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Author Topic: Quick guitar tone  (Read 5374 times)

weihfool

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #15 on: July 06, 2004, 03:59:02 pm »

Usually during drum tracking I setup my 2 Pod ProXT's for monitoring and take a dry DI and send it to a track.  We listen back to the effected signal and if the performance is cool, we then do a reamp.  If the feel isn't there, we'll just retrack the whole damn thing. However, especially in situations where a quick thing was needed, the reamp saved my tukus.

Rectum Fryers and JCM900's can give you fits.  One thing about the Mesa's is that if you use them in vintage mode and if you happen to have a set of EL34's laying around, you can usually get something usable out of the rhythm channel, especially if you use a small amount of gain and drive the power amp hard.

As for micing, I tend to put a Sennheiser E609 dead center with an SM57 on a roughly 45 degree angle, both mics the same distance from the grill.  This works pretty damn well with the amps and cabs I've had the pleasure of recording.  Best of luck and remember that if you don't think it sounds right, trust your ears and tweak till correct.

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chickenbop

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #16 on: July 06, 2004, 04:14:29 pm »

I had a mesa tremoverb which is a dual recto and it sounded like crap.Like a bunch of bees flying around your head.I can't believe I paid so much money for that thing.Mesa is one big hype.Maybe good for nu-metal but nu-metal sucks.
I've also had a jcm900 and I don't think they're as bad as everyone says.You have to match them with a smooth sounding cabinet loaded with something like celestion vintage 30's.The jcm900's get real harsh through the cabinets with the cheaper 75 watt celestions though.
I've never played through a normal jcm 800 but I have a slash head which is a reissue of the jubilee jcm800 and it's amazing.It really easy to get good tones out of.It's also very versatile.It's actually got a good clean tone,awesome keith richards tone if you turn the gain all the way up on the clean channel,and a great lead/semi-high gain for the 70's tone.
One thing I've noticed about getting a good tone out of modern tube amp is that you shouldn't crank it to 10(especially on the lead channel)unless you want to sound like Boston.It turns to mush.
I've found that cranking an amp usually only works for non-master volume amps like super leads or old fenders.
A modern amp sounds better at 3 or 4 vs. 9 or 10.
Everybody says "crank it" but it doesn't work.
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weihfool

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #17 on: July 06, 2004, 06:54:02 pm »

There are some Mesas that are really worth a try though.  If you check out some of the older Mark series amps, they can make your jaw drop.  Also, some lesser respected, why I don't know, but still great models to check out would be the DC-5, the Subway Rocket (through a 4x12, and cranked up this thing has a great rock tone, not metal), the DC-3, and supposedly the Blue Angels are nice, though I've never actually played one.  

Personally, I own a DC-3, a DC-5, and a MarkIII Simulclass that was modded to a MarkIIC+ preamp.  If you'd like to hear what the MarkIII sounds like through a pair of Vintage 30's, check out the CAPE song from Team Superhero.  The crunchy guitar chords are being played through that amp.  
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chickenbop

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #18 on: July 06, 2004, 09:49:01 pm »

Yeah-I was really saying that the dual rectifier family sounded like crap,not the fender-y boogie stuff.
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Fibes

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #19 on: July 07, 2004, 04:25:42 pm »

chickenbop wrote on Tue, 06 July 2004 21:49

Yeah-I was really saying that the dual rectifier family sounded like crap,not the fender-y boogie stuff.


They are of a type that is hard to control, don't think clean, think grind. It takes the right guitar but when you get the right combo and dial in another amp as spice it can be sick as a cruiseliner. Just watch that fizz around 6k.
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Fibes
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redelephant

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2004, 05:50:06 pm »

So what should I do? Get a Royer and a Fender Twin with a bunch of stomp pedals on hand since the usual Recto's and JCM's suck? I have a Plexi and a 900. I do not plan on buying a Mesa and I wish I could afford a Bogner, so does this seem like a good fall back? Oh and I usually use my GR-M1NV on guitar cabs and my room is decent when isolated correctly.
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chickenbop

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2004, 06:09:07 pm »

Red-I think having a plexi and a jcm900 can get you a bunch of cool sounds.Way more than a dual recto.A marshall power brake is cool to have around for the plexi so you don't have to go completely deaf.I had a super lead and  I found that a rat(with the treble on all the way)pedal could sound good through the bass channel of the amp for an additional sound past just cranking the amp.
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Jonas as

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2004, 07:17:04 pm »

redelephant wrote on Wed, 07 July 2004 23:50

So what should I do? Get a Royer and a Fender Twin with a bunch of stomp pedals on hand since the usual Recto's and JCM's suck?  


YES, but maybe not a bunch.
You need more than one colour though,
that goes for amp, boxes, guitars, and PLAYERS.
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redelephant

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2004, 10:06:44 pm »

chickenbop wrote on Wed, 07 July 2004 23:09

Red-I think having a plexi and a jcm900 can get you a bunch of cool sounds.Way more than a dual recto.A marshall power brake is cool to have around for the plexi so you don't have to go completely deaf.I had a super lead and  I found that a rat(with the treble on all the way)pedal could sound good through the bass channel of the amp for an additional sound past just cranking the amp.


I have a THD Hotplate that works brilliantly. I also use my Rat on channel 2 quite a lot.
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redfro

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2004, 10:46:44 pm »

redelephant wrote on Thu, 08 July 2004 03:06

chickenbop wrote on Wed, 07 July 2004 23:09

A marshall power brake is cool to have around for the plexi so you don't have to go completely deaf.


I have a THD Hotplate that works brilliantly. I also use my Rat on channel 2 quite a lot.


NEVER use a Marshall power brake. It'll destroy your amp quick, trust me on this one! THD is the ONLY way to go, and they also make one of the coolest studio amps IMHO.
http://www.thdelectronics.com/products/univalve.htm

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chickenbop

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #25 on: July 08, 2004, 12:29:09 pm »

You must have had a bad one.I've used mine for 7 years.
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eaeolian

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #26 on: July 08, 2004, 03:30:59 pm »

chickenbop wrote on Tue, 06 July 2004 21:49

Yeah-I was really saying that the dual rectifier family sounded like crap,not the fender-y boogie stuff.


Rectos are curious beasts. I've got some really good tones out of them, but you have to know what you're doing.

Step #1: TURN DOWN THE GAIN.
Step #2: See Step #1.

Gain at a reasonable level? Good.

That's usually the crucial step. Half of the people I've seen that use Rectos have them sound like crap live, much less for recording, because they go in and dime everything out. That's the best way I can think of to make one sound like poo.

If you're recording a Recto - and going for really heavy tones - keep a Tubescreamer around, with the drive set low. Check out Andy Sneap's stuff for how that works out.

It's also better if they use the Mesa cabs - I've had little luck getting them sound good through a Marshall.

Hope this helps. I know nothing about 900s, other than that I can't stand them.  Very Happy

Mike
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j.hall

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #27 on: July 09, 2004, 11:09:13 am »

most players don't realize how gain effects their recorded tone

they crank the gain to get the thick saturated sound they want to hear 10' back from the amp with a single signal

it's just mush when you mic that

back off the gain, do an overdub and you got what they want.
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Signal

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Re: Quick guitar tone
« Reply #28 on: July 09, 2004, 04:34:23 pm »

ok well we're now not into quick anymore i guess..


but some great advice, i think it was posted to the homerecording bbs - i forget who- but basically ...
BEWARE OF PHASE DIFF if USING TWO MICS!!!

the best way to deal with it is setup one mic, setup your second mic and flip the phase, and then let a very very small signal into the first one while you move the second one.  listen to headphones to what is going on, and when you hear hum or whatver start to disappear, THAT is where you want the second mic.  

Then, just go back and flip the phase- then you dont have phase issues.  Having phase issues doesnt make your tone BAD exactly, but if you want to know how to control everything, phase is another part of audio that effects sound =)

hope that helps.

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