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Author Topic: External summing of DAW mixes  (Read 77279 times)

compasspnt

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #135 on: December 28, 2008, 11:37:19 pm »

Yeah, but other than that, it doesn't matter...
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Bob Olhsson

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #136 on: December 29, 2008, 10:46:12 am »

Truncation distortion accumulates 6dB. per generation. Dither accumulates 3 dB. per generation. There is no third choice.

You can turn the bias off on an analog recorder too, but why?

Buzz

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #137 on: February 16, 2009, 01:49:16 pm »

Peter Thanks for the excellent scientific approach to this , it's refreshing to be able to SUM up what people hear to what is really happening !

Again this has opened my eyes BIG TIME !

LAter
Buzz

and ya of COURSE Terry and WW are right

BrianS

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #138 on: March 11, 2009, 06:28:21 pm »

I'm mixing PTHD with 16 stems out to an Apogee DA16 into the Neve 8816. I like it a lot.

I've also been patching out of the 8816 into a pair of API 560's then into an Alan Smart C2 back into Apogee AD16. It feels much more like the old days of mixing on a console to me. I like it much better than bouncing or printing a bus mix to a track.

The top is sweet. The bottom is warm. Mixing is easier. It "feels" good to me. I'm having fun with the rig.
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Nacho

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #139 on: April 14, 2009, 04:28:28 pm »

Hello Guys,
I've been trying different ways of mixing for a couple of months now

I've tried ANYTHING I have had in the studio to try out the analog summing compared to ITB.

It all depends on what you are looking for.  Sometimes ITB sounds just right for some kind of music and it doesn't for other styles.

My tryouts have been with a mackie 2408, an "El Cheapo" soundcraft 12 channel mixer, and the infamous Digidesign sub group channels in the C24, they were all receiving 8 stereo stems.

I know these are not very "pro" devices to use but I just did it to try it out, so don't thrash me about it haha!.

The best sound for my taste came out of the Mackie board.  Open sound, and that 3D sensation came up to life.

I definitely liked the ease of mixing when mixing out in stems to the mackie than what I like ITB.  It seemed that I could get to a decent mix in less time and using less resources than when mixing ITB, but the final color using the mackie as an analog summing device doesn't convince me.

Im looking forward to purchase the folcrom summing box or the dangerous music summing box for that use.

Nacho
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Unwinder

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #140 on: April 21, 2009, 04:44:46 pm »

I just slowly read through this entire thread and i'm just amazed. Total thanks to Peter for his thorough examination of these subjective matters and to Ross for sharing his experience.

I learned alot here today.

This also served to reinforce(to me) the opinions that alot of you guys have been standing by, which i continue to appreciate.

D.

marctheshark

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #141 on: July 14, 2009, 07:45:27 pm »

When I sum, out in the out board, that is...I use my favorite summing summer: the Yamaha Music Mixer Amp Speaker. It has a quality of nice that isn't in other music devices that are used by my friends Bill and me. We make the beats, and then we sell them behind the barn. We sum them because it is what summing is all about! Talk to you guys later. Keep summing.
Shocked
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compasspnt

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #142 on: July 14, 2009, 11:31:11 pm »

OK, if you keep Catting.
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bjornson

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #143 on: August 09, 2009, 09:58:22 pm »

I've gone full circle. From an Otari 54c  46x24 with MF automation to HD in the box, back to 56 fader Euphonix cs2000 with 48 PT outputs. I missed my outboard...I'm staying this way for the time being.  
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Wireline

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #144 on: September 05, 2009, 02:50:22 pm »

Question time for y'all in them thar big cities.

There's a lot of different summing schemes in a lot of different boards, etc.  What's to stop anyone from using their DAW for sub-bussing (like going to a Dangerous or whatnot), then to their analog board for compressions, EQ, external effects, and THEN to a monster cool summing unit like (fill in your favorite flavor that's better than what your board has here)?

Example:  I really like our Soundtracs Solo EQ, and my analog comps, with TC and Lexicon reverbs, but don't like (at all) the board;s summing.  If this works the way we want, then we'll look at adding whatever flavor we think is needed (if any).

It's gonna make for an interesting week, to be sure
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Ken Morgan
Wireline Studio
Midland, Texas
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jetbase

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #145 on: September 14, 2009, 03:03:41 am »

Wireline wrote on Sun, 06 September 2009 04:50

Question time for y'all in them thar big cities.

There's a lot of different summing schemes in a lot of different boards, etc.  What's to stop anyone from using their DAW for sub-bussing (like going to a Dangerous or whatnot), then to their analog board for compressions, EQ, external effects, and THEN to a monster cool summing unit like (fill in your favorite flavor that's better than what your board has here)?

Example:  I really like our Soundtracs Solo EQ, and my analog comps, with TC and Lexicon reverbs, but don't like (at all) the board;s summing.  If this works the way we want, then we'll look at adding whatever flavor we think is needed (if any).

It's gonna make for an interesting week, to be sure


Wouldn't you be better off replacing the console than getting a summing box in addition to it? Summing is probably the most important part of an analogue console. I think the problem with the Soundtracs Solo was that there wasn't enough headroom. Everthing ended up sounding a bit small & you couldn't quite get away from a 'demo' kinda sound, in my experience anyway. I think I remember liking the eq's - it's been a long time.
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Wireline

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #146 on: September 14, 2009, 07:49:00 pm »

Might be...but its a good stopgap until the cash breaks free for the board we want, then its gonna have to do.  Even as a stop gap, the summing unit will not go to waste.

The EQs are why we are going thru this hoop jumping, BTW.
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Ken Morgan
Wireline Studio
Midland, Texas
www.wirelinestudio.com

Wireline

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #147 on: September 19, 2009, 09:19:46 pm »

If anyone is still interested, installed the summing device today.  The differences were not small.  Board that was headed to the dumpster (literally) now has a function, featuring its strongest elements and bypasses its weakest...the usual phrases of clarity, renewed punch, etc all apply, with the addition of previously unknown separation.

not a bad tradeoff, really.  


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Ken Morgan
Wireline Studio
Midland, Texas
www.wirelinestudio.com

ericbridenbaker

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #148 on: December 04, 2009, 02:32:44 pm »

Wireline wrote on Mon, 14 September 2009 18:49

Might be...but its a good stopgap until the cash breaks free for the board we want, then its gonna have to do.  Even as a stop gap, the summing unit will not go to waste.

The EQs are why we are going thru this hoop jumping, BTW.

Nice to hear you found a solution that you are happy with. Have gone full circle on this one a few times... If you like the sound of your converters, and feel that the console EQs are better than plugins, and the overall sound and mixing experience is better then it's totally worth it.

I had always hoped that working entirely ITB could lead to a very streamlined workplace, but then the analog toys (and the associated cabling mess) keep coming back out... so much for that one, at least for now Smile

finding that tracking with the analog EQ and processing has been a lot of help especially if the mix is going to be ITB. Coming back out to analog for the mix through less than stellar converters can (but not always) muddy up the sound.

figuring it would actually be pretty expensive at this point (and take up a bunch of space) for me to move back to analog mixing and get a better sound than is happening now with straight up leveling of well recorded tracks in the DAW.

But really, you cant know for sure until you try it YMMV.

BIG thanks to Peter for his tests and information! Reading through it now.
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ericbridenbaker

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Re: External summing of DAW mixes
« Reply #149 on: December 04, 2009, 02:48:48 pm »

also, for those that like to go out to analog for the final mix, i remember seeing somewhere some analog summing cables naiant.com ??

can't do the whole summing argument thing anymore, but summing cable might be another affordable option to try...

Best Regards,
Eric
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