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Author Topic: DDP fail  (Read 12841 times)

tbridge

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DDP fail
« on: March 26, 2011, 06:57:02 am »

For a couple of decades, I've been creating DDP files on Sadie and delivering on Exabyte, but the tape machine is slowly giving up the ghost - so, for my latest job, I decided to use Sonoris' DDP Creator, a great program which creates the whole fileset along with CD-Text and also the MD5 checker. You can also upload the fileset from within the program.

My client is very fastiduous about ISRCs and CD-Text and listens to and checks every stage of the process. Over the years, he has had masters delivered to him on CD, but he has come to me for his latest project, and I persuaded him to go the DDP route - he struggled with the concept, but after speaking to his broker, finally agreed. I cut him a CD directly from the image file created in Sonoris, which he auditioned and gave the green light - then I uploaded the fileset to his broker's ftp site (I'd rather have sent it directly to the plant, but you know how brokers can be coy about where they are pressing!). 3 or 4 days later, my client received several thousand pressings - each one with a minute's silence in the first track.

The image file on my computer is intact, but I downloaded the file from the ftp server, and that indeed has a minute's silence. I have no idea how this can happen without the checker spotting it. Is there any point in me downloading the checker from the server and running that, or have I got the wrong idea entirely?

Thanks for any advice you may be able to share, even if it's only a virtual man-hug  ;)

Tony
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tbridge

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2011, 07:20:36 am »

fwiw, I've just downloaded the folder from the ftp server, run the MD5 checker, and it reports an error...
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bblackwood

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2011, 08:03:45 am »

Ahh, so the uploaded file contained the error?  Or was the file corrupted during the upload? Did you use any sort of file compression (zip, etc)?
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Brad Blackwood
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bkuijt

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2011, 08:57:11 am »

Mr. Bridge!
So nice to see you here!
Of course this happens with the most cautious and suspicious client.... typical...

...editing my post again, need to learn how to read better....

If the MD5 check fails it indicats that neither the broker nor the plant ran the check!
That's pretty silly if they do support online delivery.

Like Brad suggests, delivering a .zip or .rar packed archive is safer.

Hope you'll solve it!
Bests, Bastiaan
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Bastiaan Kuijt  //  BK Audio  //  www.bkaudio.nl

tbridge

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2011, 09:09:58 am »

Hey Bast, how are you?

Well, the file that exists on my computer is what I burnt the ref CDs from, with no problem. I can listen to it now, and it's intact. And that is the file that I uploaded to the server, so I can only assume that it was the upload process that corrupted the file. As I say, the MD5 check (from the server) fails... but if I run that checker against the original file, it passes.

So, that confirms (I think! my head's spinning...) what I really knew, that the two files are different. It's the 'why' that I don't understand yet :(
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bkuijt

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2011, 09:22:36 am »

I need to learn how to read better...

Modified my post just while you typed a reply.
At first I assumed the disc had additional silence like someone modified it. I had that recently, but with a burned CDR master..

If the MD5 check fails it indicates that neither the broker nor the plant ran the check!
That's pretty silly if they do support online delivery.

Did their delivery specification say it should have been packed in some sort of archive?
If not, then it's just as much their mistake not to verify delivered content!

Hope you're doing well apart from this issue!
Bests, Bastiaan
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Bastiaan Kuijt  //  BK Audio  //  www.bkaudio.nl

jdg

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2011, 02:12:16 pm »

i find it odd that the corrupt DDP caused 1m of silence.

if it was corrupt, the is a 99.999% chance it just would not load in at all.

how did the plant intake the DDP? sounds like something happened after intake
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John McCaig
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ggidluck

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2011, 04:14:39 pm »

So, that confirms (I think! my head's spinning...) what I really knew, that the two files are different. It's the 'why' that I don't understand yet :(

FTP does not do checksums on each packet and resend corrupt packets. As a defense, if you zip (or rar) the file, the program which opens it will detect an error if the embedded zip checksum does not match the original. Make sense?


 
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Pieter Stenekes

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2011, 04:30:54 am »

if you zip (or rar) the file

or you can download the image back and check the md5 yourself before giving clearance to the plant
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tbridge

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2011, 05:27:44 am »

Pieter, I did that over the weekend, and sure enough the checker fails, but passes the original file. I agree with jdg that I would have thought a corrupt file would just not play.

check the md5 yourself before giving clearance to the plant
it seems that this is the way forward in future...

I find it sad and frustrating that we have to jump through yet another hoop just to cover the incompetence of others - should the mastering engineer have to do QC for the plant too? >:(
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phonon

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #10 on: March 28, 2011, 08:45:24 am »

Are you saying that the FTP process corrupted the DDPi only by adding a minute of silence to the program that shouldn't have been there?    Isn't it rather a smoking gun that the factory edited the DDPi?


Andrew
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tbridge

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2011, 11:28:06 am »

Andrew, no not added... 30 seconds into the first track, the music disappears for a whole 60 seconds, while the CD display keeps ticking over. The only way that could happen, I should think, is if I created an edl with 60 seconds of silence in the first track, but the MD5 I included with the uploaded DDP set passes the master edl, which of course is intact. It doesn't pass the image file on the ftp server.

That doesn't make the bad image file the fault of the plant - where their fault lies is in not running the checker, which would have spotted a bad file, which I could then have re-uploaded.  :'(

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Table Of Tone

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #12 on: March 28, 2011, 04:22:22 pm »

or you can download the image back and check the md5 yourself before giving clearance to the plant
That's what I'd do!

What are your thoughts on putting a couple DDP's (double CD release) on a DVDR?
Should I zip each one?
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Treelady

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #13 on: March 28, 2011, 11:13:11 pm »

(I think Brian from DM always says the following): When you submit a DDP, add the checksum file inside the folder, compress the entire folder (.zip or .rar) and send that to the plant. 

When they open it, if the file won't de-compress, they know there is an issue.  If the file does de-compress, the plant should still check the MD5 file to make sure the DDP you sent is the one they have. 

For those of you who upload a file then download it to recheck, that's good, except if the plant has an issue on their download from their FTP server to their local machines (not all FTP boxes on onsite.  If the FTP server is outsourced, the could have transmission errors from the FTP Server to the Plant's production sever.) Your lawyer will be happy that you put the correct file on the FTP server, but the client needs it to get all the way to the Plant's production server.

Ultimately, the plant has to assume some level of professionalism and accept responsibility for what they produce.  Just as many mastering engineers add extra hours (often un-billed) to double check that DDPs are correct, the plant needs to put forth the effort to protect the interests of their clients.

This is a rough situation, and I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

Best,
GH
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lowland

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Re: DDP fail
« Reply #14 on: March 29, 2011, 03:08:26 am »

What are your thoughts on putting a couple DDP's (double CD release) on a DVDR?
Should I zip each one?
Not Pieter, but this cropped up here a few years ago and I was told 'only one master per disc' at the time, so a double CD = 2 x DVD DDP masters. Not sure why this is, perhaps it's a potential source of confusion at the factory - I've done it since with doubles (or more) and there's been no problem.
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Nigel Palmer
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