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Author Topic: Which Tube SDC mics have the fastest response??  (Read 3394 times)

Bubba--Kron

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Which Tube SDC mics have the fastest response??
« on: March 31, 2011, 04:23:50 pm »

I'm looking for something to pick up faster sounds than what my U47 does.  I was thinking Schoeps SDC. I'm obviously gonna demo a bunch, but was trying to narrow it down to a few choices.      Would a SS SDC be a better choice??  Is a triode tube SDC gonna be too warm??   The peluso p-28 looks like a pretty good deal, NO?? 

It would be going into vintage neve preamps, so something with some punch would be nice!!
Thanks
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Cheers, Bryan Richards

Fletcher

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Re: Which Tube SDC mics have the fastest response??
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2011, 08:56:47 am »

I think I know what you're talking about - though "fast" is really the wrong word.  Something like a KM-54 /56 might work... or a Gefell M-295 might be something to try.  Nickel diaphragms have a different sound to them, which I suppose could be described as "faster".
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CN Fletcher

mwagener wrote on Sat, 11 September 2004 14:33
We are selling emotions, there are no emotions in a grid


"Recording engineers are an arrogant bunch
If you've spent most of your life with a few thousand dollars worth of musicians in the studio, making a decision every second and a half... and you and  they are going to have to live with it for the rest of your lives, you'll get pretty arrogant too.  It takes a certain amount of balls to do that... something around three"
Malcolm Chisholm

J.J. Blair

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Re: Which Tube SDC mics have the fastest response??
« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2011, 05:26:00 pm »

Bubba, you're going to have a really hard time convincing me that any capacitor mic is going to be noticeable "faster" at picking up sounds than another one.  You might want to learn something about how everything you've mentioned works. Sounds like somebody is filling your head with misinformation. 

Now, if you want to improve transient response, I don't know that you can prove SDCs capture that better than LDCs, as a generalization.  I have, however, replaced passive components in mics, without altering the circuit, and measured better transient response, which was a result I was not expecting.  This didn't make it "faster," but the transients certainly registered stronger.

I honestly doubt that the caliber of components I used will appear in a Peluso mic. 

BTW, to understand what you are talking about better, is it an original, real U47?  If so, what capsule is in it?  What components have been changed?  And why aren't you asking this in Klaus' forum?
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Bubba--Kron

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Re: Which Tube SDC mics have the fastest response??
« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2011, 07:52:53 pm »

Thanks for the responses, you guys make good points.   I have a Beesneez T1 with the k7 capsule.   It just does not have the "presence" ( i guess is a more appropriate word) in higher pitched sounds that I would like for adding more robust rythms to certain songs.   I was just looking for something for fast acoustic gutair, in your face vocal chorus's, Bazouki, Mandolin,snares.  Basically just REALLY fast songs where the whole steele tube LDC seems to be slowing them down.

The peluso does not look good, the Mojave Ma-100 or the suggestions Fletcher made seem to be the ones I am gonna try.

Sometimes the gnarly teeth on the wave form of u47ish mics can be a clash of vibe IMO.  Obviously I would do fine with a 251 or m49 or any other more sonically pure mics on such sources LDC wise, but was just looking for a cheraper/easier solution because I enjoy steele tube LDC on most other sources or my coles 4038's.

I am not trying to make blanket statements about anything , just curious what some people here liked.  I will post this in the Klaus forum next time, but it seemed a more application based question rather than a technical mic question.   Thanks, Gentlemen.

Cheers:)
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Cheers, Bryan Richards

J.J. Blair

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Re: Which Tube SDC mics have the fastest response??
« Reply #4 on: April 01, 2011, 08:15:14 pm »

OK, first, the only thing that is a real U47, is a real U47.  No offense to the company currently making a mic called a U47, but the ones they are making are not the same thing as a real Neumann U47, on many levels.  (I hope Fletcher does not make me go into detail on this.)

Anyway, that being said, I would not characterize what a U47 sounds like, based on anything other than using a good example of a real U47.  The other mics you mention, the 251 and M49, are certainly not more "sonically pure" than a U47.  In fact, the CK12 capsule has a great deal more phase shift than a M7 or K47.  And M49s, which use the same capsule as the U47, have a great deal of coloration on their own, and I would certainly not characterize their transient response as being any better than a U47.

Your conclusion that the "steel tube LDC" is "slowing down" the song, is a bizarre conclusion.  I don't know how you arrived at the idea that the housing of the tube has anything to do with slowing down a song. 

It sounds like you're looking for something with more presence.  A U47 or M49 would not be my choice for the instruments you mentioned, in the first place.  From what you are describing, I'm taking a guess that you are looking for a more forward sound, which you are not going to get from a K47, or M7.  Sounds like a dual backplate design, like a CK12 or K67 (in a circuit without a NFB LPF) is going to be up your alley.  A mid range and HF presence will certainly accentuate some of those sounds that bring out the attack more. 

That's completely a function of frequency balance and phase shift, and has more to do with the capsule than the tube, in my experience, and certainly has nothing to do with the material of the tube's housing. 
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Bubba--Kron

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Re: Which Tube SDC mics have the fastest response??
« Reply #5 on: April 01, 2011, 08:18:33 pm »

Great info.

Thanks
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Cheers, Bryan Richards
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