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Author Topic: No DDP via FTP... WTF?  (Read 9230 times)

zmix

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No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« on: October 16, 2009, 04:30:26 pm »

I asked Oasis if they could accept a DDP file over FTP for replication and they responded that they preferred a disc.  Considering Oasis' "Green Policy",  I would think that an  FTP transfer option would be a priority .    The current model requires me to burn a file to a disc, take the disc to a shipper, have the shipper transport the disk to the company where the original file is extracted from the disc and the disc is then discarded.  Not very green at all.

Any alternative replicators who do accept DDP?

Waltz Mastering

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2009, 04:46:00 pm »

I emailed  a contact at discmakers in NJ a couple weeks ago to see if I could send ddp because of a rush job and they would only accept a hard copy next day even though on there site it says they accept ddp.

bblackwood

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2009, 04:58:17 pm »

I find it sad that most every overseas production facility happily accepts DDP files yet we have such trouble finding people who do so here in the states...
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Brad Blackwood
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TotalSonic

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2009, 05:10:43 pm »

Oasis is now owned by Discmakers so they use DM's plant in Pennsauken NJ.

Seems a lot of my clients these days go to Discmakers or Nationwide in Texas - but neither will accept DDP.  

I understand the reasons for this as they have a strict work flow for their glass mastering that makes it more of a non-brainer to keep going.  In this case "inputs" are CD-R's only - first tested to see if they are to spec - and then the passed ones read into hard drives into DDP formatted exactly as needed, with entire batches able to be queued to the LBR.  It's an either/or work flow - not a "maybe if" that you can get with DDP images not being formatted in precisely the way you need them.

Of course it wouldn't be all that hard for them to change this so that they could easily accommodate DDP via FTP - but once a plant determines the "way they like to do things" don't hold your breath for it to change.

btw - the "greenest" policy regarding CD's is just not to make them!!  As far as digipaks and jackets that Oasis spouts as being so environmentally conscious - sure, there's more elements to them that are biodegradable - but anyone who has ever lived next to a paper mill knows they are a far thing from being truly "green."  For some reason this absurd pandering to folks guilt as a misplaced and misinforming marketing plot always rubs me the wrong way.  

Best rewgards,
Steve Berson  

zmix

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2009, 06:45:31 pm »

Oh as is wrote on Fri, 16 October 2009 16:30

Chuck,
   We do have an FTP for design, however it is not a perfect world. We do get a small percentage of corrupted files which we don't find out until it's been opened up. With a clients master we don't feel we want to gamble on the their final product or chance an issue. I hope you understand. Sorry for any inconvenience.

Chris Walthy
Client Advisor
Oasis Disc Manufacturing
chris@oasiscd.com


To which I replied......

Hi Chris,
 So it is the official position of Oasis to say that possible file corruption has eliminated the possibility of any FTP transfer?  
I would expect an equal number of corrupted discs to FTP files... I  routinely use my FTP site to accept client projects and  masters and I urge then to ZIP the files as any errors are detected immediately upon unziping and substitutes may be uploaded  to replace them. There are several replicators who do accept DDP via FTP, and more mastering houses which transfer files this way (Sterling, for just one huge example, has their own client software for downloading a DDP file and burning a disc for reference.)  I  thought that given Oasis "Green" posture you would understand the importance.

-Chuck

bblackwood

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2009, 07:04:37 pm »

Heck, every DDP I create is zipped, then I find the MD5 checksum value of that zip, write that to a text file, and zip that with the previously zipped DDP file set. I can then extract the MD5 zip file and check the checksum to insure everything is safe. Takes about five minutes to insure there's zero chance of corrupted data.

Bizarre that in this day and age the fear of 'bad FTP transfers' still exists...
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Brad Blackwood
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carlsaff

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2009, 07:14:38 pm »

Yeah, I even hear the "I don't want internet transfer changing the sound" thing from time to time. Just crazy that these ideas still exist! The internet wouldn't work at all if we couldn't get data from one machine to the next with extreme reliability.

That is diligent error-checking there, Brad! I'm pretty sure that ZIP-ing alone is more than sufficient protection against data corruption. If the uploaded ZIP doesn't open, the data is corrupt. If it does, it's not. Someone please tell me if I'm wrong.

bblackwood

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2009, 09:39:39 pm »

carlsaff wrote on Fri, 16 October 2009 18:14

That is diligent error-checking there, Brad! I'm pretty sure that ZIP-ing alone is more than sufficient protection against data corruption. If the uploaded ZIP doesn't open, the data is corrupt. If it does, it's not. Someone please tell me if I'm wrong.

Could be, but when it only takes five minutes, I hardly see it as over-zealous.
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Brad Blackwood
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Bob Olhsson

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2009, 12:50:55 am »

Remember that they are dealing with all levels of clients and mastering facilities. I suspect they've gotten burned where the client hadn't actually heard and signed off on a CD-R that had been made from the DDP.

bkuijt

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #9 on: October 17, 2009, 09:26:18 am »

Bob Olhsson wrote on Sat, 17 October 2009 06:50

Remember that they are dealing with all levels of clients and mastering facilities. I suspect they've gotten burned where the client hadn't actually heard and signed off on a CD-R that had been made from the DDP.


Over here in the Netherlands they tell me: "there's no point because we have to burn a CDR of the DDP and this is extra work and risk of something going wrong. We assume you don't want us meddling with your product..."
Confused

The bigger ones accept DDP and ftp but the cheapo's don't.
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Bob Olhsson

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #10 on: October 17, 2009, 11:22:45 am »

carlsaff wrote on Fri, 16 October 2009 18:14

...If the uploaded ZIP doesn't open, the data is corrupt. If it does, it's not. Someone please tell me if I'm wrong.
I recently learned the hard way that a zip can be opened with the audio corrupted. I find BWF headers to be a more accurate way to spot corrupt audio files.

Viitalahde

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #11 on: October 17, 2009, 02:51:00 pm »

Bob Olhsson wrote on Sat, 17 October 2009 16:22

I recently learned the hard way that a zip can be opened with the audio corrupted.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think a RAR package is immune to this? I honestly don't know how widely RAR is supported, though. I've always liked it.

ARJ X *.*
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Jaakko Viitalähde
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bkuijt

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #12 on: October 17, 2009, 03:55:53 pm »

Viitalahde wrote on Sat, 17 October 2009 20:51

Bob Olhsson wrote on Sat, 17 October 2009 16:22

I recently learned the hard way that a zip can be opened with the audio corrupted.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think a RAR package is immune to this? I honestly don't know how widely RAR is supported, though. I've always liked it.

ARJ X *.*



Drifting off topic a bit:

RAR is very robust but I've had BOTH  zip and rar failures (also found out the hard way).
When zip made it's first error I had to re-author the SACD and switched to RAR.
The RAR error was spotted by the MD5 check (so theoretically it could also be an unreported HD write failure, there is no way of knowing).
I check MD5 all the time: reading CD's or DVD's, unpacking archives or when people send unpacked data by FTP. Even when copying lots of data to a different drive.
With returning customers I ask them to include the checksums from their end, saves a lot of time.
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crna59

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #13 on: October 17, 2009, 04:03:00 pm »

We routinely use Synchronicity for our ftp DDP transfers. The one time that I had to send a disc, it appeared to me they felt it was a hassle.


Regards,
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hnewman

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Re: No DDP via FTP... WTF?
« Reply #14 on: October 17, 2009, 04:03:20 pm »

I believe FLAC is also error immune, and most of the frontends let you fingerprint when you encode.  I wish FLAC would catch on, I like that most software will play them without decompressing.
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