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Author Topic: IMP9 begins.  (Read 10161 times)

chrisj

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #45 on: January 06, 2007, 10:37:24 pm »

Then I guess the challenge is spelled out.

Make these guys sound like awesome. Not 'correct': awesome.

Okeydokey Smile

Nizzle

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #46 on: January 06, 2007, 10:40:24 pm »

chrisj wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 03:37

Then I guess the challenge is spelled out.

Make these guys sound like awesome. Not 'correct': awesome.

Okeydokey Smile



I wonder if this is only one guy and NOT a band...kinda sounds that way to me, but I don't know squat.

-t
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henchman

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #47 on: January 06, 2007, 10:58:25 pm »

Nizzle wrote on Sat, 06 January 2007 19:27




Any idea how many important records you would have wiped out of existence with the sort of hard line narrow mindedness expressed above?

Look - I get it - you don't like this music. Fine , Cool...End it there. You know - I remember listening to the Pixies "Surfer Rosa", the first Stooges record an the Velvet Underground for the first time and I Fricken Hated them.
-t


Again, I disagree. There's some great playing on all of those records. Perfect? Maybe not. But definitely great.

Tom C

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #48 on: January 07, 2007, 07:29:39 am »

I'm listening to the song for the first couple of times now
and I think it's the perfect song for what J.Hall wants us see to
learn: the differences between the technical aspects of a song
and the vibe of it.
Throwing some plugs at it and comping the live out of it is
something everyone can do (heck, even I can do that on a good day).

But finding out what the song is all about and support the vibe
of that (especially without any feedback from the artist) is the
hard part and something we'll all benefit from in the long run.

The fact that the song has started this controversial discussion
shows that it's a perfect learning example for that.

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Tom

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Vladislavs Korehovs

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #49 on: January 07, 2007, 08:38:39 am »

Hello,

Well, i haven't said i didn't like this song and Indie rock. Moreover my mix is using Indie mixing approaches, which in my oppinion still need to be developed among engeneers...

What makes Indie rock different from just Rock in my oppinion is a DELAY Layer on guitars and more ambient mixes with Reverb. Also Cymbals have special treatment and usually have reverb and delay also.

What makes Indie Rock musically different is a:
  1) Drums Playing non straight patterns: for example "I. I. I"
  2) Live feeling in play.
  3) Playing inner melodies (guitar arpegios) which rytmically comping with piano and with drums.
  4) Harmony vocabulary is much broad then in Rock music.
     for example 4 note chords come into play, so all theory
     about rootless voicing, tritone substitution, taken from
     Jazz music comes into the play now.
NEW: All this means what Indie musicians should be quite skilled, of couse if they want to produce something interesting.

I don't feel arranging of this song was following this.
It is more easy to drop some garbage on track (like we have at the end) then trying comping rytmical elements.

Is a Live playing synonym for Sloppy playing?
I don't think.

My drums just swing aroud, thats i don't like.
My guitar makes much mess in Delay layer, because if you apply delay to something plaed very loosely, then this will take very much attention.

I'm still wont edit anything, because editing is boring process:)))

Is this track Indie rock?
Well i don't know: It can be Indie rock or Plain Rock or just piece of garbage, this all is depending on Engeneer in this case...
What engeneer cannot do, is to make it PERFECT indie rock.

What i like in songs with few tracks what they are more challenging because every track should sound perfect.
What i don't like:
With few tracks we don't have arranging choise and cannot select Arranging functions(Foundation, PAD, Rytm, Solo) among the tracks... Moreover in this case we are lucking well defined functions in song arrangement.


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Tom C

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #50 on: January 07, 2007, 09:35:20 am »

Vladislavs Korehovs wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 14:38

Hello,

Moreover my mix is using Indie mixing approaches, which in my oppinion still need to be developed among engeneers...




A mix is a mix is a mix.

Why should I mix an album from an independent band any different?
Remember Indie isn't a style (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indie_rock for details).


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Nizzle

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #51 on: January 07, 2007, 09:51:30 am »

Tom C wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 14:35

Vladislavs Korehovs wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 14:38

Hello,

Moreover my mix is using Indie mixing approaches, which in my oppinion still need to be developed among engeneers...




A mix is a mix is a mix.

Why should I mix an album from an independent band any different?
Remember Indie isn't a style (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indie_rock for details).






What he said....The last thing we need are rules that dictate how one mixes a certain style of music.

-t
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scottoliphant

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #52 on: January 07, 2007, 10:52:22 am »

Quote:

What makes Indie Rock musically different is a:
1) Drums Playing non straight patterns: for example "I. I. I"
2) Live feeling in play.
3) Playing inner melodies (guitar arpegios) which rytmically comping with piano and with drums.
I don't feel arranging of this song was following this.
It is more easy to drop some garbage on track (like we have at the end) then trying comping rytmical elements.


the fact that most music now doesn't sound like "live feeling in play" says something. furthermore, not really sure any artists sit down and try to write an "indie" song using the above list. unless you are some washed up songwriter trying to get the new kids on the block to sound "indie". kind of funny

henchman

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #53 on: January 07, 2007, 01:21:57 pm »

scottoliphant wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 07:52



Furthermore, not really sure any artists sit down and try to write an "indie" song using the above list.


Maybe not. But when it coems to recording, I myself have dealt with bands who will do things so they sound more "Indie".

rankus

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #54 on: January 07, 2007, 01:55:32 pm »

Nizzle wrote on Sat, 06 January 2007 19:40



I wonder if this is only one guy and NOT a band...kinda sounds that way to me, but I don't know squat.

-t


I'm thinking this may be a live off the floor one shot deal... There's vocal leakage in the drums...

At first I thought: These guys can't play too great, but what a great song... so it don't matter..

Regarding editing: I was "hired" to do the mixing not editing... If they wanted it edited I would have called and asked, and if they did I would have charged extra for that...
(Hate editing, I'm oldskool)
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gatino

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #55 on: January 07, 2007, 11:56:00 pm »

there's digital distortion (static noise?) in the original "vox" file.

i'll finish the mix and send it as is since there is nothing one can do about it. kind of disappointing. Sad

i can't imagine this is supposed to be part of the challenge.
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iCombs

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #56 on: January 08, 2007, 12:36:16 am »

gatino wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 22:56

there's digital distortion (static noise?) in the original "vox" file.

i'll finish the mix and send it as is since there is nothing one can do about it. kind of disappointing. Sad

i can't imagine this is supposed to be part of the challenge.



Hey man, I've touched WAY worse.  This is a pretty limited challence, all things considered.  I remember one band brought in tracks to me so we could finish overdubs and vocals and mix everything. Their previous engineer was a recording school dink (no offense to anyone who has gone to a recording school, so long as you aren't a dink) who really did not do a very good job, and what's more, foisted some of his mixes on me in the tracks he sent...i.e., he printed all his effects to the individual tracks even though I specifically asked for raw tracks.  He had the most horrid gates on the snare and kick.  It took a fair amount of work, but I managed to make something of it, but it was one of those situations where it was like, man, what else can I really do?  I just did what I could and did the best I could with what I had...it turned out okay, but if I would have gotten what I asked for, it would have been a shitload better.  

This project is at least well delivered and well recorded.  It seems like the song and performances are up for debate, but at least the engineering is well taken care of.
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chrisj

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #57 on: January 08, 2007, 01:36:47 am »

I'm actually a Pixies nut so I understood the crazy distorted stuff immediately. Hope I did it justice. I went absolutely nuts. Maybe it's glorious. I can't wait for upload day- and I did NOT limit the 2-buss, I have a hellbroth of saturation, mix compression and slew limiting on there instead Wink

I hope J likes it. Feel like I wasted my J slot on the piano/vox one Wink not that it was wasted with what I learned...

Vladislavs Korehovs

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #58 on: January 08, 2007, 05:21:29 am »

I've edited my message, now you have 4-th, i would call "advisory" rule. Laughing

i'm looking forward to hear all mixes, and comment:)

By the way i've read your referenced Wikipedia:)))))))))), and "although the term is often used to reference the sound of specific bands and the bands they have influenced" i think i just used it in this way to reference Coldplay.

I think it is just early phase of Indie style, so it will have some time to stabilize, and i hope what my rules will remain, or i will be dissapointed in Rock music, this will be not a music anymore but a "protest" like it was with Black Metal for example, there music is the least important factor.
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gatino

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Re: IMP9 begins.
« Reply #59 on: January 08, 2007, 06:00:53 am »

iCombs wrote on Sun, 07 January 2007 23:36


Hey man, I've touched WAY worse.  


i'm sure. it's just everyhing i did brought it out more.

i'd like to know what others did esp. considering the lead track had the noise.

i liked all the other intentional noise. Smile
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