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Author Topic: the role of an engineer in relation to art  (Read 9951 times)

cdr-1

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #45 on: December 30, 2005, 09:24:07 am »

Maybe artisan or artificer would be a good term.

One that contrives, devises, or constructs something: "The labyrinth... was built by Daedalus, a most skillful artificer" (Thomas Bulfinch).

I would not call myself an artist just because I recorded a band. That seems self indulgent. I can facilitate an accurate recording of a song but that does not mean I can write one.

On the other hand, I would not call myself an engineer just because I recorded a band. That also seems self indulgent. I can calibrate my MCI but that does not mean I can design or build one.

A song is not a horse made of marble, it's a live horse and the artificer didn't invent the horse. The horse evolved from smaller horses.

Still, it's the artificer's job is to know his or her shit well enough to extract a likeness of the horse from a block of marble.

-Adam
CDR


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Dave Martin

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #46 on: December 30, 2005, 11:29:09 am »

I like 'artificer'; it has a nice ring to it (which, of course,  I CHOSE to leave in the mix....  Razz )
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Tidewater

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #47 on: December 30, 2005, 01:30:08 pm »

The choices are just part of the tool set.

If you do anything for a long enough time, you will have an idea about where to go, and how to get there, in any situation. There are many levels of that idea. Some get there better than others, for as many reasons.

The more you love it, the more potential you have for being insanely great at it, no matter what *it* is.

All that said, many bands would not be served well if you just printed them. They need alot of color correction, and sometimes the content needs expurgation.

Songs are like paintings.. moreso than photography, when you are producing.

M
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maxim

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #48 on: December 30, 2005, 07:11:06 pm »

steve a wrote:

"If you have to make a specific decision on every moment -- if everything is potentially up for grabs -- you are depriving yourself of the opportunity to learn from your experiences and draw conclusions. "

every choice and decision you make, including not making a choice, is based on your previous experience (as long as you have a brain, of course)

our brains are very good at patterns, semi-automatic behavioural loops that allow us to rest our grey matter(some occur on the cerebellar level, others higher or even lower)

when you allow yourself to go into pattern-mode, your brain is/should be still 'keeping an eye' on the proceedings

the problem can arise beacuse every experience is different, so the patterns may need to be adjusted accordingly

if you're running in automatic, that opportunity may be missed and the project may be impaired or ruined altogether
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Ron Steele

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #49 on: December 30, 2005, 07:25:56 pm »

"the role of an engineer in relation to art "


I think the word..art or artist....has been to loosely floated around.

I mean, is a person or persons, who are all of sudden inspired and influenced by the ramones to pick up a guitar and thrash and scream,
all of sudden a musical "artist" just because of a new found inspiration?

It could be considered a copy, in the same way we have Les Paul GTR copy's.

So what makes a person or group an artist?





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electrical

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #50 on: December 30, 2005, 07:27:06 pm »

DivideByZero wrote on Fri, 30 December 2005 13:30


All that said, many bands would not be served well if you just printed them.

"Just" printed them? If only that were the easy way to do it...

It is incredibly difficult to "just" print them. Accidentally fucking-up a record is the biggest pitfall, and it takes constant awareness and ingenuity just to avoid doing it. It is infinitely easier to assume that part is a no-brainer, and then fuck around forever being "creative" and doing a bunch of fancying-up and producing.

I believe it is more important to improve our not-fucking-it-up ability than to dream-up ever more fantastic things to do with the studio.

Quote:

They need alot of color correction, and sometimes the content needs expurgation.

That's incredibly presumptuous of you. Bands "need" you and your smarts? Otherwise, what, they're nothing? You get to decide what someone else's music is supposed to sound like, based on what you think is "good." Why would any band who actually liked their own material allow themselves to be subject to that?

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electrical

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #51 on: December 30, 2005, 07:31:36 pm »

maxim wrote on Fri, 30 December 2005 19:11


our brains are very good at patterns, semi-automatic behavioural loops that allow us to rest our grey matter(some occur on the cerebellar level, others higher or even lower)

when you allow yourself to go into pattern-mode, your brain is/should be still 'keeping an eye' on the proceedings

the problem can arise beacuse every experience is different, so the patterns may need to be adjusted accordingly

if you're running in automatic, that opportunity may be missed and the project may be impaired or ruined altogether

So... not everything is a choice then? I'm right, is that what you're saying?
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Ronny

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #52 on: December 30, 2005, 08:10:40 pm »

Ron Steele wrote on Fri, 30 December 2005 19:25



So what makes a person or group an artist?







The ear of the beholder.  
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maxim

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #53 on: December 30, 2005, 08:45:42 pm »

steve a wrote:

"So... not everything is a choice then? I'm right, is that what you're saying?"

what i'm saying is that your decision not make a choice is also a choice

of course, there are reflexive actions, and we rely on those as human beings to survive, to improve and just 'coz we are plain 2FL (too f*cking lazy)

sometimes, the trap is, though, that the reflexive loops are based on previous choices and experiences, which may not have been extrapolatable or no longer apply

steve a wrote:

"fucking-up a record is the biggest pitfall, and it takes constant awareness and ingenuity just to avoid doing it. "

ditto

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electrical

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #54 on: December 30, 2005, 09:04:56 pm »

maxim wrote on Fri, 30 December 2005 20:45


what i'm saying is that your decision not make a choice is also a choice

Nonsense. It's nothing.

If, by not doing something, I am doing it, then tonight I will both discover a cure for cancer and invent a new kind of electric blanket. By not doing it.
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steve albini
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maxim

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #55 on: December 30, 2005, 10:53:52 pm »

not doing is a subset of doing, not the other way around

steve a wrote:

"If, by not doing something, I am doing it, then tonight I will both discover a cure for cancer and invent a new kind of electric blanket."

no, the correct answer is you WILL not  discover a cure for cancer or invent a new kind of electric blanket

but you could will to do so

it's just that you choose to do other things
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electrical

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #56 on: December 30, 2005, 11:28:56 pm »

maxim wrote on Fri, 30 December 2005 22:53

not doing is a subset of doing, not the other way around

Did you get this from a self-help book or something? It's silly and circular.
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steve albini
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maxim

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #57 on: December 30, 2005, 11:34:22 pm »

no, steve, it's just common sense, but you can help yourself if you understand that concept

zero is a number

zero eq is along the same linear process as subtracting and adding

not helping a stranger in the street is a form of action

not adding salt is a decision
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electrical

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #58 on: December 30, 2005, 11:43:08 pm »

So, right now, doing nothing, I am making an infinite number of choices? Having chosen against every other thing in the world I could be doing? That's preposterous. Things of no consequence don't even warrant consideration, and I cannot believe that I am making a choice against them.
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steve albini
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maxim

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Re: the role of an engineer in relation to art
« Reply #59 on: December 31, 2005, 01:06:26 am »

steve a wrote:

"So, right now, doing nothing, I am making an infinite number of choices? "

noone said anything about infinite

you are only making one choice: to do nothing

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