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Author Topic: IMP21 discussion  (Read 12681 times)

mdifazio

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #15 on: May 08, 2009, 04:31:31 pm »

I get a tempo of around 110 also.  Then there's that tricky 7/8 section...
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M.Difazio
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Podgorny

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #16 on: May 08, 2009, 05:15:08 pm »

Eric H. wrote on Wed, 06 May 2009 17:49

Abuse of Autotune on the lead voc?


Not an ounce of Autotune.
There is Melodyne, and I promise it was executed with a great deal of competence.

With regards to the overheads, these are more "cymbal" mics than full-kit overheads.  The kit sound during tracking was built around the close room mics and spot mics.  The OHs were compressed with a pair of 1176s - which I thought worked well for this song.

The Kick is another story.  The kick and toms were an early sixties ludwig kit- chosen for another song that needed a more vintage sound.  Efforts were made to make the Ludwigs more aggressive for this song, with varying degrees of success (I think the kick sounds better than the toms).  And no, it wasn't a Beta52, smartypants. Smile

There is no set tempo, as the band recorded without a click.  They were good enough to, so why not?  Anywhere between 110bpm and 116bpm should get you close enough for setting delays.

The snare and kick waveforms ARE clipped.  They were compressed with an LT Sound CLX-2.  If you ever work in Nashville, you'll see them all over the place.  They do that to drums.  I don't know why.  I've noticed it, but don't really care because that thing just rules.

Anyway, I'm glad you're all enjoying this.  It was a fun project.  Unfortunately, the band is not on tour with anyone.  They broke up about a month after finishing this.

And J, it will be nice to have you in town.


A picture...



index.php/fa/12158/0/
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"Nobody cares what the impedance is; all they care about is when you can walk into the room, set up a mic, turn the knobs, hit record, and make everybody go 'wow.'"

iCombs

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #17 on: May 08, 2009, 07:32:22 pm »

Color me corrected about the kick mic!

Sounded like the weirdness that I get from B52's...musta been the processing that's creating it.

Too bad about the band breaking up...good tune.

Anything else you care to share about these sessions or you plan on keeping it under wraps til mixes are in?
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Ian Combs
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Podgorny

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #18 on: May 08, 2009, 07:46:06 pm »

No wraps. What do you want to know?
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"Nobody cares what the impedance is; all they care about is when you can walk into the room, set up a mic, turn the knobs, hit record, and make everybody go 'wow.'"

iCombs

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #19 on: May 08, 2009, 08:20:54 pm »

Actually...wondering what the setups for vocals were...doesn't sound like there was a lot of compression going in and controlling vocal dynamics is something I'm struggling with a little on these...Everything else is just SCREAMING (at least IMO) for certain treatments...mostly because the sounds are really well established already...the vocals sound a little more raw both spectrally and dynamically.

This is a hell of a job, dude.  I'm really impressed all the way around.
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Ian Combs
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"Mista apareeatah... can I have maar beass at all frequencies?"

Podgorny

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2009, 11:11:45 pm »

The vocals are by far the most difficult aspect of this mix.  One, there are a lot of vocals.  And two, the singer's voice has a tendency to become a little harsh if not treated carefully.

The chain was SM7 > API 512 > umm... I don't remember. It was over a year ago.  Maybe a DBX 160?

Unlike the rest of the tracks, I prefer to cut vocals without a ton of processing. That way it's easier to match up sounds later on, as I'm much more likely to have to punch in a line or two after the fact than I am with, say, bass.  I sometimes will listen with some more compression on the tape return, as it can help the singer to feel more comfortable.



Some more pics:


http://www.kylemann.com/imp21/drums.jpg

http://www.kylemann.com/imp21/amps.jpg

http://www.kylemann.com/imp21/cabinets.jpg

http://www.kylemann.com/imp21/marshall_settings.jpg

http://www.kylemann.com/imp21/patchbay.jpg
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"Nobody cares what the impedance is; all they care about is when you can walk into the room, set up a mic, turn the knobs, hit record, and make everybody go 'wow.'"

Jonah A. Kort

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #21 on: May 09, 2009, 08:02:20 am »

How was the bass recorded, please?

I know it really doesn't matter, but it might spark a new idea in

my head for tracking!
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Patrik T

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #22 on: May 09, 2009, 03:40:56 pm »

Is the mp3 expected to be 44.1 or 48 kHz?

/patrik
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Eric H.

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #23 on: May 09, 2009, 04:38:43 pm »

Is this a Bruce Swedien style Kick drum blanket that i see on the pictures?
Did you make it for yourself?

This track is really great and seems almost premixed (editing and levels as well as the right tones and eq/comp). Very good job indeed.
I am still a little bothered by the pitch correction, probably because i never have to use it.
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eric harizanos

iCombs

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #24 on: May 09, 2009, 06:34:01 pm »

That's actually just a packing blanket...which is the same sort of technique that Bruce Swedien (and a lot of other engineers) use to minimize bleed into the mic outside the kick drum.

I've done it, too, and it's really, really handy when you want to lean on that out mic for your kick sound (something I'm doing more and more...especially in this mix).  I've always wondered, though, if there was any side effect on the sound of the kick drum itself as far as damping the shell is concerned...I've actually gone as far as sandbagging the blanket on top of the kick (which also adds more acoustic damping for the bleed that comes to the inside kick mic), but I gotta wonder if or how much it plays with the shell resonance of the drum and what that does not only to the close mics, but the aggregate of the kick drum sound.

I'm almost positive that the differences are so negligible that it's probably a purely theoretical discussion, but at that, I still just GOTTA WONDER.  Anyone have any experience that leads them to any sort of conclusion on this?
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Ian Combs
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"Mista apareeatah... can I have maar beass at all frequencies?"

Podgorny

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #25 on: May 10, 2009, 01:06:03 am »

Hey Jonah,

I'm sorry, I don't recall all the details about bass. I'll list what I remember.

It was definitely a Jazz Bass into my Hiwatt and an Ampeg 8x10. I think we used my SIB Varidrive for a little bit of grit too.

Mic was probably an SM7.  But it could've been a D112 or a Gefell M71.  I don't recall. Preamp was API 512 (I used APIs for every track on the project), into GML 8200 and LA-2A (or CL1B?).

DI was probably a Sescom w/ Jensen TF.  I don't think I used any of the DI in my mix.



About the kick/packing blanket.  YES, it can change the tone of the drum; DRASTICALLY.  I mean, imagine wrapping your Toms in blankets.  It kills shell resonance.  Sometimes this sound is part of the reason for using a blanket, but usually, since rock kick sounds are already very short in duration, it's strictly about bleed.  If you notice on the side-picture, there is a tunnel in front of the kick as well.  It's a 26" bass drum shell, that I keep for that purpose.
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"Nobody cares what the impedance is; all they care about is when you can walk into the room, set up a mic, turn the knobs, hit record, and make everybody go 'wow.'"

iCombs

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #26 on: May 10, 2009, 03:16:34 pm »

I've done the extra shell thing as far as tunneling the kick off...but I've found that I hear the inside of that second shell in a weird way...perhaps if I blanket the INSIDE of that shell...even just a little at the bottom...I'll have to try this.

As far as damping goes...I totally see that...but when, like you say, the drum is already muffled and is primarily filling the role of a quick thump...does the blanket really make a functional difference in the way things sound?  I know it does on an absolute level, but what are the practical implications in this situation?  Anything worth worrying about?

Also...I totally forgot to ask...if it isn't a Beta 52 in there...then what the hell is it?
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Ian Combs
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grantis

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #27 on: May 10, 2009, 03:49:23 pm »

Kyle,
What was the mic used on the far room mics?  Is that an SF-12 I see out in the distance?

Great, great, great tracks
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Grant Craig
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Podgorny

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #28 on: May 10, 2009, 06:58:01 pm »

D112.


Edit:
Grant, the close room mics are Royer 121s, and the far mics are UM92s.
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"Nobody cares what the impedance is; all they care about is when you can walk into the room, set up a mic, turn the knobs, hit record, and make everybody go 'wow.'"

iCombs

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Re: IMP21 discussion
« Reply #29 on: May 11, 2009, 12:53:52 am »

Huh.  Veeird.  Not used to hearing D112's sound like that...they're also not on my first call list of kick mics, though the last one I used on something turned out surprisingly good.

Like I said, though...any difference of opinion I have with these tracks is 100% subjective.  Everything works!  I even think I solved at least a bunch of the vocal issues I was having!

Can't wait to hear these mixes!
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Ian Combs
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"Mista apareeatah... can I have maar beass at all frequencies?"
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