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[johnR]

Bubba Kron wrote:

every mp3 player/satellite radio/ipod/cable tv reciever/ actual tvs doing all da conversion with own clocks/Satellite tv reciever all have really shitty clocks and da.

True, but with lossy compression schemes the clock is not the main cause of quality degradation. I'd agree that the importance of good clocking is often overlooked when it comes to consumer playback devices for CDs, DVDs and uncompressed (or lossless compressed) files.

[J.J. Blair]

Are different clocks better for different keys?  What's the best clock for a mid tempo song in B minor?

[archtop]

one less than 18 years old

[Bubba#$%Kron]

Gee fellas,some of you just made apparent the true quality of your ears- thats gotta suck man!!!  You cant hear clock differences and your in this business??  Ouch

[J.J. Blair]

Bryan, what you are failing to grasp is the absurdity of your statement.  I don't think anybody is saying that there's no difference between clocks.  But you have entered into gearslutz territory with the "this clock is better for this type of music" idea.  

I guarantee you that mic'ing technique is infinitely more important than knowing what clock to use on what instrument.  

[Bubba#$%Kron]

J.J. Blair wrote on Sat, 02 October 2010 17:49

Bryan, what you are failing to grasp is the absurdity of your statement.  I don't think anybody is saying that there's no difference between clocks.  But you have entered into gearslutz territory with the "this clock is better for this type of music" idea.   I guarantee you that mic'ing technique is infinitely more important than knowing what clock to use on what instrument.

it all comes down to faster and slower sounds, hence the time/clock reference.  I think I can tell just fine on my B&W's myself thank you.    And yes, the mytek clock is suited towards more classical natural sounding music.  If you are doing a jazzy vocal, you will get much better results on a mytek.  Fast repeated drums sounds, c777 gives you a much harder sound (no matter what converter u use). The c7777 is very rhythmic and much more tight. This all a choice on trackling/mixing/ and mastering/bouncing from tape.  There are many clock layers that all makes a difference on the end product.     You think the people who build these things REALLY cant hear the difference themselves, and its all one big joke once you get above a certain level??  That sound like Ethan winer GS BS to me!!  Its one thing to say U cant hear a difference yourself(bummer), but to claim that no one can and anyone claiming to is dillusional Is just silly!!!!  

Thanks,n Bryan

[J.J. Blair]

Please quote where I said nobody can tell the difference.

BTW, I don't need multiple clocks to get great drum sounds.  I do just fine with my AD16Xs.  I guarantee you that my ability to tune a kit, knowing how to mic it, and then picking the right signal path is way more important than what clock I use.  I fact, I don't need multiple clocks to get good any kind of sounds.  And god forbid I'm in a studio and I'm stuck using 192s, I'll still get great fucking sounds.

But if you feel you need multiple clocks on your sessions, then have at it.  Knock yourself out.

Also, AFAIK, clocks do not determine pre-ringing, so if the sounds is fast or not should matter.  

[bob ebeling]

Bryan, JJ has you here.  As usual.

Musicians/songs and ENGINEERING is everything.

Clock freaks think there were no records made between 1995 and 2005?  

Radiohead Kid A.  

[compasspnt]

J.J. Blair wrote on Sat, 02 October 2010 22:18

I guarantee you that my ability to tune a kit, knowing how to mic it, and then picking the right signal path is way more important than what clock I use.

And of course, the choice of drummer is even more important than any of that.

[compasspnt]

Bubba, are you either from West Virginia, or drummer?

I agree the 777 clock in the Apogee is a good one though.

[J.J. Blair]

compasspnt wrote on Sun, 03 October 2010 10:17

J.J. Blair wrote on Sat, 02 October 2010 22:18 I guarantee you that my ability to tune a kit, knowing how to mic it, and then picking the right signal path is way more important than what clock I use. And of course, the choice of drummer is even more important than any of that.

Terry, which is why in my original post, I said song and performance were most important.

And I'm sure Terry is tired of me bringing it up, but I will bring it up again, just to make the point:

Al Green.

Those are some of the most terribly recorded records I've ever heard, from a stand point of fidelity.  Poor Terry had to mix them, and get them to sound listenable.  

Lucky for him, the songs are AMAZING.  And the performances are some of the best ever.  And you know what?  Those songs still get played, everywhere you go.  And nobody complains about the fact that the tape machine was probably misaligned, or the mic pres sucked, etc.  Fidelity wise, I bet those records would have sounded better on black faced ADATs, than whatever contraption was going on over there.

Or ask Bob Ohlsson about the nightmares of recording at Motown.  

So really, for me, as a producer, the first question is ALWAYS "is the song good enough?"  Not "what's the best clock for this song?"  And then, it figuring out the right parts, the right performance, the right sounds, etc.  I know when a sound works, or when it doesn't, and the clock is never in the equation for me.  NEVER.  

I have converters that work for me, within my budget, and they sound great.  How much better would things sound is I used Prizm converts and an atomic clock?  I'm sure I would be able to hear an improvement.  But do I dislike what I have now?  No.

Do people complain about the sound quality that comes out of my place?  No.

Do any of the clients, or professional engineers that come in here ask what additional clocks I have?  No.

Does not knowing the sound of different clocks make me a bad engineer?  No.

What makes me a good engineer is that I can make sounds that are musical, and work for the material, no matter what the circumstances are.  And when I'm in another studio, or considering another studio, the first five things I consider about their gear does not include the word clock.  

So, for me, clock is NOT everything.

[Chris Kress]

Clock is one thing... one of many things....  that all need to work together in a studio.  I am mixing a great album where none of those many things were there.  So it takes me three time as long to pull the greatness out.  How well would these musicians have played in a better environment? How great would the recording have been in a better environment..  Don't poo poo the clock.  It is one of many factors..

[J.J. Blair]

I never said it was "nothing."  I just said that "it's not everything," which is the title of the thread.

I was also refuting the notion that those of us who don't use different converters for their different characteristics are not good engineers, or that we can't hear.

[bigbone]

compasspnt wrote on Sun, 03 October 2010 13:17

J.J. Blair wrote on Sat, 02 October 2010 22:18 I guarantee you that my ability to tune a kit, knowing how to mic it, and then picking the right signal path is way more important than what clock I use. And of course, the choice of drummer is even more important than any of that.

Voice of a wise and experience mind speak the truth.............

JN

[compasspnt]

...said the great drummer...