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Author Topic: lps to cds  (Read 2165 times)

Annie

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lps to cds
« on: February 03, 2007, 08:25:48 PM »

Soooo i write a tech column and recently i had a reader ask me a question about home recording lps to cds.  I'm sure it's been covered elsewhere, but I wanted to throw my rough draft answer up here to see if anyone agrees or has suggestions.


um..

thanks


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Dear Prima Data,

I am from the older generation and I enjoy playing my hundreds of LP's. I would like to convert them onto CD's via my computer and how can I install my turntable to the computer so I can "download" them? Is there a conversion software package available?
 
Sincerely,

Guy P.
Generation LP

Hey there, Guy.  Thanks for bringing this up, I love LPs!  The first toy I remember was a Fisher Price record player, with a hard plastic “lp” of Camptown Races.  This was the start of a very fond relationship that I still indulge today.  Shocking, I know, for a digital diva like myself, but it’s true.   In my living room next to the home theater PC, two of the latest gaming systems, 5.1 surround sound setup and a receiver that I believe could control a satellite if it wanted, is a standard record player.  

Call me old fashioned, but part of what I love about playing records is the process: pouring over the details of the large cover art, carefully pulling the record of its sleeve, blowing off the needle and lying the vinyl down on the turntable to cue up the song.  Then flip!  Playing music used to be an engaging hands-on process for the listener.  Sadly, those days are gone along with the “B-sides” that no longer exist for us die hard fans who loved the traditionally un-radio worthy gems.  (CDs have squished all the tracks together, letting our little secret out of the bag!)  We can’t hold that against the compact disk though, because of the precise digital reproduction, the high quality and longer shelf life of the music we love.  But readers, between you an’ me, I kind of like the scratchy warmth the LPs I grew up playing.

Guy, you want to hear 80 minutes of straight music flip-free and I respect that.  So to answer your question in the most realistic terms, your best bet is to purchase the CD.    Mr. Data and I have been through the LP conversion process for some of my Dads rare vintage vinyl and my consensus is it was difficult and entirely too time consuming to be worth it.  

There is software available that will do the task. We used Sound Forge, a recording program from Sony with an affordable beginner package.  The frustrating thing about home conversion is the additional noise that is produced while trying to record.  The general noise from record cracking is expected and can be removed with a decent noise filter.  The problem is the white noise produced by every piece of equipment along the recording chain, this is: the turntable, the receiver, the cables, the sound card and the computer.    Unless you’re using professional equipment, this will generate a low signal to noise ratio, meaning - less signal and more noise.  This complicates the process and is where things can get expensive.  

On top of equipment costs, I judge projects in measurements of time.  What is my time worth compared to purchasing?  Records have to be recorded in real time and monitored for problems.  Start to finish, we’d spend an average of 3 hours per album for sub par quality.  Three hours of my time vs. $15 for a new CD?  Not a tough decision.

It is understandable that, like my Dad, you may have some albums that just aren’t available commercially.  In this case, I would recommend a professional service that will give your treasured tunes the treatment they deserve.  Expect to pay around $30 an album.

Guy, if you have the time and want to do it for fun, there is a very thorough 13 page tutorial written by Gabriel Torres on www.hardwaresecrets.com.  Just search for “lp conversion”.   (http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/1)


Good luck!

Heather Hamilton is the Prima Data. She knows your computers and that Camptowns racetrack's five miles long, oh de doo-da day.  





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Barry Hufker

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2007, 08:57:46 PM »

Annie,

Pardon me for not answering your question.  But I hope you'll emphasize the need for a phono preamp.  That's implied in "the reciever" but it is a must in case one thinks the process is directly turntable to computer.

Best,

Barry
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dcollins

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2007, 12:51:37 AM »

Annie wrote on Sat, 03 February 2007 17:25

Soooo i write a tech column and recently i had a reader ask me a question about home recording lps to cds.  I'm sure it's been covered elsewhere, but I wanted to throw my rough draft answer up here to see if anyone agrees or has suggestions.



http://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-AT-LP2DA-LP-to-Digital- Recording-System/dp/B000MEYVIG

DC

rollmottle

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2007, 01:47:23 AM »

pop/click elimination software ruins the sound of a vinyl to digi encode IMO. it never sounds right after the de-pop. sounds unnatural. i'd rather hear the vinyl clicks and pops than hear the scrubbed version.
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Annie

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2007, 02:10:55 PM »

awesome.  

it's pretty rare that i can have a second set of eyes and not so rare that i need one!

thanks a lot. I'll be including all of this info.
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compasspnt

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2007, 09:08:38 AM »

What Dave said.

Also, sometimes the CD version has been ultramaximised in loudness, and therefore doesn't sound as good.

And I'm sure you'll be proofreading, but are you sure you were "pouring" over details...(amongst other things)...?
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Fletcher

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2007, 12:42:03 PM »

Annie wrote on Sat, 03 February 2007 20:25

Soooo i write a tech column and recently i had a reader ask me a question about home recording lps to cds.  I'm sure it's been covered elsewhere, but I wanted to throw my rough draft answer up here to see if anyone agrees or has suggestions.


You're being more pessimistic than necessary... 3 hours per record, I don't think so.

I've been transfering a bunch of vinyl to computer from there to CD and sometimes out to my iPod.

The path is turntable to phono pre.  Phono pre to Apogee "Mini-Me" Analog to Digital converter... out of the "Mini-Me" via USB into iTunes as a Wav file... from there, burn a CD or convert to AIFF for iPod use.

Total time of conversion... maybe 5 minutes longer than it takes to listen to the vinyl.  I name the tracks, artist, etc. in iTunes and it transfers to the CDR without a struggle.

Unless you're looking at something like the CEDAR "de-noise" unit most of the other "de-noise" programs are pretty destructive to the audio [and the CEDAR costs about as much as a car so I'm sure that is out of the question] so I don't bother to "de-noise" anything... just play the record and get what I get... which usually still sounds better than the "digitally remastered" reissue CD.

As always, YMMV.

Peace.
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CN Fletcher

mwagener wrote on Sat, 11 September 2004 14:33
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If you've spent most of your life with a few thousand dollars worth of musicians in the studio, making a decision every second and a half... and you and  they are going to have to live with it for the rest of your lives, you'll get pretty arrogant too.  It takes a certain amount of balls to do that... something around three"
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garret

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2007, 12:54:26 PM »

If you're on windows, waveknife is a free program that chops up long wave files by detecting the gaps.  Works a charm.... you can digitize each side of the vinyl, and have waveknife make separate waves for each track in just a few seconds.

http://www.spacetaxi.de/sf/waveknife.html
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Fibes

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2007, 02:14:16 PM »

garretg wrote on Tue, 06 February 2007 12:54

If you're on windows, waveknife is a free program that chops up long wave files by detecting the gaps.  Works a charm.... you can digitize each side of the vinyl, and have waveknife make separate waves for each track in just a few seconds.

http://www.spacetaxi.de/sf/waveknife.html


Toast (MAC) has a function like this too. So did Peak LE.




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maxim

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2007, 08:35:14 PM »

terry wrote:

"amongst other things)...?"

yes, are you aware that the track from camptown to merryall (the alleged race track) is only 2 miles long?...

http://www.roadsidethoughts.com/12/c12_5137200.htm
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Annie

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2007, 08:48:04 PM »

maxim wrote on Tue, 06 February 2007 20:35

terry wrote:

"amongst other things)...?"

yes, are you aware that the track from camptown to merryall (the alleged race track) is only 2 miles long?...

http://www.roadsidethoughts.com/12/c12_5137200.htm


shit.

Very Happy
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Annie

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2007, 08:54:15 PM »

[quote title=Fletcher wrote on Tue, 06 February 2007 12:42]
Annie wrote on Sat, 03 February 2007 20:25



You're being more pessimistic than necessary... 3 hours per record, I don't think so.

I've been transfering a bunch of vinyl to computer from there to CD and sometimes out to my iPod.

The path is turntable to phono pre.  Phono pre to Apogee "Mini-Me" Analog to Digital converter... out of the "Mini-Me" via USB into iTunes as a Wav file... from there, burn a CD or convert to AIFF for iPod use.

Total time of conversion... maybe 5 minutes longer than it takes to listen to the vinyl.  I name the tracks, artist, etc. in iTunes and it transfers to the CDR without a struggle.

Unless you're looking at something like the CEDAR "de-noise" unit most of the other "de-noise" programs are pretty destructive to the audio [and the CEDAR costs about as much as a car so I'm sure that is out of the question] so I don't bother to "de-noise" anything... just play the record and get what I get... which usually still sounds better than the "digitally remastered" reissue CD.

As always, YMMV.

Peace.


Thanks.

i like your method.


And it's true, i rounded up, lots.

But, my audience reads the newspapers daily.  Usually in their 50's to 80's and just learning about computers. So it would take them that long, or longer.  

(guess i shouldda mentioned that.)
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compasspnt

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2007, 09:28:33 PM »

maxim wrote on Tue, 06 February 2007 20:35

terry wrote:

"amongst other things)...?"

yes, are you aware that the track from camptown to merryall (the alleged race track) is only 2 miles long?...

http://www.roadsidethoughts.com/12/c12_5137200.htm


O doo dah day 2 U 2...
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maxdimario

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Re: lps to cds
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2007, 05:56:46 AM »

it makes more sense to buy the cd's in 99.9% of the cases as far as sound.

hopefully the gear used by record companies to transfer the master into digital is better than the AD converter etc. that someone may have at home.

I second the fact that noise reduction ruins records..

it makes casual listening easier without clicks and pops but it sucks the life out of the recordings because it screws up transients.

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