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Author Topic: Brauner Valvet  (Read 11146 times)

Glenn Bucci

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Brauner Valvet
« on: October 04, 2008, 11:47:55 am »

I put this info on the Mic lab forum, but though it would be helpful to put it here too. I  have been working in my studio with the Valvet for several days and have been very impressed with it. I have a project studio which is a serious hobby for me. The best mic I have is a Blue Blueberry.

When I A/B the two mic's into a Langevin DVC, the best way I can compare it is by comparing converters. If you have a Motu converter, you may feel it has given you good results. It sounds better than the Behringer and Presonus converters you had heard in the past.

But when you then try a Apogee converter, you hear more detail, depth, and clarity. This amount of clarity is something that surprised me. It does not have the silky top end of a Blue Kiwi but with that mic being transformerless, it lacks the fullness of the Valvet. The U87ai has that classic low mid character which many including myself love. But the honkyness that many claim the U87ai has, the Valvet does not have. Instead you get a glorious full, clear, detailed sound that gently smooths the top end without adding a lot of color.

For adding more color to the mic, I ran it through my Voxbox. It does not add more character, but if more color is need, the Voxbox did it well. The people who record in my studio mostly do Gospel music or music where the vocals stand in front of the music. I think this mic would be a good fit.

Now this does not mean that all my other mics will collect dust. People like API pre's for rock n roll. It has a character that many like while it at the same time lacks the high end detail of a Neve 1073. I found in my short test so far that the Blueberry is more like the API. It lacks the high detail of the Valvet, but it also at the same time pushes the vocals through a mix very nicely and may be better on certain types of rock n roll type music.

After working with acoustic guitars, and more vocals, there is one word that really came to my mind with working with the Valvet.......refinement. In comparing it to some other mic's including another tube mic, the Valvet shown it's refinement that was very appealing. Again the refined sound may not be best for some rocker songs, but breath taking with other types of music. My other mic's seems a little corse compared to the Valvet. Depending on the type of song, that was either a good or bad thing. What the Valvet lacks is texture. It has a large clear,detailed, sound. I am not sure if I want a mic that lacks texture, then again if all my other mic's have it, this may be a great alternative. I found on acoustic guitars the full spectrum of the guitar was heard best with the Valvet. The Lundahl transformer adds some weight and fullness to the guitar. Unlike the U87ai I have tried on acoustic, there seems to be a more balanced character from the low's to high's. For rock music, I found my Neve Portico pre sounded best with it on vocals and acoustic guitar. On ballads, or Gospel depending on the vocalist, I preferred the Manley Voxbox or Langevin pre.

The first part of the chain is the microphone, and this is a great mic to start with. With it's full, detailed, and refined sound, you can experiment with different pre's, EQ's, and compressor to get different character, and sound. I read a review where they said the API did not match well with the Valvet. Most likely because the API top end is not as wide and extended so you don't hear some of the quality of the mic.  All in all this is a very good mic very high end workmanship behind it. I found the high end easier on your ears compared to some decent Chinese tube mic's out there.
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Knastratt

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2008, 09:11:04 pm »

I just love my Valvet. The detail is awesome. Haven't really had any singer sound bad with it.

Peace - P
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wwittman

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2008, 11:27:36 am »

Glenn Bucci wrote on Sat, 04 October 2008 11:47

...People like API pre's for rock n roll. It has a character that many like while it at the same time lacks the high end detail of a Neve 1073...



With respect, I think this is completely untrue

and strikes me as more of that internets wisdom kind of stuff


naturally, you are entitled to your opinion, but I can't just let it be read into the record, as it were, as a FACT;  as an "everybody KNOWS that..." statement.

because everyone doesn't agree with that KIND of thinking at all.


my OPINION:
A Brauner VALVET is a really nice, high quality, mic.
A Blueberry isn't.


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William Wittman
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JGauthier

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2008, 03:44:53 am »

Just to add (since Ive been looking at Brauners all day and also owned a Blueberry)-

I agree 100% that the Blueberry does NOT count as a great mic and in this case is a poor reference for comparison. I owned one for years and only kept it cause I thought the resale was low enough not to consider it. I only had it cause it came in a bulk purchase.

That mic may work on the occasional source but overall its just AWFUL on the top end. Funny thing is I did find a use for it- shaker/tamb mic! It was awesome for that! And the occasional R&B singer and strangely me (though I have a terrible singing voice and don't sing- just scratch tracks)- but overall nothing...

I finally got rid of it in a trade+cash for an RCA 44bx... I still can't believe he took that mic...

I have to say it again, I really really didn't like that Blueberry and it sat in the box 99% of the time. It sounded like crispy paper...
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seedyunderbelly.com

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2008, 11:16:57 am »

Hi Glenn,  Maybe your API is cooler than most  as I find them to be brighter than a 1073..  weird.

They are also way more dynamic in the highs  ie:  letting the high "jump"  wheras the 1073 hols it at bay a bit.

As for the Blueberry  that is an unfortunate microphe unless you have a low pass on it..

all kidding aside I wonder if your API / 1073 'z are funtioning normally.  Or perhaps as usual I am not!

-j

Andres Gonzalez

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2008, 02:45:06 pm »

wwittman wrote on Sun, 05 October 2008 11:27

Glenn Bucci wrote on Sat, 04 October 2008 11:47

...People like API pre's for rock n roll. It has a character that many like while it at the same time lacks the high end detail of a Neve 1073...


With respect, I think this is completely untrue


Likewise, I do not think the API pres (512c or 312) lacks any high end detail. I do not have any 1073s to compare them to, but I do have several channels of 1272s which are essentially the same as a 1073 minus the EQ section (well, at least one half of a 1073 because it has 2 1272).

Was the EQ flat on the 1073 when you made that comparison?

-Andres
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Glenn Bucci

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2008, 03:53:27 pm »

I find it amazing that someone who has a home studio is put down for mentioning another mic he has in his studio while reviewing his observations on another mic. This forum is for discussing your impressions on gear, not complaining about a mic someone mentions they have in their studio.......you can do that at gearslutz.  

Regarding the Blueberry, I know the band Take 6 used the Blueberry for their vocals. I have seen Bono use a SE Gemini and Tony Bennett used a 4047 on his Duet record. Regarding API and Neve, API has more color than Neve. Perhaps I did not use the right word to explain the difference in the top end.

Peace
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burp182

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2008, 04:08:09 pm »

As an aside about the Blueberry:
One of the unique things about the original series of BLUE mics was that they were designed to be used differently from each other. The Blueberry is a case in point. The only way to get that mic to sound right is to work it VERY close. It was designed to use proximity as an integral component of it's sound. Back off and it gets bright and scratchy really fast. This wasn't a surprise to BLUE; it was intentional. Used on a voice up close, it was their take on a C12/251 style sound. Used with a foot or more of distance, it is a quite well made, attractive unbearable turd of a buzz-saw, IMHO.
Salespeople rarely imparted this intended little bit of wisdom, so the mic isn't regarded as well as they'd hoped. Whether BLUE succeeded in their C12 quest is a matter of conjecture, but the mic is better than the general chatter about it.
For what it's worth.....
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seedyunderbelly.com

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2008, 05:25:03 pm »

Hi Glenn,

I certainly hope that you did not think I was bagging on you on the contrary.  I think it is great to knock around the ideas!

Bagging on gear and celebrating other  gear  I guess is the idea..  So please do not mistake my dig on the BLUE mic as I dig on you-  

I hear the opposite  if we are talking about """"""""coulour"""""""""

The 1073 has more to my ears -  that is why I wonder if ours are set up the same-  I hear it the opposite-

How old was the API?  maybe the caps were dried up.I rejected some mics that went to TAKE SIX once..fwiw  mid sized diaphram
stinkers..

I remember skipper told me (John (pause) Maybe you are just not ready for these mics)  funny

I am still not ready for them or an enima for that matter

If they use those and the Blueberry  maybe they can sing better than they can discern mics!  oops!


did I say that??  perhaps not.


I do not think anyone has a nias about home studios or junky mics..  I just cut a lead vocal with a broken Telem411..WW

If you can sing  I am sure any mic would do.

It is our fetish to be concerned with timbre  It is a nice fetish  a gentlemanly one.

How do you hear more warth or colour in an API though?  I think

something is up with that it could be me my examples or different ears who knows  --  if you have anymore info about that please share

I hope that this discourse is not discouraging but fine

I appreciate you enthusiasm for the Brauners and I hope to hear them someday!

Take care -j














JGauthier

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2008, 07:36:21 am »

Glenn Bucci wrote on Thu, 13 November 2008 12:53

This forum is for discussing your impressions on gear, not complaining about a mic someone mentions they have in their studio.......you can do that at gearslutz.


Im glad you are here and not gearslutz but just fyi- this forum is for professional reviews- not home studio reviews. Maybe you didn't get a chance to read the charter. Im letting the thread stay because I think the review was well done regardless, but to be honest, the comparison/relativity in this case is not extremely helpful.

And Burp182 is 100% correct- I liked the blueberry on my voice cause Im a puss and hate singing and sing softly when cutting scratch takes. I also have a big voice so it worked well with that mic- literally almost kissing it. And again it kicks ass on tambourine... But regardless of proximity and tuning its just an overall 2nd rate mic that sounds good on a fluke.

Preferably some more mics in the locker for reference though. So don't take the shots at the Blueberry personally, its just not a good mic to use for relativity. Yes that mic and an Avalon 737sp made platinum records but I'd like to hear from people who are using mics in the same league- a step up isn't a comparison, its an improvement. I think theres a reason the Blueberry lost all its steam...

Any other Valvet users who have any input?
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Glenn Bucci

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2008, 09:01:58 am »

JGauthier wrote on Mon, 17 November 2008 07:36

Glenn Bucci wrote on Thu, 13 November 2008 12:53

This forum is for discussing your impressions on gear, not complaining about a mic someone mentions they have in their studio.......you can do that at gearslutz.


Im glad you are here and not gearslutz but just fyi- this forum is for professional reviews- not home studio reviews. Maybe you didn't get a chance to read the charter. Im letting the thread stay because I think the review was well done regardless, but to be honest, the comparison/relativity in this case is not extremely helpful.

And Burp182 is 100% correct- I liked the blueberry on my voice cause Im a puss and hate singing and sing softly when cutting scratch takes. I also have a big voice so it worked well with that mic- literally almost kissing it. And again it kicks ass on tambourine... But regardless of proximity and tuning its just an overall 2nd rate mic that sounds good on a fluke.

Preferably some more mics in the locker for reference though. So don't take the shots at the Blueberry personally, its just not a good mic to use for relativity. Yes that mic and an Avalon 737sp made platinum records but I'd like to hear from people who are using mics in the same league- a step up isn't a comparison, its an improvement. I think theres a reason the Blueberry lost all its steam...

Any other Valvet users who have any input?



Though I don't have a "professional studio", I have been recording in pro studio's since 1980, and have written reviews on recording gear in EQ magazine, studioreviews.com, and digitalprosound.com. So even though I don't own a lot of high end gear, I think I have enough knowledge to discuss gear. Perhaps I could of compared the Valvet to the Neumann 147 or or 149 which I have used in the past. However some people on the forums requested that I only discuss equipment that I use on a regular basis, and not gear that I used on occasion in studios; hence the reason I mentioned the Blueberry. However your point is well taken.
Very Happy revelationsoundstudio.com
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Rader Ranch

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2008, 07:24:44 pm »

JGauthier wrote on Mon, 17 November 2008 07:36

fyi- this forum is for professional reviews- not home studio reviews. Maybe you didn't get a chance to read the charter.



I don't see that in the announcement or the sticky.
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scott...

Didier Brest

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #12 on: February 23, 2009, 06:24:30 pm »

First take with a new Valvet matched pair.

The picture:

http://img365.imageshack.us/img365/9641/dscf0577.jpg


The sound:

Brauner Valvet

My feeling about the sound: uncolored and big. I like it.

For comparison: colored and big, the FLEA 49, a clone of the M49  (matched pair, same setting like above)

FLEA 49

I like this sound also. Razz

And you?

Didier  

NB Valvet and FLEA 49 are in cardioid setting.
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Barry Hufker

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #13 on: February 23, 2009, 07:42:40 pm »

There are nice qualities in both sounds.

If you should find yourself with a moment, I would love to hear the comparison again but with both sets of mics high enough that there are no reflections from the piano lid into the capsules.  I ask this only because it is a sound with which I'm more familiar.

But only if the idea appeals to you.  In any event, thank you for sharing.

Barry
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Didier Brest

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Re: Brauner Valvet
« Reply #14 on: February 24, 2009, 06:44:36 pm »

Barry,

I tested your idea. The microphones setting is like above except the height of the mics 1.8 m above the floor. Since the horizontal distance of the mid point of both mics to the piano rim is only 20 cm, the diaphragms are nearly in the prolongation of the open lid. As an opposite to the previous recordings, I did not boost the lows below 100 Hz, which is my usual way for transforming my 7' piano in a 9' one Smile, and I did not add reverb. This and the lack of smoothing effect from the lid reflection makes the sound rather crude for my ears. I shall see whether audio mastering can attenuate that and how it compares after mastering with my usual setting where the mics are about at mid height between the rim and the lid.

Brauner Valvet

FLEA 49

Didier

PS I feel here the sound from the Valvets a bit more aggressive. I did this take just after the FLEA take and may have not let the mics warming a time long enough after having install them on the stand. Confused
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