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Author Topic: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques  (Read 16263 times)

KAyo

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Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« on: July 13, 2011, 10:28:51 am »

Here we go. Wump – 23 Techniques

If you've finished with the listening and commenting page, then, let’s divulge our mastering approaches taken and why so ..

Apart from the settings, do take us slightly into the mind of the man behind the machine, regarding the approach. It just makes for better reading.

Cheers,
KAyo
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MoreSpaceEcho

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2011, 01:30:52 pm »

ok, my mind was saying "do this as quickly as possible and don't get bogged down in second guessing". i don't know about you guys, but i  really don't enjoy mastering stuff that i mixed...i just try and get it over with....

since i was going fast i didn't write anything down, but from memory it was:
sonoris eq -1.3 at 160? 180? somewhere around there. 1/2 octave q. this might've been on the M only but i think it was L/R.

out via lavry black into drawmer 1961, +1@3.2, +1@10, wide q for both.

drawmer 1969, 20ms attack, release was either 100ms fixed, or 200ms variable, meters just barely twitching.

fatso...input set very conservatively so it wasn't doing much. i think i had the 'warmth' kicking in a little bit on the louder cymbal crashes

back to digi via lavry blue, i let a few of the snares clip a little.

elephant, AIGC3, faster, 50% linked, 4x oversampling, 2db GR.

wavelab internal dither, no noise shaping.

Patrik_T

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2011, 04:10:57 pm »

...
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KAyo

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2011, 11:39:38 pm »

I too wanted to keep it somewhat straight… apart from the plug-in debacle swap etc..
Preferences, was for the midrange tangle clean up and also for the high range to be smoothened out too, with a scoop at some point into the lower mid range etc..
Compress lightly and use very little limiter, if any. Find the gain via Input/ Output modules etc..
Also, watch out for Vocals and that it always stayed poking out.

I had a better time with the TCMD3 into the Masterpiece II, but, since I was judged on the submission, the settings below speaks the process.

Playback via Wavelab >> RME 800FW >>

into the Redline plug >
Low Pass: 37hz
124hz > Gain 1.8 > Q1.8
280hz > Gain -1.4 > Q0.77
1612hz > Gain 0.8 > Q0.78
4800hz > Gain 1.1 > Q0.44
High Pass: 18461hz

into the Masterpiece II >
Input Gain 2.2db

1515 EQ module
600hz > Gain 2 > Q2.0
310hz > Gain 2.5 > Q3.5

Tape Texture
Mid Only
slopes @ 200hz & 2.0khz

1900 Compressor Module
Mid and Low band only
Threshold -15db
Attack 60 mS
Release 175 mS
Ratio 2.1
Soft knee ON

Output Gain 2.1
HPF 60hz
LPF 12hz

>> RME 800FW >> Capture 44.16
No Dither


Thanks to all.
Always, glad to be part of the WUMP’s.

Ciao’
KAyo
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Herbeck

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2011, 12:50:13 am »

My big mistake this time is that I wanted to tryout a few things.
I changed the settings on my sub, I wanted a little more low end(on my mastering).
I used a few notches on a harsh demo with some success a while ago, I wanted to try that again.
I've made a new plugin that I just had to try on this song.
Well, of these three things the plugin made the least damage, it may even helped the mix a little.

SRC to 176,4

The EQ:
-2db@200 Q71    -1db@2,7kHz notch    -1db@4kHz notch
low-shelf 3,5db@125Hz    1,3db@1,5kHz Q71    4db@35kHz Q35


The new plugin (I call it color):
This plugin adds color and/or saturation at any frequency and any amount, without changing the frequency.
Using a kind of convolution technique for the coloring part.

Added some color of a Massive Passive at 400Hz just for the hell of it.
Added saturation at 2,5kHz to push the vocal a little.


The limiter:
Non brick wall mode
Channels linked
Fast attack and release (maybe to fast)

SRC to 44,1

I think I used the POW-r 3 in Samplitude for dithering.


Conclusion: developing and tweaking plugins and stuff is fun, but it takes a lot of time and energy to do it.
I need to change focus a little and spend more time on the actual mastering part.

Cheers,

Herbeck
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Patrik_T

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2011, 04:19:25 am »

...
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KAyo

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2011, 11:34:54 am »

The record option in Wavelab ask's, what sample rate and bit depth. That's the one I use, if recording in Wavelab instead of Sequoia etc.. and if, it is a 24bit I am collecting as a 44/16, then one would hope RME's got that dither covered.

Thanks Patrik_T, for prompting the intrigue. Will investigate further.

KAyo
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MoreSpaceEcho

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2011, 02:16:02 pm »

why not capture at 24 bit?

Viitalahde

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2011, 05:09:05 pm »

OK, here's mine.

My first impression was that the mix sounded good, and I found no major issues with it. Still, since there was a lot happening at the same time, I wanted to focus the sound a little. Like Patrik, I found the mix to be vulnerable to EQ, and I tried very minimal settings (because I still felt these things needed to be done!) but ended up doing quite a bit, compared to my usual gig. In a nutshell, I wanted the sound to groove a little around the  bass guitar and have the midrange be a bit more cracking.

The settings go like this:

BPEQ:

31Hz, -4dB, shelf (6dB/oct)
82Hz, +1.5dB Q2
1k75, +1.5dB, Q1.4
8k90, +1dB, shelf (6dB/oct)

..into Knif Pure Mu compressor:

Input +8dB, threshold 7 (midway), ratio 2 (2nd lowest), SC filter 100Hz, attack 6 (midway), release 2 (2nd fastest), link 0, dual release off. The GR VU was swinging under -0.5dB mark most of the time, a couple of times hitting -1db.

..into Western Electric 111C repeat coils

Capture @ 44k1, cleaned heads and tails off. I think I was the only one in my group that cleaned the stick sound from the middle of the tail.

Some additional limiting with Fabfilter Pro-L: Input +1.4dB, transparent mode, lookahead 0,96, attack 6100, release 168, transient link 0%, release link 37%.

-0.2dB ceiling, dithering down to 16bit/44k1 with triangular spread noise.
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Twerk

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2011, 07:48:39 pm »

Upon first listen, I was pretty happy with the mix as it was, and didn't hear any glaring issues that I immediately wanted to correct. After a few listens I started to feel the upper frequencies could pop a little more, giving clarity to the percussion. I also wanted a little more weight in the bottom. It was also pretty important to maintain the physical impact/feeling of the drums and not fold them into the vocal with overuse of compression.

In the Daw:

FabFilter Pro-Q:
High Shelf 1.0dB at 5.75kHz with a Q of 0.122
+0.5dB at 40Hz Q 2.0
+1dB at 80Hz Q 2.0

Then out of the HEDD192 and into Foote Control Systems P3S ME (compressor):
RMS and A/R timing modes mixed with an attack of 8, release of 2, feedforward compression, threshold -8dB, ratio 1.05:1, HPF engaged, output gain +4dB, output transformers engaged. Not more than 0.25dB of compression at any given point.

Into Manley Massive Passive:
10 O'clock position at 1kHz - Q fully counter-clockwise
9 O'clock position at 2.7kHz - Q 12 O'clock

Into the Manley Vari-Mu:
Compression mode, input at 2 O'clock, output at 9 O'clock, slowest attack, max threshold, recovery in the middle position, HP SC engaged and linked channels. Barely saw the needles moving.

Back into the HEDD192 with the Pentode setting at 3, captured at 44.1/24

Cleaned up the beginning and end, and applied FabFilter Pro-L: dynamic mode, gain +1.5dB, lookahead 0.25ms, attack 4093ms, release 59ms, transient link 0%, release link 100%, 4x oversampling, 16bit dither (optimized noise shaping), Output 44.1/16  at -0.3dB



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KAyo

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #10 on: July 15, 2011, 01:01:15 am »

why not capture at 24 bit?

Big believer in capturing the sound at the intended target from analogue, without breaking the encasing again and applying dither and taking back to that delivery point. Over the years, I’ve concluded, unless otherwise… I prefer to capture it at the delivery target rate. Analogue is such a great medium to massage the audio, it acts as the best catalyst for sample rate or bit depth change. It’s not a hard and fast rule, in fact nothing is, it just sounds better to me, especially on this run.

Ciao'
KAyo
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MoreSpaceEcho

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #11 on: July 15, 2011, 02:24:56 am »

Quote from: Viitalahde
..into Western Electric 111C repeat coils

i don't even know what this means. what does this mean?

i love reading what you guys did. a question for you fabfilter folks...what's up with the limiter attack times? thousands of milliseconds?

Patrik_T

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2011, 11:47:09 am »

...
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ggidluck

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #13 on: July 15, 2011, 12:02:44 pm »

Quote
Western Electric 111C

Old telephone repeater coils. Transformer saturation ???

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Viitalahde

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Re: Wump - 23, Mastering Techniques
« Reply #14 on: July 15, 2011, 12:43:26 pm »

Old telephone repeater coils. Transformer saturation ???

Yes, they're transformers. But they will not saturate, I think I'll blow up my A/D converter before the transformer gives any sort of significant distortion.

Don't oversweat it, guys. The 111C's have only a very slight sonic stamp here, and the master could have well been done without it, too. I just like the way these things sound.

This is interesting. I initially found that either I had to let the EQ be out of the way or use all 5 available bands in order for nothing to "sink". I very much preferred the situation and sound of no EQ since the drift-from-mix became too much for me to accept.


Indeed. I remember the mix felt like it crumbled down easily, but when the EQ was right, it was right.

With mine, I'm still happy about the EQ. I shouldn't have crushed it this much though, and perhaps just leaving the limiter out would've helped. Doesn't sound too crushed, though.

Oh, I think I forgot to mention the D/A - A/D loop. I'm using the Crane Song HEDD192.
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Jaakko Viitalähde
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