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Author Topic: Edwards Dropping Out  (Read 6869 times)

PRobb

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2008, 04:46:54 PM »

The level of cynicism is really depressing. I'm really sick of hearing people describe candidates as "they're all flawed so I won't vote of any of 'em".  I got news for you. If you're waiting for a Washington/Lincoln/Joan of Arc combo to come riding over the hill bathed in a pure white glow- it ain't gonna happen. We really need opinions that go deeper than "fuck 'em all". Yeah they're all flawed. Does that surprise anybody? But one of them is going to become president. Welcome to the real world.
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J-Texas

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2008, 04:46:59 PM »

Eric Merrill wrote on Wed, 30 January 2008 13:26


I disagree. It matters a great deal. It is not the MOST important consideration, of course, but I think it's foolish to deny that having a woman or any minority as president would be a significant step forward.


That's not what I said. I think it's obvious that it's a step forward.

What IS foolish is to vote for a candidate BECAUSE she is a woman... or black... or whatever, which is what people are going to be doing because they want so badly to be represented. Everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon.

Like I said before, it's the same thing that Bush did with the Christians. Did the Christian conservative feel represented by him these last two terms? I don't know, but I didn't.

The Democrats have been doing that shit for years. They don't care about the farmer, the little man, the minority. They feel superior to these people. They feel like they can "help", because they really feel sorry.

Do you think Bubba wants to trade in his 4x4 for a hybrid?

You really think the blue collar guy wants gay marriage in his hometown?

It's absurd. It's politics, and the politicians will do anything they can to be on top.

"I'm a strong woman who has put in 30 years of hard work and brought about change", blah, blah, bullshit.
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PRobb

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2008, 04:59:31 PM »

J-Texas wrote on Wed, 30 January 2008 16:46


The Democrats have been doing that shit for years. They don't care about the farmer, the little man, the minority. They feel superior to these people. They feel like they can "help", because they really feel sorry.

One of those things everybody knows that happens not to be true. The fact is the middle class and small business does better under the Democrats.

Quote:

You really think the blue collar guy wants gay marriage in his hometown?

Do you think 50 years ago he wanted his kids going to school with negroes? I really don't see a fundamental difference.

Quote:

It's absurd. It's politics, and the politicians will do anything they can to be on top.


Of course it's politics. Yes, we're talking about politics. Politics is political. Accusing politicians of being political is like accusing a piano player of being musical.

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studiojimi

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2008, 05:27:05 PM »

PRobb wrote on Wed, 30 January 2008 13:59

Accusing politicians of being political is like accusing a piano player of being musical.





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danickstr

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2008, 07:42:08 PM »

It's always a choice between a giant douche and a turd sandwich. - Kyle Broslofsky

and gay marriage in any town is fine with me.  where do you draw the line in your discrimination?
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Nick Dellos - MCPE  

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E Merrill

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2008, 07:44:51 PM »

J-Texas wrote on Wed, 30 January 2008 16:46



That's not what I said. I think it's obvious that it's a step forward.

What IS foolish is to vote for a candidate BECAUSE she is a woman... or black... or whatever, which is what people are going to be doing because they want so badly to be represented. Everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon.



Ok. then I apologize. Representation of belief and ideology is at least as important as representation of identity.

Eric
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MDM,

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2008, 07:45:29 PM »

RON PAUL


The constitution is a machine built for FREEDOM
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E Merrill

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2008, 07:54:19 PM »

mgod wrote on Wed, 30 January 2008 14:56

I suggest that folks have a look at the Goldwater granddaughter's recent documentary on Barry to get a look at what bi-partisanship was. People can have many disagreements over what constitutes appropriate governance and what defines good policy without always being sniveling rat-faced bastards.



Fair enough. Goldwater was distinctly unsuited to politics. I think he's gotten a little too much beatification but he's a unique case. I still think that Coolidge could qualify as a rat-faced bastard but standards change and your point is well taken.

mgod wrote on Wed, 30 January 2008 14:56

 Nixon was the beginning of the modern era of the despicable Republican party, but he was a panty-waist compared to what Reagan brought in(or rather what brought Reagan in).




I have read accounts of the 1972 Republican race and convention that left me feeling very much like Nixon sold out the establishment republicans to the supply side and religious right. It was that move that created the machine for Reagan, I suspect.

Now, my source is primarily "Fear and Loathing on the Campaign Trail" but it seemed quite convincing!

I'm all for civility in discourse but I do not regard "bipartisanship" as a reasonable governing philosophy.


Eric
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danickstr

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2008, 08:07:06 PM »

In my limited historical reading, I have been lead to believe that Cal Coolidge was a subversive guy. Good point.  

But certainly a complete lack of bipartisanship will only lead to a castrated congress.  

Ouch.

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Nick Dellos - MCPE  

Food for thought for the future:              http://http://www.kurzweilai.net/" target="_blank">http://www.kurzweilai.net/www.physorg.com

E Merrill

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2008, 08:47:45 PM »

danickstr wrote on Wed, 30 January 2008 20:07


But certainly a complete lack of bipartisanship will only lead to a castrated congress.  



There's truth to that, clearly. My fear is that when bipartisanship is the GOAL and not a working climate one hopes to foster, the result is Clintonian Triangulation. I think I would prefer collegiality. To me that implies an environment in which one could hold steadfastly to belief and ideology while respecting those with whom you disagree.


This response to the Edwards decision makes me ill:

http://tinyurl.com/3779yg
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Barry Hufker

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #25 on: January 30, 2008, 09:54:57 PM »

I am not denigrating the advancement of women and minorities, but we have had a woman (Geraldine Ferraro) and a black (Jesse Jackson) as part of serious bids for president/vice-president.

Ron Paul has no chance.  Traditionally John McCain has been viewed as a hothead ( http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=28641547027 3826).

What has amazed and disappointed me was the reception I received when I tried to make a comment on a thread at Crooks and Liars.  I was eaten up, chewed to pieces and spit out because I am not as liberal as these folks.  The are radical and a bit rabid.  I tried to make the point for cooperation between the parties and was told to STFU.  Personal attacks on me followed.  These people will never settle for any compromise.

I couldn't stand it.  I'll never go back to post on that forum.  And I worry about the country's future when so many people are strongly polarized.
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danickstr

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #26 on: January 30, 2008, 11:08:22 PM »

That Yahoo Edwards story is weepy.  Sounds like a story fox news would run (if it had a paradigm shift).
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Nick Dellos - MCPE  

Food for thought for the future:              http://http://www.kurzweilai.net/" target="_blank">http://www.kurzweilai.net/www.physorg.com

mgod

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #27 on: January 30, 2008, 11:10:32 PM »

J-Texas wrote on Wed, 30 January 2008 13:46

What IS foolish is to vote for a candidate BECAUSE she is a woman... or black... or whatever, which is what people are going to be doing because they want so badly to be represented. Everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon.

Excuse me? That's ridiculous. Everybody wants to jump on the bandwagon? Which bandwagon is that? Self-governance? Presumably, everybody is already on the bandwagon - not just white males. They want so badly to be represented? This is an admission that they're not - so where's the problem in wanting that, in a representative democracy?

Voting for Clinton because she's a woman or Obama because he's black is 100% sufficient reason to vote for them. Otherwise you're voting for somene because he's a white man.

They have lived a completely different life experience in the world and in the country than, not just your average, but ANY white male. What they bring might to the office is necessarily informed by that. And its about fucking time we get some other kind of experience in there, because white mens ain't been doing such a good job.

The "accepted" idea that being a woman or black isn't sufficient reason to vote for a candidate is totally reverse-PC, the kind of thing we're being trained to think. They've each passed the hurdles the constitution lays out, of native-birth and age, and they've raised the requiste insane amount of money - so they're  on even ground (or ahead) of the white men. AND they bring the fact of being something other -and that othhr can make all the difference.

And no - I wouldn't vote for Al Sharpton or Phyllis Schlafly. But these are mainstream candidates, on a level we haven't had before.

DS
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Barry Hufker

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #28 on: January 30, 2008, 11:58:38 PM »

You wouldn't vote for Sharpton or Schlafly??  Damn.  There goes my dream team...

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J.J. Blair

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Re: Edwards Dropping Out
« Reply #29 on: January 31, 2008, 01:14:36 AM »

Edwards said he won't accept a Veep nom.

Nader is an egomaniacal narcissist who has lost his mind.

Kucinich is full of shit.  He's totally pandering to a fringe base in his home state, and his position gets him the hot liberal chicks like his wife.  

McCain sold his soul after he lost in 2000.

If people really knew more about Ron Paul's positions, they wouldn't want him as their president, even though it's awesome that he's out there saying what he's saying.

I can't wait for Bloomberg to announce his third party candidacy.
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