R/E/P Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 6   Go Down

Author Topic: Guitar Amp For the Studio  (Read 13234 times)

James Duncan

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 583
Guitar Amp For the Studio
« on: January 01, 2006, 11:47:22 am »

Obviously, the quality of the gear that comes walking in the door varies greatly from performer to performer, and this can make our job challenging at best. 'nuff said...

I am looking to get another amp for the studio that I can provide as part of my services on a daily or per session rate.

I currently have a Marshall TSL601 combo, a Marshall DSL401 combo, a couple of rack-mounted preamps with a Mesa Boogie 2:90 main amp, and a Marshall 2 X 12 speaker cabinet.

I also stock a pretty good supply of guitars (PRS, Gibson, Wolfgang, Fender, etc.).

My problem is that I am not really happy with any of the guitar sounds I am getting. The distortion is muddy sounding, and not tight and focused.

I tend to do rock/pop/blues types of projects, but will get the (fairly) occasional punk or metal bands in as well, but I am more concerned with the rock-ish sound (think GnR with Slash at the helm of his LP and JCM800 Jubilee).

So I guess the easy answer is to go and get a Marshall Jubille with a Marshall 1960 cabinet, but that is a pretty expensive rig, although if that is the answer, then I guess I would be willing to go that route.


I have two problems here:

1) It just seems to me that I should be able to get a better sound out of the gear that I have, and...

2) I am looking for some possible cheaper alternatives (a Jubilee head alone is in the US$1,800 - $2,000 vicinity).


With regard to my existing gear: Why do both of the Marshall's sound like crap? (I am talking in the room here as well as to tape)? Are the Marsahll TSL/DSLs really that bad? Could it be that 2 x 12 speaker cabinet? It is a closed-back 2 X 12 with some pretty high-wattage Celestians. I am thinking a nice 4 X 12 with some 30w greenbacks might sound a lot better. I also tried listening closely to the single 12s in both combo amps, and got similar crappy, muddy sounds. They may not be the best-sounding amps in the world, but these sound like CRAP!!! Total doggie doo-doo. I am pretty pissed. The TSL uses EL34s and the DSL uses EL84s, which you would think would give me a nice pallet of varied sounds, right? Nope! They all suck!

Should I consider re-tubing? I just had the DSL looked at, and one of the pre amp tubes was replaced as well as a bad solder joint on one of the tube sockets. I am not sure why he didn't replace the whole set of preamp tubes (which I asked him about when I went to pick it up), but I figured that I can easily do that for a lot less without having to re-bias like I would with the power amp tubes, so I left it alone.

BTW...the DSL and the TSL seem to be OK for live gigging, but suck in the studio.

Regarding other alternatives: I can pick up one of the much-maligned JCM900's for about 1/3 of the cost of the Jubilee, but I keep hearing a lot of folks bad-mouth the JCM900 as being a piece of junk. I played one at GC the other day, and didn't think it was *that* bad personally, but it is hard to tell in that environment, obviously. The also had an old JMP there that was very cool, but was not the sound I am looking for. I need more gain and distortion than that.

I am not really into the Recto/metal sound, so let's stay away from there for a while. I am also trolling for a nice Fender Twin, but that is for a different sound altogether, and not really related to this thread.

So, where do I go from here? Any ideas?

Thanks in advance!
Logged
James Duncan

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
Napoleon Bonaparte

covert

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 119
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #1 on: January 01, 2006, 01:56:23 pm »

James Duncan wrote on Sun, 01 January 2006 11:47


I am looking to get another amp for the studio that I can provide as part of my services on a daily or per session rate.

I currently have a Marshall TSL601 combo, a Marshall DSL401 combo, a couple of rack-mounted preamps with a Mesa Boogie 2:90 main amp, and a Marshall 2 X 12 speaker cabinet.

I also stock a pretty good supply of guitars (PRS, Gibson, Wolfgang, Fender, etc.).

My problem is that I am not really happy with any of the guitar sounds I am getting. The distortion is muddy sounding, and not tight and focused.


With regard to my existing gear: Why do both of the Marshall's sound like crap? (I am talking in the room here as well as to tape)? Are the Marsahll TSL/DSLs really that bad?



In a word yes.  

Quote:


BTW...the DSL and the TSL seem to be OK for live gigging, but suck in the studio.


Recording is a microscope.  It will make bad sounds far more obvious.

Quote:


Regarding other alternatives: I can pick up one of the much-maligned JCM900's for about 1/3 of the cost of the Jubilee, but I keep hearing a lot of folks bad-mouth the JCM900 as being a piece of junk. I played one at GC the other day, and didn't think it was *that* bad personally, but it is hard to tell in that environment, obviously. The also had an old JMP there that was very cool, but was not the sound I am looking for. I need more gain and distortion than that.


If you have a decent tech, the rectifier bridge that ruins the drive cannel of the 900s can be removed, making them a much better amp.

Logged

Tidewater

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3816
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2006, 02:20:16 pm »

I would steer you towaard the 1980's red knob Fender Twin.

It's distortion is wailing, or not, and crushing, or not, but the notes are always separated, and it has a fantastic clean sound. It crunches like a good Marshall, with more tone control, and a reverb.

For recording distorted guitar, turn the distortion down a lil.

My Marshall settings go Bass 0, Mid 10, Treb 10, Pres 10-or-0, gain 5-6, master 4-7. If non-master I strap the channels, and peg II, then turn I up to taste.

M
Logged
Time Magazine's 2007 Man of the Year

compasspnt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16266
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2006, 02:47:43 pm »

I agree that the microscope syndrome may be pointing out bad amps that you don't notice on stage or in Guitar Center.

However, I wobder about the room in which you record these, as well as the mic'ing techniques.  Neither of those is mentioned.

I agree that the "Red Knob" Fender "The Twin" is an excellent amp.  I remember David Lyndley using mine, and he really, really liked it.

http://www.davidlindley.com/

But back when I bought mine, I didn't like the red, and ended up taking the knobs off and replacing with same model black ones.
Logged

rankus

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5560
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2006, 04:33:02 pm »

DivideByZero wrote on Sun, 01 January 2006 11:20

 
For recording distorted guitar, turn the distortion down a lil.

My Marshall settings go Bass 0, Mid 10, Treb 10, Pres 10-or-0, gain 5-6, master 4-7. If non-master I strap the channels, and peg II, then turn I up to taste.

M


I thought this just me... I usually turn the bass knob all the way down as well, and crank up the high end a little.... Gtr players hate  this... until they hear the results in the mix.

Seems this is almost standard fair.  I ask the player to get "his" sound, and then I stroll out and roll off the bottom... I lose some distortion as well... pretty much this scenario every time.

Love the JCM800's!

Love the older Mesa MK4's as well!

Love the Greenbacks...

Love SM57's and 4033's ... Shocked
Logged
Rick Welin - Clark Drive Studios http://www.myspace.com/clarkdrivestudios

Ive done stuff I'm not proud of.. and the stuff I am proud of is disgusting ~ Moe Sizlack

"There is no crisis in energy, the crisis is in imagination" ~ Buckminster Fuller

Ryan Leigh Patterson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 526
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2006, 04:50:08 pm »

Look into getting an older Fender Bassman ( Black Face or early Silver Face) and have a good tech hotrod it.  These amps are pretty boring stock, but they're decently cheap to buy used and they've got all the right parts to make a smoking amp.  

Early Traynor Bassmasters etc are also excellent.  They're basically a JCM 45 (plexi and 59 Bassman) circuit... they sound great and they're cheap.  

Ampeg V4-B and V4-G.. also nice, think mini SVT.  

Shop around for some used Fender 2x12 cabs (late 60s early 70s) and used Marhsall 4x12 cabs and then play with different speaker combos....

Garnett Herzog.... basically a Fender champ with a dummy coil and an output attenuator on the output tranny.  Feed one of these through any amp and stand back!!!  This is the sickest sounding distortion box in the world....

Fender Champ.... small amp, big sound!!


Logged
Ryan Patterson
Toronto, Ontario
www.myspace.com/ryanlpatterson

Haolemon

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 112
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2006, 05:41:48 pm »

You might consider the Mesa Blue Angel.  It provides a good approximation of both the AC30 and the Fender Deluxe, as well as a sort of hybrid of the two.
Logged

Dave Martin

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 331
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #7 on: January 01, 2006, 08:10:55 pm »

I'm a big fan of a Deluxe, too.
Logged

Tidewater

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3816
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #8 on: January 01, 2006, 08:48:45 pm »

You mean a pre-67 black face... you mean a GREAT pre-67 black face.. right?

Yeah, me too... but it has to be a really great one.


M
Logged
Time Magazine's 2007 Man of the Year

Brendan Thompson

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 243
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2006, 09:55:49 pm »

James Duncan wrote on Mon, 02 January 2006 03:47

The also had an old JMP there that was very cool, but was not the sound I am looking for. I need more gain and distortion than that.


Go back and try a clean boost in front of it...
Logged
http://home.no.net/nightguy/images/teambunny2.gif

I'm currently out of my mind, please leave a message after the scream...

Dave Martin

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 331
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2006, 12:47:37 am »

DivideByZero wrote on Sun, 01 January 2006 19:48

You mean a pre-67 black face... you mean a GREAT pre-67 black face.. right?

Yeah, me too... but it has to be a really great one.
M


The one here is (I believe), a '65...
Logged

Tidewater

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3816
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2006, 12:52:28 am »

...and well serviced.. CONGRATS!

The prices have really been falling off on those lately... you'd do well to find a fool to pawn it off on.

Let me know... PM or email is fine.. don't talk to anyone else!


M
Logged
Time Magazine's 2007 Man of the Year

maxim

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5828
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2006, 01:05:37 am »

i would, personally, dump the marshalls in the river

they're enough to drive guitarists to a pod

different amps for different sound, i reckon

the studio is a good place for a smaller amp that can break up at lower volume

fenders are clean and will translate the gtr + pedals well

ac30 is a great, if particular tasting, amp

matchbox do an improved version

mesa is an acquired but unique taste

i record a lot of my electric stuff on a pignose

there are some great boutique and vintage tube amps that bring the variety to your studio

also, don't forget pedals

guitarists love to play with new fuzztoys

i recommend new zealand's hot cake as a unique flavour

Logged

Fibes

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4306
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2006, 09:55:55 am »

I've been looking at the deluxes built by Sligo amplification and the deluxe version by Top Hat. The top hat is super sweet and barks in at 1300 USD which is at least half of a Black face 65 deluxe and is quiet as a mouse. It has tat great 3d depth and now i just have to wait for my local dealer to give me a deal or maybe we need to be a clock raping whores for a little while...
Logged
Fibes
-------------------------------------------------
"You can like it, or not like it."
The Studio

  http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewArtist ?id=155759887
http://cdbaby.com/cd/superhorse
http://cdbaby.com/cd/superhorse2

Sir Bergersworth

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1
Re: Guitar Amp For the Studio
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2006, 01:38:46 pm »

I have a 98 hot rod deluxe that souds great when tracked. very, nice amp and wont break the bank.
I also recommend the small format fender tube amps (cant remember the models). they sound great when cranked and tracked.
Logged
.....And all the while, I was here
Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 6   Go Up