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Author Topic: drums and pres question  (Read 7324 times)

Colin Larson

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drums and pres question
« on: November 06, 2008, 12:44:35 am »

I don't have a lot of nice pres, I just have two decent ones and a bunch of low budget ones.  Now when recording drums, would you use the nicer pres for overheads or kick and snare?  I suppose one of these days I'll just have to test it out, but I was wondering what you all thought.
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NelsonL

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2008, 02:39:41 am »

I asked the same question here several years ago, although I already sort of had an opinion. Many many sessions later I still feel pretty much the same way, although my affiliation with Zilla has since made the question moot-- plenty of nice pres there.

My drum sounds rely on OH's and rooms quite a bit, I'd say the overheads are the most important. Especially since I can potentially use samples to improve or replace the close mics if I have to. Anyway, that's my deal.
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jdier

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2008, 10:50:02 am »

I have RNP's, GR's and the pres in my RME FF and OctaMic.  I tend to use the RNP's for overheads and the FF for snare and kick.  I have done it the other way and to not notice a HUGE difference when in the mix, but since I use the overheads heavily in my kit sound I always feel like the RNP's should be there.  GR's on guitars usually.
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grantis

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2008, 11:07:52 am »

If you have good samples to blend with a the kick and snare, then I'd opt to use your nicer pres on the overheads above anything.  Hard to add overhead samples...Smile
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Grant Craig
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iCombs

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2008, 11:52:55 am »

Man...I'd put the GR's on overheads...

The other option you have is to mic up each drum one at a time with the GR's...get a killer close mic'ed sound at each drum and collect a batch of samples...then mic up the kit with a focus on getting REALLY killer OH's...and use the samples you've gathered to replace the close mics.

It's a bit more work intensive...but it basically lets you clone your mic preamps!
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j.hall

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2008, 11:58:20 am »

overheads.  though the pre will only help if you have great mics and a solid sounding room.


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grantis

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2008, 07:02:57 pm »

j.hall wrote on Thu, 06 November 2008 10:58

overheads.  though the pre will only help if you have great mics and a solid sounding room.





i don't know about that.   if you have mediocre mics and a bad room AND bad pres, surely you're better off using better pres.  it's a start.
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Grant Craig
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tom eaton

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2008, 12:10:08 am »

Like heading to the South Pole by going north.  It's a start.  You'll get there eventually.  

There are WAY better ways to spend that money if your room and instruments are not up to snuff.

j.hall

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2008, 10:34:27 am »

grant richard wrote on Thu, 06 November 2008 18:02







i if you have mediocre mics and a bad room AND bad pres, surely you're better off using better pres.  it's a start.[/quote]


if you have a bad sounding room it really doesn't matter what you use.  and in a lot of cases, it might be better to use something crap then to capture that bad sounding room in all it's glorious badness with great mics and pres.

if the room sucks, you are going for a vibe alone, or just trying to get good isolated trigger hits for your samples....................
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Jonah A. Kort

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2008, 11:34:18 pm »

I use SM57s as room mics.  It's all I got but once they're crushed with Bomb Factory 1176's they sound pretty darn in my bad sounding concrete basement!
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bob ebeling

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2009, 08:07:23 pm »

Colin, I could get pretty specific for you if you tell me some more details:  

1. What pre's DO you have.
2. What mics do you have?
3. What Compressors do you have?
4. What exactly is the space you are recording in like?
5. DRUMS!  What kind and can you tune?

But right off the bat I'll tell you this.  Kick and Snare are Everything.  Kick and Snare tone ultimately define your record for the ages.  Think of a record you love, now, you hear the kick and snare don't you...  But I'd need to hear more to tell more.
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Bob Ebeling
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rankus

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2009, 04:12:34 pm »

bob ebeling wrote on Sat, 17 January 2009 17:07

Kick and Snare tone ultimately define your record for the ages.  


Quoted for emphasis.

A client was ribbing me about the amount of time I'm spending on the snare mix on her EP (4 days so far)(only a couple of hours a day though lol) , and I told her that next to vocals the Snare is the most important thing in a mix.. it sets the overall ambiance of a recording.

However I agree that in the OP's situation I would prolly use the good stuff on the OHD's and use samples on the bass drum and snare drum (blended).


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danko

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2010, 07:09:59 pm »

bob ebeling wrote on Sun, 18 January 2009 03:07

1. What pre's DO you have.
2. What mics do you have?
3. What Compressors do you have?
4. What exactly is the space you are recording in like?
5. DRUMS!  What kind and can you tune?

Apologies for upping an old topic, but I borrowed a bunch of mics for drum recordings and don't have too much time to test and choose, because I also got to play at the same time. So I have some kind of plan, but I'm also keen into hearing any comments or opinions as I'm not fully familiar with all the mics. I'm on a mobile rec gear including MacBook, Digi003 with ADA8000 and Soundcraft EPM8 as additional pres, so the track count is limited to 16. I also have some DBX compressors (DDP, 286A & 3*266), any use for them?

  • AKG C319 (4) -> 2 for ambience (ORTF)
  • AKG C417 (6)
  • AKG C535 (3) -> 2 for OH's
  • AKG D5
  • AKG D190
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  • Behringer ECM8000
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Fletcher

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2010, 08:23:54 am »

If it were my gig [having no idea of the room, kit, style of music, etc. -- in other words, a pre-judged yet uniformed response] I would probably go with

The Shure 52 for kik [and possibly add the "sub kik" if you want too... Michael Wagner uses this combination a lot and it seems to work pretty well], the AKG D-190 for snare, the Pearl CR55s for over heads, the 57's on the tom(s)... and if necessary, a 58 on the hat.

I wouldn't worry about the ride cymbal unless you're not getting enough of it in the overheads [which could also mean that you need to work on your technique to get the ride to cut through clearly when you play].

Pick whatever you want for room... and leave compression out of the picture if you're rushed for time [even if you're not rushed for time]... over the years I've found that unless you have a really inconsistent drummer, compression on drums as effect can be an interesting mix thing [especially parallel compression] but during recording it is often a recipe to get a whole lot of something you don't want and can't remove.

Hope this is of some assistance.

Peace.
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CN Fletcher

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Sam The Soundman

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Re: drums and pres question
« Reply #14 on: August 04, 2010, 06:00:06 pm »


Well man. I know I'm not a pro at recording as I obviously can't grasp the concept of certain things but here's a better question.

Are you recording in a decent room? If not, I know you'll mostly use some effects for the room sound. In that case, I would use the good pres on ur kick and snare inputs. I remember the last recording your band did and it sounded great and thats where I would switch to using the better pres on over heads but thats just my opinion. I get a little experience since I have a studio there in gibson and have to choose wisely what I use for what since the music room is a carpeted area. I only wish i could build a nice live sounding room.

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