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Author Topic: The advantage of large mixers?  (Read 34376 times)

Glenn Bucci

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The advantage of large mixers?
« on: July 21, 2004, 11:44:38 am »

I am wondering if the cost factor on high end consoles are worth their weight as they were 10 years ago. Yes the Sony Oxford console is amazing and with it you may not need much more than what the console offers, I agree. However there are tons of high end plug ins including George
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Fig

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2004, 12:56:18 pm »

Keef wrote on Wed, 21 July 2004 10:44



So besides the extra faders, what does the high end console offer that the cheaper setup would not give you?




A place underwhich to lay down when the session is over Smile

I think the biggest difference is in the way that someone works on a console versus a DAW.

I'm much more comfortable with a console than clicking around.  I like being able to see all the settings at the same time on one nice big surface.

And consoles generally have more inputs and outputs than most computer based systems.  I'm referring to actual XLRs in and out, not firewires or USB ports.

I know you get infinite tracks on the computer, but how many audio inputs can you have at one time?  That has always been the limitation of computer-based systems in my eyes.

The outputs are the same deal, I find it much easier to hook up multiple headphone mixes with a dedicated console than with a soundcard.

And then there is summing.

Real gear is exactly that -- REAL.

$.02,

Fig

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The easiest thing to do is the thing most easily forgotten.

Glenn Bucci

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2004, 01:09:44 pm »

That is why many have two monitors with their Daw. Once monitor for the wave screen, and the other showing two mixers showing 16 channels each. I hear what you are saying, but with more and more home recordings being done (if with Rush, Peter Frampton, etc)many studios may want to save some money. Heck you can even get the new Nuendo ID controller, with the UAD and Powercore plug ins along with the SIR reverb and be all set.

But it is nice seeing all your settings on all your channels at the same time. Is it worth spending over 100K though?
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Giovanni Speranza

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2004, 02:21:05 pm »

The answer is:
Did you hear them? If yes, you will know.

weihfool

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2004, 02:21:38 pm »

Keef, would you consider getting a console that isn't necessarily a "selling point" console, i.e.; SSL, Neve, API,etc.?

I'm sure you could pick up a very nice, clean used console, such as older Soundcraft, Soundtracs, Trident, etc. for very little money, that would give you 48 or so inputs at mixdown so you could have some nice analog EQ's and summing(the key benefit, though I'm sure that many would debate that) for considerably less money.  

Hell, you could even pick up a brand new Daking board for around $25K and those are supposedly wonderful sounding consoles.  Use your DAW software for automation and use the EQ's and summing of the board.

That's what I'll be doing once my board is back assembled (sound workshop series 30).  

Just an idea to think about..
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Fig

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2004, 03:35:32 pm »

Keef wrote on Wed, 21 July 2004 12:09

Is it worth spending over 100K though?


There are plenty of fine consoles for considerably less that 100K.

Giovanni Speranza wrote

The answer is:
Did you hear them? If yes, you will know.


ROTFLMAO!

Oh yeah, there's that  Rolling Eyes  

Keef, I think you'll want to look at the types of work you are intending to do on the gear you propose.

The types of clients that require an Oxford would not be well pleased with your proposed substitute.  Studios install Oxfords cuz they have the clientele that demand what it can do.  If your clients (or your own projects) do not require that type of device, then you are right:  there is a cheaper way.

No dis to the DM2000 -- which is fine kit BTW, but it does not make the same impression as an Oxford when a prospective client walks into the control room for the first time.  And besides, how can a band of four to six members all gather around a DM-2000? (see attachment)

What type of gigs are you doing (or aspiring to do if this is an upgrade path to your current setup)?  What kind of gear can get those jobs done?  And finally, what gear do you want to be operating for the next five years.  Personally, I'll take a sea of knobs over two monitor screens anyday.

Osci-later,

Fig
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Glenn Bucci

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2004, 04:43:46 pm »

I guess if you have a pro studio, it helps get clients who have the money. I just am wondering sound wise what advantage is there, if any?
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Giovanni Speranza

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2004, 07:56:07 am »

ROTFLMAO meaning?
Rolling on the floor laughing....???

Bob Olhsson

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2004, 09:11:18 am »

The purpose of a console isn't sound quality. It's to facilitate performance both in front of the microphones and in the mix.

Anybody who thinks large consoles are going away anytime soon probably isn't very well grounded in how recordings are PERFORMED.

Eddie Matthews

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #9 on: July 22, 2004, 10:15:31 am »

Giovanni Speranza wrote on Thu, 22 July 2004 06:56

ROTFLMAO meaning?
Rolling on the floor laughing....???


. . . My Ass Off.
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Glenn Bucci

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2004, 11:54:18 am »

Bob Olhsson wrote on Thu, 22 July 2004 09:11

The purpose of a console isn't sound quality. It's to facilitate performance both in front of the microphones and in the mix.

Anybody who thinks large consoles are going away anytime soon probably isn't very well grounded in how recordings are PERFORMED.


Thank you for your reply, you just reafirmed to me the main purpose of a big console, having lots of I/O to make your work flow easier. In a pro studio, it is the way to go. However on a mid level playing field the DM 2000 or even the beloved Sony DMX R100 would be a good choice! Not sure if I would choose the new SSL 900 over these two units.
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PP

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #11 on: July 22, 2004, 06:02:41 pm »

Quote Bob: “Anybody who thinks large consoles are going away anytime soon probably isn't very well grounded in how recordings are PERFORMED.”


Precisely!

Best Wishes Peter


Peter Poyser
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Touchwood Studios

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2004, 01:52:04 pm »

What would have people said if 20 years ago someone on a soap box would be standing a saying "Most of the music/video/film/composing will be done with computers."
They all would have laughed.
Never say Never.
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Bob Olhsson

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #13 on: August 20, 2004, 01:01:38 am »

Touchwood Studios wrote on Thu, 19 August 2004 12:52

What would have people said if 20 years ago someone on a soap box would be standing a saying "Most of the music/video/film/composing will be done with computers."
They all would have laughed.
Never say Never.

It was actually visible on the horizon 30 years ago and blatantly obvious 20 years ago! What we have today is just a cheaper version of what was being used at the high end 20 years ago.

Dave Hayes

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Re: The advantage of large mixers?
« Reply #14 on: August 20, 2004, 02:31:06 am »

FWIW, the first time I stepped up to a large format console, it was a Neve VR series, and it was darn near a religious experience. I was coming from about 2-3 years experience with Cubendo and I now much prefer working on a large analog desk to clicking around with a mouse. Twisting the knobbies just works for me, in a way that even a huge control surface can't compete with.
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Dave Hayes
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