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[otek]

Fibes wrote on Wed, 02 June 2004 15:14

The double charging for the setup time isn't a part of my world as i stated earlier...

I didn't quite see it as "double charging".... more like "asking a reasonable per-title price" and not getting pushed into making a deal I am not satisfied with. Especially when I tweaked the sound to suit their project, it was no "set-and-forget" situation.

But I do see your point.

[j.hall]

i have yet to ask a carpenter, painter, plumber, electrician, landscaper, millworker, tech, etc..... to do anything for me for free.  i may negotiate a bulk rate for service rendered, but that happens long before the actual work begins

so why has recording become something people feel is their birth rite to get for free????

i'm providing a service just like those listed above.  i haven't heard anyone i know, or know of, ask any of the professional disciplines above, to work for free.

if you want your hardwood floors re-finished, you expect to pay.

you want to make a record, you expect it to be free......expectations are really annoying!!!

[Fibes]

j.hall wrote on Wed, 02 June 2004 11:04

so why has recording become something people feel is their birth rite to get for free????

It happens with all time based businesses especially those that are once removed, like architecture. People will spend millions on a building but will skimp on the design and legal documents holding a contractor to his bid. One change order due to omissions could pay the entire architects fee, people still want the gamble. The value of good production and AEing is in that same boat. the kids are more interested in the video or cd art than the execution of the actual product.

The whole file sharing thing hasn't helped either, not to mention the populations total ignorance to what a professional recording is.  I spend more time fixing peoples home tracking mistakes than I do tracking lately. Is that justice? Is that proper? I don't care. Duping people into figuring out the value of what we do is now part of the game, good sense and reason is now all but a part of the collective imagination.

The more you charge, the more people will respect your need to charge them.

As Walter Sear said: "you can't compete with free." i stopped long ago...

[otek]

Fibes wrote on Wed, 02 June 2004 17:53

The more you charge, the more people will respect your need to charge them. Asalter Sear said: "you can't compete with free." i stopped long ago...

How very, very true.

Well spoken Fibes.  

[tom eaton]

Seems to me you should get your hourly/song rate per tune, and the real injustice is that client #1 paid for the initial setup and tweak and client #2 benefitted.  The right thing to do would have been for client #2 to pay half of the setup fees.  Your rate would be the same per song/hour (however you figure it).  

The worst case I can remember of the engineer being overlooked was when Roger Nichols delivered ProTools mixes on a record, and then the label went to do the surround mix in house with one of their guys, using all Roger's settings.  Mr. Nichols got paid for the initial work, he just didn't realize how valuable the work was, and the longevity it would have, until later.

-tom

[otek]

Tom,

Your Roger Nichols example is actually very descriptive of how I feel about this whole thing.

And client #2 should have offered client #1 to pay for part of the setup time.

I think I have made clear by now that the principle of how this deal was negotiated (or wasn't, as it were) is what irks me the most about it.

Oh well. Another day, another session, and another wisdom.

[Fibes]

I just got paid extra (sort of a tip) by an artist, just thought I'd share.

Good shit happens too Ola.

[otek]

Fibes wrote on Thu, 03 June 2004 15:27

Good shit happens too Ola.

Yes it does. I, too was recently offered a cash bonus for a job well done.

And today, I landed a new album mix gig!