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Author Topic: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?  (Read 14632 times)

rankus

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Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« on: November 25, 2006, 02:12:46 pm »


Well this in the budget section cuz I'm on the cheap here...

I have a metal band with two kick drums coming in for an album soon, and I only have one NS10 "mic"....

So I'm looking for a speaker that can be used as an alternative to the NS10 driver because they are getting rare and expensive... I know I can just try some speakers, but I will have to probably buy one, because I just don't have any old speakers lying around right now.

Any suggestions?
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compasspnt

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2006, 05:23:26 pm »


A Microphone.
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PaulyD

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2006, 10:33:42 pm »

The word on the street is the NS-10 mic thing was started by Michael Wagener, and, when Yamaha saw what he was doing, developed the SubKick. Pictures of them with the cover off reveal a driver that looks a lot like the one in an NS-10, but gray colored. Never tried one, but have heard nothing but good things about them. Most places sell it for $300 USD.

Paul

Fibes

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2006, 12:25:08 am »

IMO the speaker works WITH a mic not solo.

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Fibes
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Dave Martin

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2006, 02:09:18 pm »

PaulyD wrote on Sat, 25 November 2006 21:33

The word on the street is the NS-10 mic thing was started by Michael Wagener, and, when Yamaha saw what he was doing, developed the SubKick.  good things about them. Most places sell it for $300 USD.

Paul


Well, except that Michael uses a Fostex woofer, and has for years...

I know of engineers using speakers on kick drums back as far as the 1970's, when they would simply roll an Ampeg B15 cabinet in front of the kick and take the output of that into a DI; it's really not that new of a concept. but taking that as a starting point, there's no reason that you can't try any cabinet that has only one speaker in it - a 1x12, or a 1x18 and connect it to a DI with a guitar cord; it'll either make you smile or it won't... Anc certainly you can try any raw speaker (Michaels subkick is a bare speaker mounted on an aluminum frame) as well, as long as you can jury-rig some method of keeping it in position.
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wwittman

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2006, 03:32:59 pm »

compasspnt wrote on Sat, 25 November 2006 17:23


A Microphone.




Damn! he beat me to it again!

It FASCINATES me that the people who seem to think they need a mud-only 'microphone' to pick up sub-sonic frequencies, seem to be the same people who think they need to filter the bottom out of all of their sounds to "make them fit"!


how much information below the range of, say, an RE20 do you NEED from the bass drum?

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Fibes

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2006, 04:31:51 pm »

Yeah, in todays world of the shoehorn style mix and occassional tap with a DBX SubHarmonic synth or a multed track with a high passed signal is PLENTY.

Or that triggered 808 gated and triggered...

Havene't done any of it in quite a while.
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Fibes
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Podgorny

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2006, 10:11:17 pm »

wwittman wrote on Sun, 26 November 2006 14:32

It FASCINATES me that the people who seem to think they need a mud-only 'microphone' to pick up sub-sonic frequencies, seem to be the same people who think they need to filter the bottom out of all of their sounds to "make them fit"!



Have you ever actually tried a subkick?

It really works quite well.

But judging by the fact that you're still using an RE20 on kick, I assume you're not going for that kind of thing.

All I know is, I haven't used a kick drum sample on any rock stuff I've done in the last year.
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"Nobody cares what the impedance is; all they care about is when you can walk into the room, set up a mic, turn the knobs, hit record, and make everybody go 'wow.'"

James Duncan

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2006, 09:50:08 am »

I get what William is saying *philosophically*, but once you hear what one of these bastards does to the sound of a kick drum, you will see what it can do!!!

It adds a special "something" to the kick. That is all I can say.
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compasspnt

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2006, 11:38:17 am »


Something is better than nothing.
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Tim Halligan

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #10 on: November 27, 2006, 11:47:43 am »

James Duncan wrote on Mon, 27 November 2006 22:50

I get what William is saying *philosophically*, but once you hear what one of these bastards does to the sound of a kick drum, you will see what it can do!!!

It adds a special "something" to the kick. That is all I can say.


I "get" both sides.

One wonders if this subkick bizzo will merely become the next fad that gets abandoned in the search for even louder records.

Cheers,
Tim
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Spiritwalkerpro

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #11 on: November 27, 2006, 11:48:17 am »

I agree I like the subkick, but I do use a second mic in case I need a little more twack.

Norm
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Dave Martin

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2006, 12:10:02 pm »

I like 'em, and use one. But I can certainly get a drum sound I like without it.... index.php/fa/3780/0/

That's a Yamaha Sub-kick in the picture.
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rankus

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2006, 02:09:16 pm »


Um,  Yes of course I use a real mic as well... I usually use a 57 , 421, or recently purchased D6 inside the drum.... Sometimes within an inch or two of the beater for some "point"

My question was not "what is a sub kick mic" ...  Rolling Eyes

It was "what alternative woofers" have folks used as a mic in place of an NS10 that is not too expensive.... (Somebody mentioned a Fostex driver... thank you) (I don't want to buy another NS10 driver)

The earliest I have heard of using a speaker as a mic was the Beatles when they tried one on Sir Paul's bass ... Dunno what their success was.

I have heard of folks using them on guitar amps and bass amps as well.... (Recent John Mayer album of all places)
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Rick Welin - Clark Drive Studios http://www.myspace.com/clarkdrivestudios

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Podgorny

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Re: Alternatives to NS10 as Mic?
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2006, 03:32:04 pm »

Just for the sheer fun of it, I've tried the Subkick on Kick Drum, Floor Tom, Bass Amp, and Heavy Guitars.

IMHO, it's completely useless for anything other than kick.  But it sure is great on kick.
We have a few NS10 woofers (aside from the ones in the NS10s), and I prefer them to the subkick, but any sonic benefit is far outweighed by the Subkick's ease of placement.

As far as what other woofers you could use, just about any woofer that isn't too stiff should work.  I imagine a smaller speaker (8" or less, with a small voice coil) would probably be a little more manageable, both in sound and placement.  What about something like this?

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"Nobody cares what the impedance is; all they care about is when you can walk into the room, set up a mic, turn the knobs, hit record, and make everybody go 'wow.'"
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