November 28, 2011, 09:47:37 am »

Water in and of itself cannot remove gold from a membrane. You may have seen gold flake off a membrane with water on it when abrasion from a brush or other utensil was applied. I'm sure the rubbing removed any poorly adhered gold and not the water.

gkippola, you mentioned wanting to clean CK1 capsules. These membranes are only held in place by glue at the edge of the membrane. Since one of the described uses for trichloroethane is dissolving glue it might not be the best choice. It's other descibed use is as a degreaser. You won't find much grease or oil on a capsule membrane unless someone has been touching it with their fingers.

If Klaus says this compound is useful for cleaning capsules I accept that as fact.

In my more than 10 years experience cleaning capsules I have found that the mildest agents and least abrasion necessary to clean the capsule the better. As David Josephson has stated before, if you can't afford to lose the membrane or aren't capable of repairing it if it gets damaged you shouldn't try cleaning it.
Logged

gkippola

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 27
  • Real Full Name: gerald kippola
Re: How to clean up this M7 capsule
« Reply #20 on: November 29, 2011, 01:00:12 pm »

Thanks much for the reply Klaus-  indeed it would be beneficial to be able to recycle TCE, precisely that is being done with other solvents which have been used as replacements.  Being that TCE is non-polar, a simple test of conductivity might provide at least a ballpark indication of it's contamination.  A method for the evaluation of the dissolved contaminants, and a method for removing them from the solvent--a redistillation probably- but in a strictly controlled industrial environment.I would be interested in knowing what materials to stay away from with TCE.
And Tim, one of the attributes of this solvent is that it evaporates quickly w/o a trace. Glues can remain unaffected by the quick action, unless you want to do an immersion in an ultrasonic bath, and knowing what the reactivity might be can alleviate issues.  I have had factory CK1, and B&K diaphragms come loose just thru normal use and contamination-
Logged

panman

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 58
Re: How to clean up this M7 capsule
« Reply #21 on: November 29, 2011, 04:51:20 pm »

I would be interested in knowing what materials to stay away from with TCE.

Ha, that thread made me lough. Memories of my mother removing chewing gum from my hair with TCE come to my mind from the childhood. So that certainly is one :).
Logged
Esa Tervala

klaus

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1604
Re: How to clean up this M7 capsule
« Reply #22 on: November 29, 2011, 05:27:25 pm »

...and I should apologize if anyone reading this thread is coming away from it not much smarter than before:

There are proprietary issues involved in the proper process of cleaning a capsule to a professional level. Some of these processes and issues have been acquired by practitioners over decades of hard work and countless screw-ups. That investment needs to be recouped, rather than given away.
Logged
Klaus Heyne
German Masterworks®
www.GermanMasterworks.com

gkippola

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 27
  • Real Full Name: gerald kippola
Re: How to clean up this M7 capsule
« Reply #23 on: November 30, 2011, 10:28:34 pm »

I send my favorite mics out for proper cleaning, probably always will. I think most do/would do the same. But the budget does not provide for all of them to get a proper job,  I have way too many. I think there are a more than just a few who are in the same boat. There's ample food for discussion on this topic, hopefully it can pick up somewhere. There's a demand for a better understanding of the upkeep of the mic toolbox,
Logged
Pages: 1 [2]  All   Go Up