Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[J.J. Blair]

The B has a thinner diaphragm that the C?  Do you have a technical sheet that says that?  That's fascinating, as I had never heard that.  I thought it was just the grill style, and they were identical, like the SM57 and SM58.

[panman]

J.J.,it is the other way: C has a thinner diaphragm. It is also of a different shape. D24 has the same diaphragm as D19C. Likewise D17/M411 has the same thick blue diaphragm as D19B.
This is not mentioned in the tech-sheets though, but I have been repairing some D19:s(about 15), that I take this to be so. I did not see any exceptions of this. Judging from your(J.J.) earier posting, it used to be possible to buy a replacement inner element and it of course fitted all models, so it resulted some mixing up of what is original in what model.
Regards,
       Esa

[J.J. Blair]

Thanks, Esa!  That makes sense, actually.

BTW, I don't know if I mentioned it earlier, I have been told by somebody who knew quite a bit about these mics that when the elements were made and QC'd the ones that tested the best became D24s, and that's how those were selected.  

BTW, are you fixing D19s with severed coils?  I have people asking all the time who can fix theirs for them, and I never know who to send them to.  

[panman]

J.J. Blair wrote on Sat, 26 April 2008 19:42

I have been told by somebody who knew quite a bit about these mics that when the elements were made and QC'd the ones that tested the best became D24s, and that's how those were selected.

I`ve heard this too, but not really comfirmed and I don`t believe it to be so either. D19C,B and D24 were released and marketed parallel. D24 was more expensive than the D19:s. Clearly D24 was considered to be a better mic by AKG. D19 and D24 capsules allthough very similar are not exactly the same. One difference is in that D24 capsule has three screws attaching the top plate, but d19 has only two screws. And the D24 capsule is in general of better crafting(by the looks)and I assume it also to be made according to tighter tolerances. Even the paper-rings to adjust the diaphragms are of better material. It is interesting too, that the reflector in front of the diaphragm in 24 is of steel and stays on place because of the pull of capsule magnet. D19:s have a reflector, that looks the same, but made of aluminium. If it makes a difference, I don`t know, but in theory it means an extended magnetic field and could be of some influence. Anyway D24 has a more transparent responcy-curve than D19. Very nice, but then again it is lacking that special character of D19:s, that we all seem to love. D24 simply is not that special.

Quote:

BTW, are you fixing D19s with severed coils?

Yes, that`s what I do among others.
Regards,
      Esa

[J.J. Blair]

I completely disagree about the sound of the D24s.  Of my stable of D19s, D119s and D24s, one of my D24s is in my top 3.

In general, I find them to be virtually interchangeable.  

When you say talk about the steel rings, are you comparing it to D19s of the same vintage?  Maybe, like with C12 grills that started out as steel and then became aluminum, it was a change that occurred, and early examples of D19s might be steel as well.  That seems rather plausible, considering that there's another example of the, changing materials from steel to aluminum.  

[rodabod]

J.J. Blair wrote on Sat, 26 April 2008 21:53

I completely disagree about the sound of the D24s.  Of my stable of D19s, D119s and D24s, one of my D24s is in my top 3.

I agree - they all sound very similar. The sound is in the capsule.

The D24s are certainly made better. Some of the D19s are crap inside. And sometimes the paper spacers are glued which makes them almost impossible to repair.

I have quite a lot of these mics (I picked them up before the price  went sky high) but I haven't found anything that they sound particularly good on. They have quite a unique sound on voice though due to their presence peak.

[panman]

J.J. Blair wrote on Sat, 26 April 2008 22:53

I completely disagree about the sound of the D24s.  Of my stable of D19s, D119s and D24s, one of my D24s is in my top 3. In general, I find them to be virtually interchangeable.

J.J.,Could you specify the first two sentences a bit?. I can sign the last sentence depending on the tolerance of the word "virtually". And I can only talk about those I have tested. To me there are differences, not big, but e.g. D24 has a bit more bass and a bit less midrange peak. I would descibe it slightly smoother. These minimal differences are also evident in the sound-curves. Then again, there is +/-3dB(!) tolerance on those AKG-curves and taken that into consideration, they all really fit within the same specs. By the way, did  you ever check, what diaphragms those mics have? Do they really have origninals? What is the diaphragm of D119 like? Never saw one yet.    

Quote:

When you say talk about the steel rings, are you comparing it to D19s of the same vintage?

At least judging fom the serial numbers of D19:s I have had a wide selection of different vintages passing by. All had aluminium reflectors. D24:s are more rare and I have only ever tested and opened three of them. One was with XLR, so I take it to be a later vintage, but all three had steel reflectors.
Regards,
      Esa

[J.J. Blair]

Rod said:

I have quite a lot of these mics (I picked them up before the price went sky high) but I haven't found anything that they sound particularly good on.

Rod, they are quite frankly my favorite snare and tom mic.  I also quite like them for rock and roll type piano, where it has to be more aggressive.

Esa, I think what I mean is that there is so much variation between all of my D19s, that within the variations in sound, the D24s are interchangeable.  But they all have a distinct personality.  The only real consistency is in my D119s.

Ken Scott used my mics to record that Beatles sample CD, and he felt that that D119s weren't as good as the D19s.  I can't say that I totally agree.  I have a couple D19/24s that are outstanding, but I'm sure it's some defect that caused that.  LOL.

[Gabriel F]

i cant believe that making those mics again akg wont make a profit.
that could only means they are making cheap crap with 5000% profit.
i mean how hard could it be to build a 50 years old mic with today automated machines

[panman]

rodabod wrote on Sun, 27 April 2008 02:15

but I haven't found anything that they sound particularly good on.

Hi Roddy, D19:s and D24:s are exellent and among the best mics for close-micing steelpans. They are a good choise especially for the higher register pans like sopranos. Turn the ring to "S" and you hear some magic happening. Steelpans have a natural ring in the sound,that most other mics tend to filter away and you cannot give it back properly with any effects afterwards. No such problem with these mics though.
It is also a curious thing, that they fit for some male singers. A friend of mine was once looking for a mic actually for his wife and I let him test my mics randomly. But when he tried a D19C he was like obsessed and wanted to buy it. I did not want to, but I had to sell it, because it made him sound so much better. They don`t seem to fit my voice(s)though.
Regards,
       Esa

[rodabod]

I'll need to try my D19s/variants on a few things it seems. I couldn't really think in my head what they might work with, especially since in my opinion, they don't have the best low-end out there.

JJ, I'm interested in the suggestion of snare since the presence peak could work nicely there. Last weekend I used you favourite tom mic ( ), the MD421 on a snare which was nice, but there was too much hihat bleed for my liking since the hats were very loud. I wonder how the D19's pattern would work there. I should maybe experiment with hypercardioids more.

Does anyone know how to remove the grill from a D119 by the way? I quite fancy a look inside.

[J.J. Blair]

I had a Tuchel version of the D119 that I took apart, but it was a few years ago and I don't remember the trick.  The switch was actually sort of a problem.  

[simolino]

some answers to questions all over this topic,

the D19 and D24 are the same except that the D24 has the open lower mesh giving the mic some more bass...we spoke about the rear sound entry effect in the 409/gdsm200 topic.

The D19 wasn`t exactly cheap back then, it was that some others were more expensive
a `65 price list shows 149,00 german marks for the D19 and 475,00!!! for the D24

D19 variations:
D19B = 1st version with golden grill , 200ohm
D19BK = 1st version  ''   ''    ''      200 ohm with fixed cable
D19BK Hi = golden grill, unbalanced hi-z , fixed cable
D19C 2nd version, 200ohm , DIN connector
D19E 2nd version era, 5-pol XLR connector , 50/200/hi-z
D19C2 '''' '''''''''' 7-pol HF shielded connector

Tool up for an exact reissue will not be cheap, on the other hand there are 100`s of reissue products on the market but people still go for the original

[MagnetoSound]

rodabod wrote on Mon, 28 April 2008 01:03

I'm interested in the suggestion of snare since the presence peak could work nicely there.

Ringo.

[J.J. Blair]

Nick, thanks for the excellent info.  I have one correction, though.  The BK is 1kΩ, hence the "K" designation.  At least all the ones I've seen are.