R/E/P Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: [1] 2 3 4  All   Go Down

Author Topic: Condenser for snare drum  (Read 14311 times)

audiowonderland

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 108
Condenser for snare drum
« on: February 08, 2010, 09:29:28 pm »

What would be a good choice in a condenser mic to use on a snare drum? I am looking for more bite/crack from the snare without having to do major EQ moves at mix time. I am using a 4 mic setup with 2 OH's in a modified Recorderman type of setup plus kick/snare mics.

pete andrews

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 491
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2010, 11:46:28 pm »

not a condenser - but the Heil PR-20 will give you plenty of snap on a snare.

-pete

hargerst

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1458
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2010, 02:15:13 am »

The Beyer M201 is a great snare mic.  A second, less familiar recommendation would be the MXL "Cube" mic.
Logged
Harvey "Is that the right note?" Gerst
Indian Trail Recording Studio

compasspnt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16266
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2010, 08:27:58 am »

The classic snare pencil condenser microphone would be the KM-84, but that's not exactly budget.

Far less costly, you might give the NT-55 a try.
Logged

audiowonderland

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 108
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2010, 08:59:16 am »

compasspnt wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 07:27

The classic snare pencil condenser microphone would be the KM-84, but that's not exactly budget.

Far less costly, you might give the NT-55 a try.



Are those typically used on the batter side or the snare side? Boosting the highs on the OH's brings out what I want to hear. I am wondering if a bottom mic is really what I need. Most of the dymanics I have are boosted around 5k. Would something boosted around 10k be a better choice for a snare bottom mic?

compasspnt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16266
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2010, 09:25:12 am »

If you want information regarding "bottom" snare mics, it should come from someone else, because I do not like them.

The best snare mic is one backed away from the snare...the farther back you get, the better the snare can sound.  But of course, then the more the other drums will blend into that one mic.

Many, including me, like to use one (or maybe two) mics on *the drum kit*...this includes the snare of course.  But the drummer will have to be good enough to balance the kit.

I was referring to using the pencil condenser as a (fairly at least) close snare mic on the top side, in the oft-used individual drum mic'ing technique.
Logged

audiowonderland

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 108
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2010, 09:40:55 am »

compasspnt wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 08:25

If you want information regarding "bottom" snare mics, it should come from someone else, because I do not like them.

The best snare mic is one backed away from the snare...the farther back you get, the better the snare can sound.  But of course, then the more the other drums will blend into that one mic.

Many, including me, like to use one (or maybe two) mics on *the drum kit*...this includes the snare of course.  But the drummer will have to be good enough to balance the kit.

I was referring to using the pencil condenser as a (fairly at least) close snare mic on the top side, in the oft-used individual drum mic'ing technique.



Fair enough. I am using 4 mics for the entire kit and don't necessarily want to add more. I am currently using an sm57 an inch or so above the rim aimed across the batter head. It sounds good, not great, and rejects the hats really well. (They are very low, no more than 4-5" above the rim of the snare) Sounds like you are suggesting that I move that mic away from the drum a bit to capture more of the "drum" instead of just the batter head.

Do you use any type of augmentation/replacement/enhancement at the mix stage? Just trying to understand what makes up the final sound. I have listened to a few of the Widespread Panic albums and like the results I hear on those.(Angels On High in particular) My guess is you don't going with a minimal mic setup. I am a huge fan of capturing instruments/performances as naturally as possible. Not necessarily in vogue these days but I like the results

compasspnt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16266
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2010, 12:08:16 pm »

Audiowonderland wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 09:40

compasspnt wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 08:25

If you want information regarding "bottom" snare mics, it should come from someone else, because I do not like them.

The best snare mic is one backed away from the snare...the farther back you get, the better the snare can sound.  But of course, then the more the other drums will blend into that one mic.

Many, including me, like to use one (or maybe two) mics on *the drum kit*...this includes the snare of course.  But the drummer will have to be good enough to balance the kit.

I was referring to using the pencil condenser as a (fairly at least) close snare mic on the top side, in the oft-used individual drum mic'ing technique.



Fair enough. I am using 4 mics for the entire kit and don't necessarily want to add more. I am currently using an sm57 an inch or so above the rim aimed across the batter head. It sounds good, not great, and rejects the hats really well. (They are very low, no more than 4-5" above the rim of the snare) Sounds like you are suggesting that I move that mic away from the drum a bit to capture more of the "drum" instead of just the batter head.

Do you use any type of augmentation/replacement/enhancement at the mix stage? Just trying to understand what makes up the final sound. I have listened to a few of the Widespread Panic albums and like the results I hear on those.(Angels On High in particular) My guess is you don't going with a minimal mic setup....



On that Panic album, I basically used two microphones for the whole kit, one in the bass drum (47fet) and one over the rest of the instrument (251).  There was also a C12 on the floor toms, just when need for clarity, and an SM7 near the snare used mostly for snare reverb send, but occasionally used if more bite or immediacy needed on snare.

Here is the session report, with photos:

    http://recforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/mv/msg/17672/0/0/ 6490/
Logged

audiowonderland

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 108
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2010, 01:10:25 pm »

compasspnt wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 11:08

Audiowonderland wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 09:40

compasspnt wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 08:25

If you want information regarding "bottom" snare mics, it should come from someone else, because I do not like them.

The best snare mic is one backed away from the snare...the farther back you get, the better the snare can sound.  But of course, then the more the other drums will blend into that one mic.

Many, including me, like to use one (or maybe two) mics on *the drum kit*...this includes the snare of course.  But the drummer will have to be good enough to balance the kit.

I was referring to using the pencil condenser as a (fairly at least) close snare mic on the top side, in the oft-used individual drum mic'ing technique.



Fair enough. I am using 4 mics for the entire kit and don't necessarily want to add more. I am currently using an sm57 an inch or so above the rim aimed across the batter head. It sounds good, not great, and rejects the hats really well. (They are very low, no more than 4-5" above the rim of the snare) Sounds like you are suggesting that I move that mic away from the drum a bit to capture more of the "drum" instead of just the batter head.

Do you use any type of augmentation/replacement/enhancement at the mix stage? Just trying to understand what makes up the final sound. I have listened to a few of the Widespread Panic albums and like the results I hear on those.(Angels On High in particular) My guess is you don't going with a minimal mic setup....



On that Panic album, I basically used two microphones for the whole kit, one in the bass drum (47fet) and one over the rest of the instrument (251).  There was also a C12 on the floor toms, just when need for clarity, and an SM7 near the snare used mostly for snare reverb send, but occasionally used if more bite or immediacy needed on snare.

Here is the session report, with photos:

      http://recforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/mv/msg/17672/0/0/ 6490/




Very Cool. Having read through the first 8 pages or so it would seem you tend to not necessarily put mics right on top of the sources. The drums and horns in particular take advantage of the space they are being played in. I really like that approach. Is that just where things were sounding good that day or is that a preference from all of your experience? I like the idea a lot. My room is fairly dead after I added the necessary traps to deal with a very reverberant small box of a room. Should be fun to try some of this out.

compasspnt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16266
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2010, 01:25:49 pm »

Audiowonderland wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 13:10

...it would seem you tend to not necessarily put mics right on top of the sources. The drums and horns in particular take advantage of the space they are being played in. I really like that approach. Is that just where things were sounding good that day or is that a preference from all of your experience?



That is a major preference.

Walk into a studio room.

Listen to a good musician playing a nice instrument.

Do you like it?

Is your ear about 1" from the instrument?

A good room really helps of course.
Logged

Geoff Emerick de Fake

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 348
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2010, 10:51:54 pm »

Audiowonderland wrote on Mon, 08 February 2010 20:29

What would be a good choice in a condenser mic to use on a snare drum? I am looking for more bite/crack from the snare without having to do major EQ moves at mix time. I am using a 4 mic setup with 2 OH's in a modified Recorderman type of setup plus kick/snare mics.
Audio Technica PRO37; my secret weapon...
Logged

lysander

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2010, 12:58:14 pm »

If you prefer the sound of the snare miced from a distance, another trick is to use the close mic as the trigger for a noise gate on a more distant mic.
Logged

Galil

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 122
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2010, 01:43:27 pm »

+ 1 on the PRO37.

Galil
Logged

audiowonderland

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 108
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #13 on: February 12, 2010, 09:43:48 am »

compasspnt wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 11:08

Audiowonderland wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 09:40

compasspnt wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 08:25

If you want information regarding "bottom" snare mics, it should come from someone else, because I do not like them.

The best snare mic is one backed away from the snare...the farther back you get, the better the snare can sound.  But of course, then the more the other drums will blend into that one mic.

Many, including me, like to use one (or maybe two) mics on *the drum kit*...this includes the snare of course.  But the drummer will have to be good enough to balance the kit.

I was referring to using the pencil condenser as a (fairly at least) close snare mic on the top side, in the oft-used individual drum mic'ing technique.



Fair enough. I am using 4 mics for the entire kit and don't necessarily want to add more. I am currently using an sm57 an inch or so above the rim aimed across the batter head. It sounds good, not great, and rejects the hats really well. (They are very low, no more than 4-5" above the rim of the snare) Sounds like you are suggesting that I move that mic away from the drum a bit to capture more of the "drum" instead of just the batter head.

Do you use any type of augmentation/replacement/enhancement at the mix stage? Just trying to understand what makes up the final sound. I have listened to a few of the Widespread Panic albums and like the results I hear on those.(Angels On High in particular) My guess is you don't going with a minimal mic setup....



On that Panic album, I basically used two microphones for the whole kit, one in the bass drum (47fet) and one over the rest of the instrument (251).  There was also a C12 on the floor toms, just when need for clarity, and an SM7 near the snare used mostly for snare reverb send, but occasionally used if more bite or immediacy needed on snare.

Here is the session report, with photos:

     http://recforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/mv/msg/17672/0/0/ 6490/




That picture of the drum kit micing in that thread is encouraging because its actually very similar to the best setup I have found so far for drums in my room. My OH's are a good bit tighter because of a low ceiling but it really sounds so much better than what I was able to get with close mics on everything.

A.J.

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 161
Re: Condenser for snare drum
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2010, 01:47:01 pm »

Geoff Emerick de Fake wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 22:51

 Audio Technica PRO37; my secret weapon...



Interesting. These are pretty cheap. I'd like to check one out. Thanks for the tip.

Best,
A.J.
Pages: [1] 2 3 4  All   Go Up