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[MorningStar]

Fibes wrote on Tue, 09 May 2006 16:19

Cranky cranky cranky.

Forget your meds today???

[Fibes]

MorningStar wrote on Tue, 09 May 2006 16:42

Fibes wrote on Tue, 09 May 2006 16:19 Cranky cranky cranky.   Forget your meds today???

....just tired of the ITB vs OTB debate.

Quote:

I just hope you did what you thought was the right thing J. and worked from there. Isn't that what we get paid for? To make the decisions that most positively impact the end result while keeping in mind budget and all other contextual factors.

In this world there are those who find ways to make things happen and those who find ways to not make things happen. Both these conditions rear there heads in the conscious and sub-conscious realm.

Does that mean I don't prefer to mix on an API? No. It just means that when you play in one arena you best learn where the dead spots in the floor are or you're gonna end up suprised at the outcome.

[j.hall]

Fibes wrote on Tue, 09 May 2006 15:19

I just hope you did what you thought was the right thing J. and worked from there.

i always do what i feel is right.  what's the point of doing something that i myself don't agree with?

[Fibes]

j.hall wrote on Tue, 09 May 2006 17:28

Fibes wrote on Tue, 09 May 2006 15:19 I just hope you did what you thought was the right thing J. and worked from there.     i always do what i feel is right.  what's the point of doing something that i myself don't agree with?

Exactly.

There are some jobs that can benefit from one tool or another, WE should be making those decisions not the marketing folks and yes men.

Pick your tools because they are the right ones for the job.

[MorningStar]

Fibes wrote on Tue, 09 May 2006 16:57

MorningStar wrote on Tue, 09 May 2006 16:42 Fibes wrote on Tue, 09 May 2006 16:19 Cranky cranky cranky.   Forget your meds today??? ....just tired of the ITB vs OTB debate. Quote: I just hope you did what you thought was the right thing J. and worked from there. Isn't that what we get paid for? To make the decisions that most positively impact the end result while keeping in mind budget and all other contextual factors. In this world there are those who find ways to make things happen and those who find ways to not make things happen. Both these conditions rear there heads in the conscious and sub-conscious realm. Does that mean I don't prefer to mix on an API? No. It just means that when you play in one arena you best learn where the dead spots in the floor are or you're gonna end up suprised at the outcome.

Well that was kinda the point of the exercise here.... Everyone gets caught up in this ITB thing and summing boxes,etc.. but at the end of the day its the talent behind the board (or mouse) that determines the outcome.
I knew that J mixed those tunes in the box, I was hoping that we could spark a discusion here about this and show it starts with talent- then tools...
I think most of us have been guilty of thinking that "product x" is going to make me a better mixer.. but most times in the end if we just learned to use the tools we had, better, it would make a world of difference.              

[Fibes]

Quote:

I was hoping that we could spark a discusion here about this and show it starts with talent- then tools..

Me too.

That said, both methods require a very different approach and in a way skill set. The basics however still need to be there.

[John Ivan]

Fibes wrote on Tue, 09 May 2006 18:54

Quote: I was hoping that we could spark a discusion here about this and show it starts with talent- then tools.. Me too. That said, both methods require a very different approach and in a way skill set. The basics however still need to be there.

Yeah, Boy, I could not care less about how J. did this. He did it,it sound's cool, and that is the thing that matters.

I have ways of working that I prefer over other ways but , it always comes down to the talent behind the mics and the skill and artistry of the engineer. Pick your tools and go to work.

I am learning ITB mixing and while it is different, it's also the same.It's still audio.

JI..............................

[pg666]

care to confess which method you did use J?

i would be pretty surprised if it were done completely ITB. i would hope there was some analog bussing going on here. either that, or every ITB mix i've heard yet (and tried myself) really sucked.

[Fibes]

It was ITB.




It is what it is.

[garret]

My $0.02...  

Overall...
-- it's a great track, and a solid mix.. has some moments of greatness, and is almost there.  Good work!  I'm just going to make suggestions on stuff to tweak.  Don't take this feedback negatively...

The first minute...
-- lead vocal is too quiet
-- a couple times the singer's voice annoys me when he hits that really low note and holds it too long.  Use an envelope or something to fade those sustained notes out earlier.  I have the same problem with my voice when I get out of range, it's all-or-nothing.

-- there's a distracting hiss that rides the lead vocal... was it a noisy recording and thrown a heavy gate on it?   Maybe try some noise reduction on that track instead of a simple gate.

-- claps are too loud... I love em, but drop em quite a bit.

The transition around 0:60...
-- the level when the whole band kicks in is a bit of a shock, but maybe that's by design... I find if I have the first bit at a comfortable volume, I want to turn down my headphones when it kicks in.

1:45 or so...
-- vocals are too quiet

2:18 or so..
-- the vocal "seems the worst times..." has to go up... way up.  To my songwriter ears, that vocal is the payoff for the whole song.  Is that line doubled panned hard left and right?  I'm not much of a fan of doubling unless it's dead solid.  I'd rather hear one voice there, for such an important theme.  As is, I'm hearing the panned right vocal as reverb or something, and it's too affected for a theme so important to the tune.

Best,
-Garret

[j.hall]

it was summed on the big in stereo pairs that went like this.

kick
snare
drums L
drums R
Bass
Guitars L
Guitars R
Strings L
Strings R
Vocals L
Vocals R
FX L
FX R

all EQ, compression, FX, and automation were all performed ITB.

i set the console up to act like the phoenix nicerizer might to start getting a feel for if i can work this way.

to be honest guys, i like working this way better then any other method i've tried.

i can get mixes done very rapidly, and i can recall them very quickly.

when you have three projects going on at once, recall becomes a massive portion of keeping my clients happy and taken care of in a timely manner.

the mixes you heard have been very difficult, and my original schedule of 10 days is long gone.  so now i'm having to divide time across different projects in the attempt to stay on some sort of schedule.

with out the speed of PT recalls, i'd be sunk.

i think this record is sounding great.  i'm totally blown away at how PT is sounding.

[TheViking]

...knowing this kinda makes us guys who mix in the box all the time feel a bit more justified.   It's never the car...   always the driver.

If TLA mixed a record on a Behringer console it would still rule because it's TLA, right?

[rankus]

I only listened to the first song (hymnsong).

To me it sounds like the low end of the acoustic gtr and kick ambience are competing for space ... kind of a bit boomy... maybe high pass the acoustic a little higher up to open things up in the lower mids?  EQ the verb a bit?  Dunno...

Other than that is sounds pretty good!

[David Ballenger]

hmm... wrote on Sat, 06 May 2006 00:23

New here...is there a way to make the vocals more resonant?  Seem flat in affect.  Can some particular frequency be boosted to bring them out without changing the smooth aspect the singer seems to be favoring?  I've been playing around with mic placement on my vocals, has made a big difference.  As has changing the tone I sing ith until it 'speaks'....can (lack of this cutting tone) be compensated for at the mixing stage?  Nothing major, just wanted to bring the vocals out a bit without necessarily going whole hog with a level boost.  Just sort of felt a small level boost and some sort of eq or effect change would make it happen, maybe this isn't making sense....? but very good job, like the songs and the mixing thanks, pb

What he said.

[Phillip Graham]

j.hall wrote on Wed, 03 May 2006 13:09

critique j.hall's latest mix. http://www.thetarhythm.com/MixCritique/HymnSong1.mp3 the good, the bad and the ugly.  lets have it. i really want you guys to dive in and tear this one apart. i did not track or produce, i'm just the mixer.

Hey J.,

Listened to both.  The crazy sizzle on the cymbals in the first one bugs me, sounds like bad intermod on an RF system.  The low end feels a bit tubby, even on the crapola PC speakers here at my desk.

Handless Man, on the other hand, I really loved just the way it is. {Edit}Except that I really like the lyrics, and think the lead vocal line could come up at least .5dB.  Also the hihat is a bit much for the overall vibe{/Edit}

Can you disclose the name of the project?