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[bilco]

I am slowly getting some mics and other gear together for a really basic homestudio.  I am having to get one thing at a time and have about $250 for the next piece of the puzzle.  I keep waffling over what it is I need the most, because I need more than one thing (and I want a bunch of stuff that I probably don't need.)  What do you think is the most critical thing to get next with the $ I have?  

Goals:  

Songwriter Demos
Homegrown CD


What I Have Now:

DAW & Preamps:

PT LE 5.1 on a Dell PC
Basic PT plugins for EQ, dynamics, reverb
Digi001 w 2 stock mic preamps, 8 channels ADAT/lightpipe in, 6 analog line inputs
M-Audio Audio Buddy Preamp
Behringer ADA8000 w 8 mic/line inputs converted to digital into Digi001
Sansamp for Fender Pbass

Mics:

Shure SM58
Shure SM57
MXL603S
Rode NT1a
Audio Technica MB4000C Electret Condensor

Monitors:

Roland MA-8 micromonitors
AT ATH-M2X Headphones

What I don

[Tidewater]

Just a fast look over your list, but don't waste time with a 421 until you have completed your whole collection. They are ok on some stuff, but never my decided choice for anything.

You need an outboard compressor, at some point.

Buy ONLY the things you need, and learn as much as you can with what you have. Save money up, and buy very nice stuff that comes along at a deal.

Don't get one of everything, everything isn't the right thing. Until a couple years ago, most people had only seen ribbon mics in pictures.

RNC is a YES.


M

[maxim]

monitors

[plughead]

bilco wrote on Fri, 31 March 2006 01:35

I am slowly getting some mics and other gear together for a really basic homestudio.  I am having to get one thing at a time and have about $250 for the next piece of the puzzle.  I keep waffling over what it is I need the most, because I need more than one thing (and I want a bunch of stuff that I probably don't need.)  What do you think is the most critical thing to get next with the $ I have?   snip...

IMO,

Your budget is a bit too low to make substantial gains in any one dep't, except for an RNC (which I think is a good investment) - why not wait until you have a bit more to invest, and then put it towards something that will be a 'large' step up instead of just treading water? You have enough kit to be able to do basic home recording as it is - a $250 mic will not take your recordings to another level, and there are no compressors (save for the RNC) or mic pre's, and most importantly, monitors that meet your budget.

There is an upside tho: many people make music with less than you currently have, and limitations can be a good thing - there is no silver bullet for making great recordings, just experience, and being open to rethink things. That said, when you have the funds to invest, make wise decisions: buy ONCE - invest in gear that will hold it's value (good mic's/pre's/comp's/etc) or lose very little when you upgrade later.

Lastly - I agree with maxim: monitoring should be your first priority, tho that will more than likely cost substantially more than $250.00

All the best with it!

[Vertigo]

What kind of cabling are you using? If you're using Whirlwind, Hosa, or some other budget cable then I your weak link is probably right there. Quality cable makes a BIG difference, and you're not going to get the full potential of your gear without it.

I don't recommend purchasing omnis if your room doesn't sound good or you have a low ceiling. Omnis are very room dependent, and any shortcomings in your live room will limit the applications that you can use them for. If your room isn't an issue, I'd look into building the omni's in the Tape-op article on this site. They're really good (I like them better than the ECM-8000's, which are also good), and they'll cost you all of $20 to build.

I third (or fourth) the RNC. Great unit and I don't think you can beat it for the price.

I also agree that monitoring should probably be your highest priority. I don't think that the Rolands or the headphones you have are going to put out any substantial low end. You'll probably need to at least double your budget for a decent set.

-Lance

[Ashermusic]

IMHO far and away your biggest need is for monitors but $250 will not get it done. Save some more money until you have at least 6-700 dollars for something decent.

[bilco]

Thanks for the input everyone.

OK, I'll save for monitors and cables.  I hadn't even thought of cables; there's some pretty cheap and old cables here for sure.  I'll search the threads for monitor suggestions.  

I may go ahead and get the RNC now although in my limited experience with plugin compressors, I'm not sure what I'd gain.  I know I can compress vocals and bass going in through hardware, maybe 2:1 and compress it further if needed once it is recorded.  But if I don't clip going in and I can accomplish the same thing with a software compressor, I am curious what the difference is.  I KNOW there IS a difference b/c everyone recommends a real outboard compressor; I just don' have enough experience to know exactly what the sonic difference will be.

I have a pretty good living room with 12' coffered ceilings, so it's not a complete box.  It's pretty lively though.  

Maybe the $250 would be better spent on some kind of recording classes in Austin; the weakest link is really experience...., but I'll get there eventually

bilco

[Fig]

bilco wrote on Fri, 31 March 2006 00:35

What do you think is the most critical thing to get next with the $ I have?

Um.... experience with what you have will help you answer your own question.

If you are just wanting to buy a new piece of kit, get the RNC, can't go wrong.

In terms of taking your recordings to the next level - work with what you have and improve your SKILLS.  Throwing more inexpensive equipment at a home studio doesn't make better recordings (or mixes, either).

The suggestions for monitors are good, but $250 won't make your situation much better.  And I would say, if you want to improve your monitoring, improve your room FIRST.  Again, $250 won't take you very far in that regard.

Save your money until you can get into at least the mid-tier stuff.

Meanwhile, as the amount to invest is growing, you should be using your gear as much as possible and trying everything you can think of and everything you read here and elsewhere.

Record, mix, re-record, re-mix, listen, listen, listen.

Take your recordings elsewhere, listen, listen, listen.

Compare what you recorded to what you think sounds good.

Think, listen, save money, listen, think, and then finally...

purchase.

What's funny is if you have listened hard enough and critically, you will be able to answer your own question.

Otherwise, you end up with a bunch of $200 pieces that you still can't make sound very good (or at least not to your satisfaction).  Good recordings take much more than money.

$0.02,

Fig

[rankus]

I would spend the money on room treatment... the way your room sounds is the #1 most important thing...

Get some bass traps in the corners and damp things down a bit... you will see a big difference for a very low cost.  

I recomend making your own bass traps out of rockwool or fiberglass covered with som cheap (black) cloth...

This falls in line with the other recomendations for monitors... you need to be able to hear accurately...

So I would say:  Monitors and room treatment first.. then toys..

[Bobro]

bilco wrote on Fri, 31 March 2006 07:35

... but a lot of the songs are just being built one track at a time against a click. Thanks, bilco

IMO, while you're working on your room and saving money, find a way to flex your click.

The easiest way to do it is to clap and sing the tune through, or slap a guitar body or something, but if you're not up for that, a good MIDI program like Cubase will let you draw in tempo changes to your heart's content and use a virtual drum machine/sampler to play your click.

I realize that noone ever pays attention to these kinds of suggestions but somebody has to carry the torch for technology as it should be rather than as a feeble shadow of things past.  

-Bobro

[maxim]

rick wrote:

"Get some bass traps in the corners and damp things down a bit... you will see a big difference for a very low cost."

although it is a very "sound" suggestion, i doubt the roland "micromonitors" would generate enough bass to make a difference

fwiw, the idea of spending at least $750 on monitors isn't bad (so put your $250 away for now into a jar in the kitchen cupboard)

if you don't know what to do with a otb compressor, then it's not a priority

imo, save your bucks, and you can get a really nice compressor down the track, when you are at ease with one

[bilco]

Regarding cables, do all of you build your own or are you buying Mogami or some other brand?  This could run into some $. I think my trusty Radio Shack soldering iron is out in the garage somewhere.....

I am going to look at the RNC tomorrow, pretty sure I will get it, a pop screen and at least one good mic cable and guitar cord.

Thanks again all,
bilco

[Tidewater]

Building your own is a good way.

'Mo Gumbi!', and Canare are very good. Stay with Western manufactured hardware. (expensive cable ends) The 'Pacific Rim' stuff is made cheaply, from molds, of copies, of molds, of copies.

Neutrik, Switchcraft... Neutrik... Neutrik..


M

[Teddy G.]

Not enough for anything else worthwhile, so - work on your room!

For 250 bucks I could nearly soundPROOF my studio..? Certainly I could go to the home center and buy alot of Armstong 2x4 foot ceiling panels and a box of long screws and fender washers and screw the things up on every wall - even partial "double layers" and "laminate" the stuff into the corners, about a foot deep!(I could even get the "drop ceiling" kit for some of the panels and help, there, too!) and at least deaden the room to some degree('Scuse the "low bass"...). Fact is, I'm not sure you can "buy" a decent bass trap(Even one?) for $250? Even if you can, you'll likely need many of them to be effective(Like cover your entire room with them???). Ah well... Maybe a "local" studio/sound designer person would "stop in" for $250, and give you some general knowledge of how to proceed on your room accoustics?(No, I'm not kidding!) If I had 250, I'd buy a new wireless keyboard and mouse for my computer and maybe another couple hard drives..? I can't think of any audio gear, perse, that I need, that I want for only 250 bucks..?

TG

[Bobro]

IMO there's a very good chance that a lively fair-sized living room with 12" coffered cielings actually sounds much better as it is than a lot of "studios".

If it's a hardwood floor with some persian-type rugs on it you're in style.

Dead rooms are really all about editing and goofing around with sounds in a mix, not about sound quality.

If the money is burning a hole in your pocket, find a way to invest it in the music itself. That's my 2 cents.

-Bobro