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Author Topic: Subs  (Read 3043 times)

Mark Carr

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Subs
« on: January 13, 2006, 10:00:23 AM »

Anybody ever had that problem of low blurry sounding mixes. You know who you are. Sounds great in the studio but then ya get them in your car or another source and ya find yourself saying "Where did all that low end come from? why do the low mids sound so flabby?" Must be my room, speakers, etc, you name it. After about 5-6 years of fighting this I finally got a sub. The first mix I did with the sub sounded better than stuff it used to take a week of guessing to get. Made me wanna kick myself in the rear. Well duh. Can't mix what ya can't hear. Makes me enjoy mixing and not dread getting the low end right. Lessons learned. Worked for me anyway.
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Vertigo

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Re: Subs
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2006, 01:11:49 PM »

I find that the 125hz range is usually the low-end problem between studio monitors and consumer speakers. I routinely notch a good bit out of this range for translation sake. I also have a set of Klipsch consumer speakers with a sub that I usually A/B to my other monitors to see how the mixes will translate. It's been a huge help!

-Lance
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rankus

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Re: Subs
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2006, 06:28:36 PM »

Mark Carr wrote on Fri, 13 January 2006 07:00

Anybody ever had that problem of low blurry sounding mixes. You know who you are. Sounds great in the studio but then ya get them in your car or another source and ya find yourself saying "Where did all that low end come from? why do the low mids sound so flabby?" Must be my room, speakers, etc, you name it. After about 5-6 years of fighting this I finally got a sub. The first mix I did with the sub sounded better than stuff it used to take a week of guessing to get. Made me wanna kick myself in the rear. Well duh. Can't mix what ya can't hear. Makes me enjoy mixing and not dread getting the low end right. Lessons learned. Worked for me anyway.


Timely post.  I have been looking at Subs all week for exactly the reasons you stated.

Question?  What brand of sub did you get, and why?

TIA
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Rick Welin - Clark Drive Studios http://www.myspace.com/clarkdrivestudios

Ive done stuff I'm not proud of.. and the stuff I am proud of is disgusting ~ Moe Sizlack

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hargerst

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Re: Subs
« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2006, 12:11:06 PM »

While I use JBL subs with my main JBL wall mounted speakers, I'll use just about any kind of sub with my nearfields, just to make them kick a little louder down low.  That way, I can check for unwanted low garbage and rumble.
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Harvey "Is that the right note?" Gerst
Indian Trail Recording Studio

Mark Carr

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Re: Subs
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2006, 03:10:57 PM »

  I had taken my SLS powered home theatre sub out to the studio and tried it at first. I was plenty happy with it so I just got another and replaced my home sub with a new one. SLS is here in town and I've known these guys for 100 years so I got a pretty good deal on it. Gotta start a thread about their anechoic chamber sometime. God that is the WEIRDEST sensation.
 Anyway like Harvey says, it doesn't have to be anything great. Just something to pronounce low frequencies better. Something that when you solo your channels you'll find stuff in tracks like guitars etc. that you thought, before you got the sub, had to be coming from bass or kick drum. It also might save ya a fortune on constantly buying new and different nearfields because "these just don't transfer well." You name the brand.
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Fibes

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Re: Subs
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2006, 05:12:23 PM »


This has always been a weird thing for me.



I've never use subs much but I'm planning on adding one with a switch after i redo my room.

Why?

Because every now and then I'm asked to do things with the low end that I normally wouldn't and that's where the sub comes in.

Unholy bass.

Bass off in the hot house?

Maybe I should just put the Urei under my chair with a disconected horn. heh
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Fibes
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rankus

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Re: Subs
« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2006, 05:26:50 PM »



Thanks Mark and Harvey .... Consumer sub shopping next week!  Very Happy
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Rick Welin - Clark Drive Studios http://www.myspace.com/clarkdrivestudios

Ive done stuff I'm not proud of.. and the stuff I am proud of is disgusting ~ Moe Sizlack

"There is no crisis in energy, the crisis is in imagination" ~ Buckminster Fuller

hargerst

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Re: Subs
« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2006, 06:04:21 PM »

Pawn shops are great for finding cheap subs.
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Harvey "Is that the right note?" Gerst
Indian Trail Recording Studio

rankus

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Re: Subs
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2006, 02:04:53 PM »

hargerst wrote on Sat, 14 January 2006 15:04

Pawn shops are great for finding cheap subs.



Great idea.  Thanks for the tip Harvey. Very Happy
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Rick Welin - Clark Drive Studios http://www.myspace.com/clarkdrivestudios

Ive done stuff I'm not proud of.. and the stuff I am proud of is disgusting ~ Moe Sizlack

"There is no crisis in energy, the crisis is in imagination" ~ Buckminster Fuller

rankus

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Re: Subs
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2006, 02:29:31 PM »



Hey Harvey et al:  Are you guys using crossovers or just plugging the sub into a spare out on the board?

If crossover, what brand and x-over points?

Thanks again, guys.
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Rick Welin - Clark Drive Studios http://www.myspace.com/clarkdrivestudios

Ive done stuff I'm not proud of.. and the stuff I am proud of is disgusting ~ Moe Sizlack

"There is no crisis in energy, the crisis is in imagination" ~ Buckminster Fuller

Mark Carr

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Re: Subs
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2006, 03:15:44 PM »

I come out of the mixer stereo mix out put to the xlr input on a Hafler 9505 (my nearfields are not powered). The Hafler has xlr and rca inputs. I come out of the rca's on the Hafler and go to the sub rca inputs which has adjustable low pass from like 200-60hz. The sub also has a volume control that you can do a few mixes and find the right mix with the nearfields. Another way is to Y left and right out of the 2 mix and go to the Hafler and the subs.
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Han S.

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Re: Subs
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2006, 06:46:56 PM »

rankus wrote on Mon, 16 January 2006 19:29



Hey Harvey et al:  Are you guys using crossovers or just plugging the sub into a spare out on the board?

If crossover, what brand and x-over points?

Thanks again, guys.


I'm extremely happy with my Eltax Atomic 10 sub that works very good with the NS10's. It has an RCA input which is connected to the monitor out of the desk and it has a volume knob and a variable X-over which is at 50hz.

I also can switch the sub on and off with a switch on the desk, works like a charm.
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wavdoctor

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Re: Subs
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2006, 12:21:16 PM »

I'm thinking I need a sub now also..How would one go about hooking this up with powered monitors? I use Genelec 1031's..
Thanks  HB
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Sunset Mastering & Recording
Harry Brookes

rankus

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Re: Subs
« Reply #13 on: January 19, 2006, 02:09:22 PM »



Well, I went and bought a Sony home theater sub.  A big one about 100 watts. Got it at a pawn shop for $35 US.

I use powered monitors.  So for a quick and dirty solution I took a "Y" off one of the control room outs on my board and ran the sub off that.  

I use Alesis M1 powered monitors that have almost no low end anyway, but I still intend to get a stereo crossover to do this right... If I have bass coming form the sub I want to kill those frequencies from the nearfields to avoid any possible masking... (Correct me if I am on the wrong track with this)

Anyway.  I am happy to report that the even this Mickey Mouse low tech setup has made a big improvement in my small control room that I have been trying to deal with low end issues.  (Yes, lots of rockwool)

Also' I have been in the middle of trying to nail down a mix on a record I'm working on with "drop C" tuning, where the bass gtr is almost off the bottom of the page spectrum wise.  The sub made a big difference in that I can actually hear the bass fundamentals.  I had been pushing too much bass in general, and the sub allowed me to tighten up the bottom end nicely....

So there you have it.... A Sub with almost no budget... a story worth relating on this "Bugjet" forum... (Love this forum Terry.. great idea!)
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Rick Welin - Clark Drive Studios http://www.myspace.com/clarkdrivestudios

Ive done stuff I'm not proud of.. and the stuff I am proud of is disgusting ~ Moe Sizlack

"There is no crisis in energy, the crisis is in imagination" ~ Buckminster Fuller
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