Topic: Zipping mixes (Read 6780 times)

OTR-jkl · « **on:** February 13, 2009, 10:27:12 AM »

An overseas (Middle East) client is having troubles uploading mix files to our server (US). I directed them to a couple of ftp apps (one of which I use regularly with no problems) that they could try out but I don't know if they've tried to use them or not. This morning, I took a peek on the server to find out how they were progressing and noticed that they've uploaded a large .zip file. Haven't heard from them yet, but I'm assuming that what I'm seeing is the uploaded mix files as one big zipped file.

Does zipping mix files (44/24) degrade the audio quality at all? Can anyone make a suggestion that might make things easier and better?

Thanks.

cass anawaty · « **Reply #1 on:** February 13, 2009, 10:33:13 AM »

This is where I find "yousendit" to be invaluable. Just send the "dropbox" link, and they upload from there.

Not sure about degradation in certain zip formats, but as an FYI one of my clients uses a lossless app called "7-zip" that has worked well.

iquinn · « **Reply #2 on:** February 13, 2009, 10:34:17 AM »

I've found sendspace (or similar sites) to be more reliable when someone is having ftp dropouts/issues.

http://www.sendspace.com/

edit: As suggested, yousendit is probably a better solution than sendspace.

zmix · « **Reply #3 on:** February 13, 2009, 10:55:05 AM »

OTR-jkl wrote on Fri, 13 February 2009 10:27

Does zipping mix files (44/24) degrade the audio quality at all?

Absolutely not. I request zipped files simply because I have had audio files damaged by errors in the online transfer, but was unaware of the problem since the files would play, only to discover a few audible "clicks" were now present.

When a file is Zipped, the Zip archive simply will not open if there are any errors or the file is corrupt. Saves me a lot of anxiety.

PookyNMR · « **Reply #4 on:** February 13, 2009, 11:23:04 AM »

Also, if I understand the issue correctly, some files (like project files) that use resource forks can be damaged by some servers that inadvertently damage that part of the file. Zipping the files puts them in a 'container' to eliminate that problem. I once encountered this problem being sent Ableton Live session files that would not open when placed directly on the server, but would when zipped.

Viitalahde · « **Reply #5 on:** February 13, 2009, 11:25:22 AM »

Cass Anawaty wrote on Fri, 13 February 2009 15:33

This is where I find "yousendit" to be invaluable.

Hey, I've been meaning to ask this here.

I've got an FTP server but it's bloody slow to some customers. The Yousendit dropbox seems pretty good, but I've been worried about it's potentionally unsafe/unprofessional aspect to some clients. I know it's not, but some might feel that way.

Have you Yousendit users had any questions about the use of this service? I've been interested in it..

Tomas Danko · « **Reply #6 on:** February 13, 2009, 11:38:39 AM »

PookyNMR wrote on Fri, 13 February 2009 16:23

Also, if I understand the issue correctly, some files (like project files) that use resource forks can be damaged by some servers that inadvertently damage that part of the file. Zipping the files puts them in a 'container' to eliminate that problem. I once encountered this problem being sent Ableton Live session files that would not open when placed directly on the server, but would when zipped.

This is a Mac issue, although not as much of a problem as it used to be. When you unpack an archive file, it will recreate the correct filetype definition for the files that might otherwise get screwed up if downloading the unprocessed file.

In order to preserve all Mac-related data, one should BinHex-encode (.hqx) the file prior to zipping it. This will prevent any server from either reformatting the data (believing it to be a text document that needs carriage returns every, say, 80th character) or otherwise futzing with it due to assigning it a MIME-type.

More info here: http://www.fileinfo.net/extension/hqx

ggidluck · « **Reply #7 on:** February 13, 2009, 11:44:18 AM »

With FTP, if it gets interrupted you will get part of the file. You might not know whether or not that it is the whole thing.

Zipping the files puts them into a container that has a checksum that verifies the integrity of the whole archive. If the checksum doesn't match then you know you don't have the whole thing.

In the taper trading community I think what they do is a smart idea... They publish the files in FLAC or SHN format (lossless compressed) and publish MD5 checksums for each song. You can verify the file is intact with each MD5 checksum.

Zip format is much more convenient I guess. RAR format can be used for bigger archives. I think zip might be limited to 2 gb. But having the files in individual FLAC files makes more sense if your connectivity is flaky. Plus you have it in a format for archival already. Some apps can read that format directly now. (Reaper/Samplitude 10). Good move!

mastertone · « **Reply #8 on:** February 13, 2009, 12:02:05 PM »

zmix wrote on Fri, 13 February 2009 09:55

Absolutely not. I request zipped files simply because I have had audio files damaged by errors in the online transfer, but was unaware of the problem since the files would play, only to discover a few audible "clicks" were now present.

When a file is Zipped, the Zip archive simply will not open if there are any errors or the file is corrupt. Saves me a lot of anxiety.

Same for me. Ive had to many files that went bad over the Ftp.

Clicks and sometimes white noise spikes here and there.

I tell all my clients to zip or winrar it.

ggidluck · « **Reply #9 on:** February 13, 2009, 01:28:30 PM »

Apparently FTP does not do checksums and this is one reason why it is so fast.

Alternatives...
You can use SFTP (secure FTP) if the host supports it. A checksum is done on each packet and acknowledgment must come back from the client. The packet would be retransmitted if needed.

Another one is SCP (secure copy protocol.) We use that on Linux systems and use a client on windows called WinSCP. Under the hood it works like encrypted connections do under SSH.

Both SFTP or SCP are preferred if you have a host on the other end that will talk to you using that protocol. Mac OSX supports both of these from what I understand.

Greg Reierson · « **Reply #10 on:** February 13, 2009, 02:38:38 PM »

Viitalahde wrote on Fri, 13 February 2009 10:25

Have you Yousendit users had any questions about the use of this service? I've been interested in it..

No problems except a brief outage a couple weeks back. Clients love the ease of use of a drop box. No messing around with FTP clients, etc. It's very user friendly.

GR

Sonovo · « **Reply #11 on:** February 13, 2009, 02:50:19 PM »

For those with a Mac, I can heartily recommend Rumpus FTP server from Maxum development.

Bob K turned me on to it last year, it is an excellently designed FTP server that also supports WebDAV and HTTP, so you can point your clients to your server through a regular web browser and up/download from there, or even mount the disk (their user area) on their desktop.

Very slick, reasonably priced, secure. The best part is that if you set up a computer in the studio as the server, you clients files are there ready to be worked on, and when you're done a simple drag and drop makes them available for them to download.

It also offer remote management, statistics, logging, etc etc.

Cheers,
Thor

cass anawaty · « **Reply #12 on:** February 13, 2009, 03:16:39 PM »

Viitalahde wrote on Fri, 13 February 2009 16:25

Cass Anawaty wrote on Fri, 13 February 2009 15:33

This is where I find "yousendit" to be invaluable.

Hey, I've been meaning to ask this here.

I've got an FTP server but it's bloody slow to some customers. The Yousendit dropbox seems pretty good, but I've been worried about it's potentially unsafe/unprofessional aspect to some clients. I know it's not, but some might feel that way.

Have you Yousendit users had any questions about the use of this service? I've been interested in it..

I have both my own and yousendit. I've never really worried about the impression as I usually pre-empt it with "it's faster and more user-friendly". I don't mess with "client login" stuff, so it's more secure in that fashion than having them upload to a folder where everyone is using the same password.

I think there are "custom" options for the dropbox to make it prettier--or at least consistent w/ your branding theme. Never messed with it, though.

Peter Beckmann · « **Reply #13 on:** February 13, 2009, 03:22:49 PM »

I get files sent to me all the time via yousendit or sendspace.
They seem slower than a regular FTP using [on a Mac] say Transmit, but are really easy for clients to use.

I always insist on zipped files to avoid potential problems. As others have said, if there's a problem, the checksum alerts you, rather than you finding out the hard way, [which will always happen when you have the tightest deadline for the toughest client...]

Thor, I'll look into Rumpus,sounds good.

Peter

Andrew Hamilton · « **Reply #14 on:** February 13, 2009, 06:52:39 PM »

The topic has pretty well been put to rest. I'll just say that I like DreamHost, who is my web site host. I have a cgi script that I found online and modified with my own names and other words. It allows me to have a browser-authenticated directory on my web site's server that anyone with a browser can upload to, as long as s/he knows the user name and password. When files arrive, a bot from the server e-mails me that I've got "mail." A separate directory is used for e-delivery. I prefer .zip, and, of course, SonicStudio's knowledgebase page has the great information on using the OSX Terminal app to create an MD5 √sum of any file. But I also accept individual files. My IP address is static, so if it takes all night to upload, it won't time out and lose the connection. I won't give the "Internets" the keys to the kingdom, so's I dasn't get swamped with MP3s and other digi gags... But I will share this screenshot of the page you will see if you do know the user name and password...

Andrew

index.php/fa/11281/0/

Waltz Mastering · « **Reply #15 on:** February 13, 2009, 07:24:08 PM »

I've been using sendspace, megaload and yousendit for a while. Haven't had one problem (knock on wood). I have my own ftp site but it's more of a hassle for clients.

TW

carlsaff · « **Reply #16 on:** February 13, 2009, 08:00:36 PM »

Already been said to death, but, if anything, ZIP-ing should be encouraged, not discouraged.

aivoryuk · « **Reply #17 on:** February 14, 2009, 05:31:34 AM »

Waltz Mastering wrote on Sat, 14 February 2009 00:24

I've been using sendspace, megaload and yousendit for a while. Haven't had one problem (knock on wood). I have my own ftp site but it's more of a hassle for clients.

TW

I'm the same, I prefer megaupload because for me it seems to be quicker with the uploads then yousendit, haven't had any problems and none of my clients has questioned my professionalism with it. I do have FTP but I have nver had to use it.

I also think it is fine to Zip/RAR the files again had no problems.

compasspnt · « **Reply #18 on:** February 14, 2009, 09:30:31 AM »

I like them zipped, using my ftp or sendspace.com

Darius van H · « **Reply #19 on:** February 14, 2009, 09:47:12 AM »

$10 per month for a yousendit pro account is the absolutely best $10 i ever spent.......takes the hassle out of sending and receiving (even very large) files. FTP'ing with clients was always a chore (login problems, incomplete uploads etc).

I normally request that all files are zipped up together in one zip (a request that is often ignored!)

bblackwood · « **Reply #20 on:** February 14, 2009, 10:27:14 AM »

FWIW, if you use yousendit, make sure the files are zipped. While I've FTP transferred several TB's worth of data over the years with no dropouts, weirdness, etc, I've had two projects sent to me with dropouts from yousendit. Subsequently, re-downloading the files from yousendit corrected the problem, so it was a delivery issue...

David Glasser · « **Reply #21 on:** February 14, 2009, 06:16:02 PM »

The gold standard for file transfer is Digidelivery. The dedicated Digiserve box will set you back a bit more than an off the shelf computer w/ FTP server software but it makes file transfer as easy as email. Minimum server management is required and it's secure enough that our military uses these units. We also have a Rumpus driven FTP server but 90% of our file transfers now are with Digidelivery.

Ed Littman · « **Reply #22 on:** February 14, 2009, 06:44:45 PM »

bblackwood wrote on Sat, 14 February 2009 10:27

FWIW, if you use yousendit, make sure the files are zipped. While I've FTP transferred several TB's worth of data over the years with no dropouts, weirdness, etc, I've had two projects sent to me with dropouts from yousendit. Subsequently, re-downloading the files from yousendit corrected the problem, so it was a delivery issue...

I'm with you on that!
Twice yousendit screwed with my files. One a chorus section was missing (for a wump I think), & the other time the audio sounded like a vocoder.
The client was freaked. Shocked

With that said I use this service often but only with zipped files.
Ed

Waltz Mastering · « **Reply #23 on:** February 14, 2009, 06:46:55 PM »

Digidelivery seems interesting, the thing that's a bummer is you can't archive files.

Do you have to buy a piece of hardware for this?

Is there a monthly charge?

What the biggest file you can send?

TW

compasspnt · « **Reply #24 on:** February 14, 2009, 06:58:29 PM »

Waltz Mastering wrote on Sat, 14 February 2009 18:46

What the biggest file you can send?

Very Big.

Waltz Mastering · « **Reply #25 on:** February 14, 2009, 08:51:17 PM »

Can you be a little more general please?

TW

David Glasser · « **Reply #26 on:** February 14, 2009, 08:59:13 PM »

Waltz Mastering wrote on Sat, 14 February 2009 16:46

Digidelivery seems interesting, the thing that's a bummer is you can't archive files.

Do you have to buy a piece of hardware for this?

Is there a monthly charge?

What the biggest file you can send?

TW

It's not a system for archiving. Presumably you already have a way to archive your data.

At the least, either the sender or receiver must have, or have access to, a Digidelivery server box.

It's a one time purchase. No monthly charges.

Waltz Mastering · « **Reply #27 on:** February 14, 2009, 09:06:26 PM »

Thanks, I guess what I meant by archiving was leaving files to sit on their server for a while without re-uploading
so there can be multiple downloads over time.

TW

compasspnt · « **Reply #28 on:** February 15, 2009, 06:08:08 AM »

Waltz Mastering wrote on Sat, 14 February 2009 20:51

Can you be a little more general please?

In general, I've received files over 19 GB.

Waltz Mastering · « **Reply #29 on:** February 15, 2009, 07:21:34 AM »

That is "very big". Thanks. The reason I ask is that sendspace - yousendit and the like are great for relatively small files. But when it comes to large files, reliability and ease of use it's good to know what's out there.

Cheers, TW

cerberus · « **Reply #30 on:** February 15, 2009, 12:51:24 PM »

Cass Anawaty wrote on Fri, 13 February 2009 10:33

This is where I find "yousendit" to be invaluable.

i use yousendit.com as well. i think it is the best of those services,
very clean and pro looking... no crass attempts to sell the
recipient a subscription before they can get their file(s).

mac users who leave their machines on 24-7 might consider a fine
cocoa webserver called "papaya", which one can set up anywhere,
it's freeeware. has the necessary security features. and it's easy.

---

.zip iirc does a checksum.. this means it simply makes sure that
the number of bits in the file is the correct amount. however
it is safer yet to make a .dmg or .iso disk image, then .zip.

jeff dinces

Viitalahde · « **Reply #31 on:** February 15, 2009, 04:25:51 PM »

I'm seriously considering Yousendit right now.

As for zipping.. I should start asking for that, even if I've come this far with zero problems.

Peter Beckmann · « **Reply #32 on:** February 15, 2009, 05:16:07 PM »

Viitalahde wrote on Sun, 15 February 2009 21:25

As for zipping.. I should start asking for that, even if I've come this far with zero problems.

Jaako, you've been lucky. Ask for zipped from now on...

Peter

Tomas Danko · « **Reply #33 on:** February 17, 2009, 07:48:32 AM »

We use Digidelivery a lot at work, and it has been rock-solid and very fast. Even our Intranet solutions aren't as efficient. I've received something like 100 MB in a bit over 20 seconds (our uplink is very fast on the whole, though) using Digidelivery.

Other people here started sending non audio-related data over Digidelivery simply because it works so well and is dead-easy to handle.

R/E/P Community

Author Topic: Zipping mixes (Read 6780 times)