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[Invisible Member]

I've been listening to Ozzmosis alot more recently and wow, the kick drum give me shivers more than any kick Ive heard in along time. I was wondering if mwagener is willing to share some basics to how that sound was achieved. Its certainly something I would like to add to my toolbox. I have been using D112's, sm57's for awhile an various ways but never had anything remotely as huge as I'd like. Thanks

[mwagener]

Hello Dennis

I assume you are talking about the kick on the released album version of Ozzmosis. Sorry, but I didn't work on the final version of that record. After the success of "No More Tears" the label came to me and asked me to produce another record exactly like "No More Tears" with Ozzy. We went in and did seven songs, at which point the label decided that they now wanted it to sound like Soundgarden. As you can imagine, once you start an album in a certain direction/style, it's not easy to change gears in the middle of it and go into a totally different direction. So, they hired Michael Beinhorn to redo the album.

I have to take Pricey's word on how it was recoded, because I don't know what they actually did. But it does sound very much like a sample to me.

To be honest, I was very disappointed when I heard the final version, but I thought, maybe it was just me being used to the original. I posted a short MP3 of  "Perry Mason" here if you're interested to hear a snip of the original mix.

As to your question about kick sound in general: I use a 6" speaker instead of a microphone in front of the kick to get the low end thump and mix it together with a Shure SM91, which is inside the kick for the attack part. The SM91 goes through a LittleLabs IBP to correct the phase between the two mics. I don't use EQ while recording but by mixing those two sources you can get a wide variety of kick sounds.

Hope this helps.

[Invisible Member]

Thanks for the info, Ill download the link at home since my work computer has no sound capability. I can see why you would be disapponted though. I tracked drums once in the early 90's and the drums to me sounded pretty good on the rough mixes, when I heard the final it was pretty sad. They didn't even retrack anything, just eq'd, gated and limited everything.  

Well if the kick is a sample then I won't pursue that avenue. Ive been tracking to a ATR16-16 and tend to mix like the 80's never ended  I have a few of the albums you've worked on, Dokken's Tooth and Nail was my favorite for along time, the Vinyl edition Its unplayable after an incident with Yukon Jack.

I just threw out a 6" speaker from a practice amp that I crushed on accident. Im certainly going to try that method after I track down schematics and another speaker. My biggest problem with my results is trying to get the kick to NOT sound like a cardboard box being hit with crowbar.

Here is some songs I did in January to get an idea of what my drum tracks sound like, these were the roughs and the drummer was struggling with timing issues for reasons relating to rehab.
http://starrdesign.com/submission/listen/ The kick problem should be obvious.

Thanks for info Pricey and mwagener.

Peace,
Dennis

[Jason Phair]

Oh my god.

That chorus.

AMAZING!!!

[Fletcher]

Some very expensive custom microphones and Neve 1057 modules went into that kik/drum sound [though I have no idea what happened in the mix process]... along with an excellent drummer, in a great room going to the maiden voyage of the first 2" 8 track... [truth be known, it was the drummer and the room but I ain't gonna say that out loud.... ooops].

[Invisible Member]

Thanks Fletcher,

I like hearing things like the drummer and the room being important:) Those are easier to come by for me than expensive and Neve.

mwagener,

I downloaded the mp3 of PMFADE.  That was quite a shock considering how many times Ive heard the released version. I even prepared myself for something different and it still made my ears tingle.  The guitars were incredible and the chorus was indeed awesome. The kick wasn't as big but it was tighter in the mix. I went back an listened to PM and now the kick seems overbearing to me and the guitars are lacking. Such is life. Just when you thought there was a flavor you loved someone offers you a taste of something better. In the words of Homer Simspson: DOH!!

Thanks for sharing.


Peace,
Dennis

[Seeker-Ian]

Agreed. Thanks for sharing Mike. Mucho to learn from you. Sounded great.

[mwagener]

well, the original goal was to make the "same" album as "No More Tears", I think we got pretty close. There is plenty more where that came from, buty unfortunately I'm not quite sure about the legalities of posting those, so you would have to stop by the studio for a listen

[recorderman]