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[YZ]

I can't watch the FOX cable TV channel (Brazil) anymore... their audio is passing thru some processor with all wrong settings, making the shows extremely hard to listen to.

The audio is not over-compressed; but any time a loud sound effect comes, the initial transient gets completely squashed to a level below the dialogue before and then it stays down for several seconds. This is not subtle, it is around a 10dB drop that stays down for several seconds making the subsequent dialogue whisper-soft.

It seems that they have some excessive side-chain EQ; high-pitched voices or sibilance also get the processor to clamp down just like with the sound effects. The problem is compounded by a somewhat bright program EQ.

Since contacts via their web page and via my cable service provider were fruitless, I am abandoning the channel; pity because I like some of the shows.

Any of you have similar audio problems with your local cable channels?

[Berolzheimer]

YZ wrote on Fri, 27 August 2010 17:48

I can't watch the FOX cable TV channel (Brazil) anymore... their audio is passing thru some processor with all wrong settings, making the shows extremely hard to listen to. The audio is not over-compressed; but any time a loud sound effect comes, the initial transient gets completely squashed to a level below the dialogue before and then it stays down for several seconds. This is not subtle, it is around a 10dB drop that stays down for several seconds making the subsequent dialogue whisper-soft. It seems that they have some excessive side-chain EQ; high-pitched voices or sibilance also get the processor to clamp down just like with the sound effects. The problem is compounded by a somewhat bright program EQ. Since contacts via their web page and via my cable service provider were fruitless, I am abandoning the channel; pity because I like some of the shows. Any of you have similar audio problems with your local cable channels?

Discovery Channel was sounding that way here a couple years ago- anytime there was an fx or music with any low end, the whole mix, including dialog of course, would get dumped by 10 dB or so.  Made it very hard to watch.  I haven't had TV here for a while so I don't know if it's been fixed.

[Otitis Media]

That's usually a problem with YOUR cable provider, who gets the Fox feed either off a bird or some other way into their head end. From the head end, it gets distributed. Seems like Fox is triggering a limiter somewhere. These kind of shenanigans happen on all cable systems from time to time. They also beat the ever loving shit out of the video signal and sell it back to you as "crystal clear high definition." Didn't know "crystal clear" means "full of codec artifacts"

[grantis]

Otitis Media wrote on Sat, 28 August 2010 06:40

That's usually a problem with YOUR cable provider, who gets the Fox feed either off a bird or some other way into their head end. From the head end, it gets distributed. Seems like Fox is triggering a limiter somewhere. These kind of shenanigans happen on all cable systems from time to time. They also beat the ever loving shit out of the video signal and sell it back to you as "crystal clear high definition." Didn't know "crystal clear" means "full of codec artifacts"

That's why satellite is the way to go.  HD never looked better.

[Otitis Media]

DBS has the same codec issues as cable - there's simply no way to cram so much content into the bandwidth they have. It's why satellite radio sounds so unspeakably bad.

[grantis]

Otitis Media wrote on Sat, 28 August 2010 11:07

It's why satellite radio sounds so unspeakably bad.

Nuh UHHHH.  It's CD quality.

[bblackwood]

grantis wrote on Sat, 28 August 2010 10:33

That's why satellite is the way to go.  HD never looked better.

Depends on where you are - here, Comcast's picture KILLS DirecTV...

[Otitis Media]

I agree with you.

If your CD is burned from 32khz mp3  files.


Seriously, SatRad sound quality is shit, and programming isn't much better than the Lilliputian playlists on terrestrial radio. Oh, and good 'ol FM, with all its processing, KILLLLLLS satellite.

[grantis]

Otitis Media wrote on Sat, 28 August 2010 11:39

I agree with you. If your CD is burned from 32khz mp3  files. Seriously, SatRad sound quality is shit, and programming isn't much better than the Lilliputian playlists on terrestrial radio. Oh, and good 'ol FM, with all its processing, KILLLLLLS satellite.

No, you're wrong.  Satellite radio is the highest fidelity audio stream I've ever heard in my life.

(I'm trying to drench that in as much sarcasm as I can do to the fact that I fell for that sales pitch and now endure poor quality audio, but I feel I've come up short)

I have to disagree about the programming though.  You can LITERALLY listen to anything you want on satellite, whereas local FM is extremely limited, even in music city.

[YZ]

Otitis Media wrote on Sat, 28 August 2010 08:40

That's usually a problem with YOUR cable provider, who gets the Fox feed either off a bird or some other way into their head end. From the head end, it gets distributed. Seems like Fox is triggering a limiter somewhere. These kind of shenanigans happen on all cable systems from time to time. They also beat the ever loving shit out of the video signal and sell it back to you as "crystal clear high definition." Didn't know "crystal clear" means "full of codec artifacts"

Yes, a limiter somewhere; forgive me for the ignorance, but my cable provider offers a lot of channels and FOX seems to be the only one affected...  shouldn't this be happening in more channels?

Also, a broadcast limiter with such a slow release time is normal?

[Randyman...]

YZ wrote on Sat, 28 August 2010 15:51

Yes, a limiter somewhere; forgive me for the ignorance, but my cable provider offers a lot of channels and FOX seems to be the only one affected...  shouldn't this be happening in more channels? Also, a broadcast limiter with such a slow release time is normal?

Could be head-end processing at the RX/Frame Sync or before the signal is MUX'd with other channels and sent out.  The "Limiter" is probably an AGC, and longer time constants are common if the level is all over the place.

I actually work for Fox Network Center, but domestically in the US.  We do provide Fox Sports Middle East from our facility, but I believe you are talking about Fox Sports Brazil - I don't know where the Master Control and Uplink is handled for that feed - but I'd also think this is a local cable/DBS head-end issue as stated.

LKFS audio monitoring in Ingest and Master Control will certainly help to solve some of these level consistency issues - but it is a very slow rollout - and of course the Cable Head Ends can still completely screw it up as is likely the case here.

[YZ]

Randyman... wrote on Sat, 28 August 2010 22:35

YZ wrote on Sat, 28 August 2010 15:51 Yes, a limiter somewhere; forgive me for the ignorance, but my cable provider offers a lot of channels and FOX seems to be the only one affected...  shouldn't this be happening in more channels? Also, a broadcast limiter with such a slow release time is normal? Could be head-end processing at the RX/Frame Sync or before the signal is MUX'd with other channels and sent out.  The "Limiter" is probably an AGC, and longer time constants are common if the level is all over the place. I actually work for Fox Network Center, but domestically in the US.  We do provide Fox Sports Middle East from our facility, but I believe you are talking about Fox Sports Brazil - I don't know where the Master Control and Uplink is handled for that feed - but I'd also think this is a local cable/DBS head-end issue as stated. LKFS audio monitoring in Ingest and Master Control will certainly help to solve some of these level consistency issues - but it is a very slow rollout - and of course the Cable Head Ends can still completely screw it up as is likely the case here.

Thanks, Randy!

Yes, AGCs have longer time constants, I just didn't think that a broadcast AGC would react so strongly to short-term stimuli.

The channel is not Fox Sports, just Fox Brazil - no sports...  carried by TVA.

I'm still receiving in analog.