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R/E/P => R/E/P Archives => Brad Blackwood => Topic started by: Viitalahde on September 20, 2010, 01:18:44 pm

Title: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on September 20, 2010, 01:18:44 pm
The time has come for me to move forward.

For years, me & my wife had been planning to move to the countryside and almost a year ago we finally made the move and bought a new home from Kuhmoinen, Finland.

The new location of nearly 200km from the location of my current room is most likely to change a few things, but the business has been growing steadily and I'm doing a lot of unattended sessions, so I look at the future with trust.

I've been working for about 4 years at Studio Kuu's room B in Helsinki, the last year commuting back and forth. The new room will be built inside a cold farming house that practically only works as an outer shell and a fine roof. The mastering room itself will be built on a dedicated frame and a new concrete slab.

I will try to do an update at least once a week. I'm targeting to move in by early January, but only after I'm sure the room is functioning as I expect it to. I've hired a pair of excellent carpenters for the job, and they will be building it to the state from where I can continue with the acoustics. My carpenters are a father and a son that also happen to play in the same band - a guitarist and a drummer!

First, I would like to show off a few photos of the actual location. These photos were mostly taken in August.

http://www.virtalahde.com/pihatie.jpg
..Entering our yard, the construction site to-be on the left.

http://www.virtalahde.com/piha.jpg
..The yard from another angle. Our house is on the left. This end was built in the early 1900's, the other end before the mid 1850's. Healthy, old house with a history, just as we wanted.

http://www.virtalahde.com/sauna.jpg
...We've got a sauna. What'd you expect?

http://www.virtalahde.com/koski.jpg
..There's a pink noise generator behind the sauna. It was a dry, hot summer so the water level is pretty low compared to the one in April:

http://www.virtalahde.com/koski_kevat.jpg

Here's a few drawings of the actual plan (small and pixelated for a purpose). The acoustics design was done by Janne Riionheimo, who has done quite a few smaller rooms with excellent results.

http://www.virtalahde.com/pohjapiirros_1.gif

http://www.virtalahde.com/pohjapiirros_2.gif

The actual space is 34 square meters in size to begin with. After the basic, insulated room is built, we're at about 28 square meters, and after the internal walls and acoustic treatment is in place, the size is about 22 square meters.

I would have wanted a slightly bigger room, but here comes the part I liked about the space:

http://www.virtalahde.com/sivupiirros_1.gif

The height is 3,5 metres at maximum (minus those clouds), and the angled roof and the sloped front should be working out excellent.

http://www.virtalahde.com/etupiirros_1.gif
..This is the front wall, exploded.

http://www.virtalahde.com/takapiirros_1.gif
..And the back wall.

What I wanted was a fairly live but a controlled, well-behaving room. A big plus in this construction is that there is no need to do any kind of soundproofing, which makes controlling the low end much easier as there's less of it that gets trapped inside the room. Thus, a smaller room like this should be working out just fine. This was one of my key design goals. I'm targeting for a listening distance of about 2,3 metres, or whatever sounds the best.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on September 20, 2010, 01:21:23 pm
This is what the actual space looks like today:

http://www.virtalahde.com/etupaa.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/oikea_etu.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/vasen_etu.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/etupaa_ylhaalta.jpg
..This is the front wall from various angles.

http://www.virtalahde.com/vasen_taka.jpg
..The back wall from the left corner. I only have one photo of it at hand right now.

http://www.virtalahde.com/katto_profiili.jpg
..This is how the existing roof is constructed. The old hay visible in the back will soon be carried out and burned (cough).

As can be seen from the photos, the building is very basic. However, the winter with its shitload of heavy snow proved that it's a strong building and worth renovating. The studio space is the first step, the rest will be worked on during the next years.

Today's work started out by digging around the building, changing some soil. Underdrains (or whatever they're called in English) will be installed all around the building for keeping the place dry and steady in the future. The winter and the frozen ground tends to slowly break buildings, and some damage was done to the other end of the building. The shape of the building didn't change and it's still standing solid, so we can only go for the better from here.

http://www.virtalahde.com/salaoja_oikea.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/salaoja_etu1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/salaoja_vasen1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/rappu_salaoja.jpg
..This is the state we're at as I'm writing this. The underdrain part should be finished tomorrow, and after that the work on the foundations of the actual room begins.

It's going to take a while until there's music playing in that space, but if everything works out as planned, I will be working in a great new room in an inspiring environment within just a few months.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: dietrich on September 20, 2010, 01:58:44 pm
enjoy! looks like will be great live/work soon
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: resolectric on September 20, 2010, 02:01:45 pm
Wow!
Wonderful place and a great project!
Will surely follow this thread with interest.

The best of luck to you and congratulations on the move.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: cass anawaty on September 20, 2010, 02:14:25 pm
I'm so jealous, but happy for you.   Very Happy
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: odeon-mastering on September 20, 2010, 02:29:48 pm
Stunning location
As I am in the process of building a new room myself (unfortunately at a city center) I just want to wish you good luck.
I will be following this thread closely.

All the best,
Apostolos

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: lowland on September 20, 2010, 03:21:09 pm
All the best with it, Jaakko! My new build will be a broadly similar volume, although the apex runs the opposite way to yours and it's ground-up, no existing structure. The thing about not needing soundproofing (same here) is very liberating Smile
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: bblackwood on September 20, 2010, 03:23:08 pm
Awesome, can't wait to watch this come together, Jaakko!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Gold on September 20, 2010, 03:39:31 pm
Looks like a great location Jaakko. Best of luck.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: mcsnare on September 20, 2010, 03:46:31 pm
Fantastic! Thanks for sharing the build and very best of luck to you.

Dave
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: mastertone on September 20, 2010, 04:18:47 pm
Truly inspiring!

Wish you all the best with it Jaakko.

Sweden-Finland road trip could be ahead next summer Smile
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: jdg on September 20, 2010, 04:23:40 pm
good luck! looks like you got your work cutout for you for sure.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Greg Reierson on September 20, 2010, 04:23:41 pm
Looks awesome!


GR
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Thomas W. Bethel on September 20, 2010, 04:47:11 pm
NICE
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: bkuijt on September 20, 2010, 04:50:24 pm
Wow! Inspiring.

Good luck with the build.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: pmx on September 20, 2010, 05:13:44 pm
great location!

how close will you be to the front wall?

looking forward to more pics Smile
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: TotalSonic on September 20, 2010, 06:43:16 pm
Jaako -
very best of luck with this endeavor!  Looks like it will end up becoming a very cool spot!

Best regards,
Steve Berson
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Patrik T on September 20, 2010, 07:07:12 pm
Truly amazing! I have a similar dream.

I hope you consider the major importance and potential injection of additional spirit/peace to your mind by having a boat in that big lake you are neighboring.


Best Regards
Patrik
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: dave-G on September 20, 2010, 07:08:33 pm
Wow, Jaakko - that's a really lovely place!  Congrats, and best of luck with all of it.

-Dave
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Bonati on September 20, 2010, 07:14:29 pm
This looks great man, thanks for posting. I think we'll all be pretty excited to watch this thread develop.

One question - what's the maximum room width you're working with?
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: rankus on September 20, 2010, 08:58:10 pm


SO ENVIOUS!  (But very happy for YOU!)


Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Waltz Mastering on September 20, 2010, 10:08:23 pm
Nice setting.  Best of luck and skill with the new build.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: djwaudio on September 21, 2010, 08:52:24 am
A slice of heaven!  
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: ggidluck on September 21, 2010, 09:53:32 am
Work on music, take a sauna, go for a walk in the woods. That sounds like the ideal environment and a dream job!

Good luck on the build!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on September 21, 2010, 01:34:42 pm
Thank you for the compliments, good people!

I don't have pictures for today - it got dark before I had the time to do that, but I'll be uploading more pictures on weekend, if not before. It was also raining pretty heavily.

The underdrains are pretty much done and working, and we put a thick layer of big, crumbled rocks to the bottom of the upcoming concrete slab. Tomorrow we'll know if we'll get the concrete truck here by friday or not, but I believe I'll have a thick slab here by the weekend. A floor heating system will also be installed to the slab.

lowland wrote on Mon, 20 September 2010 22:21

My new build will be a broadly similar volume, although the apex runs the opposite way to yours and it's ground-up, no existing structure. The thing about not needing soundproofing (same here) is very liberating Smile


Congratulations for the build! I was considering building from the ground up myself, but I ended up using this space because the basic shape was actually pretty good. I also value history in buildings, so I decided I wanted to renovate the farming house. Agreed about the soundproofing part.

mastertone wrote on Mon, 20 September 2010 23:18

Sweden-Finland road trip could be ahead next summer Smile


You're most welcome! It's actually very easy to get here even by public transport if you're via from Helsinki.

pmx wrote on Tue, 21 September 2010 00:13

how close will you be to the front wall?


To the internal, acoustic wall, I will be at about 2,35 metres in the plan.

Patrik T wrote on Tue, 21 September 2010 02:07

Truly amazing! I have a similar dream.

I hope you consider the major importance and potential injection of additional spirit/peace to your mind by having a boat in that big lake you are neighboring.


You can make your dream work, don't you ever give it up.

The big lake is indeed beautiful, and while we might not get a boat, I really enjoy paddling and might need to invest in that.

Bonati wrote on Tue, 21 September 2010 02:14

One question - what's the maximum room width you're working with?


The internal walls without acoustics will be 4,95 metres maximum, and the length is 6,05 metres. At the listening spot, those doors (the entrance and the machine room) will be about 1,95 metres away to the either side. The narrowest part in the sloped front wall is about 2,1 metres.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Ed Littman on September 21, 2010, 01:57:49 pm
It's great to be able to take breaks in the freash air & see the family! your pix Brings back memories of my own build.
best of luck,
Ed
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: lowland on September 21, 2010, 02:00:28 pm
Viitalahde wrote on Tue, 21 September 2010 18:34


Congratulations for the build! I was considering building from the ground up myself, but I ended up using this space because the basic shape was actually pretty good. I also value history in buildings, so I decided I wanted to renovate the farming house. Agreed about the soundproofing part.

Thanks Jaakko, I'm glad you took the 'envelope' route! I would have a preferred a barn or similar as a starting point, though as it is the final building should have that kind of look.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: jackthebear on September 21, 2010, 02:25:37 pm
Best of luck to you Jaako......I tip my hat to you mate......fortune always favors the brave.

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: OTR-jkl on September 21, 2010, 10:16:11 pm
Very cool property!! You definitely have your work cut out for you though. Congratulations....
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Ben F on September 22, 2010, 02:12:46 am
Amazing!

It will actually end up being quite similar dimensions to the room I'm in- 28m2 with a 3.5m ceiling.

Not set in the wonderful country side though!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Peter Beckmann on September 22, 2010, 02:58:08 am
Very exciting! Good luck, and enjoy it!

Take lots of pictures

Peter
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: ThomasE on September 22, 2010, 10:39:48 am
Very inspiring - thanks for sharing this!
Good luck with everything!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: urm eric on September 22, 2010, 10:57:53 am
+1 on the nice things others have said. I'll be watching with great interest too ... Alway good to log in to literally constructive threads.

Cheers,

Eric
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: odeon-mastering on September 22, 2010, 11:07:02 am
urm eric wrote on Wed, 22 September 2010 09:57

. Alway good to log in to literally constructive threads.




Studio construction threads tend to be addictive...I remember Darius thread and how eagerly I was waiting for his posts
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: urm eric on September 22, 2010, 11:11:13 am
odeon-mastering wrote on Wed, 22 September 2010 10:07

urm eric wrote on Wed, 22 September 2010 09:57

. Alway good to log in to literally constructive threads.




Studio construction threads tend to be addictive...I remember Darius thread and how eagerly I was waiting for his posts


Yup - o.k. time to put the pressure on Lowland Nigel to get his camera out too ... Twisted Evil
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Garrett H on September 22, 2010, 09:13:23 pm
more pictures
more pictures
more pictures!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on September 25, 2010, 05:56:17 am
Update time.

I was in Helsinki for the rest of the week and left the builders alone. We did not get the concrete for the foundations here yet since we ran out of floor heating cable. No biggie, it's not a rush and I got a chance to take a few photos before the only visible thing is a solid block of concrete.

http://www.virtalahde.com/etupuoli_salaojat1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/etupuoli_salaojat2.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/hirsinavetta_takaa.jpg
..The underdrains are now finished and working around the building, and the only thing left to do is some landscaping around the yard. The building looks different now, and I have no doubt that the foundations are now stable as the rainwater is steered away from the building instead of soaking the land under the building, only to expand in the winter and ruin the foundations.

http://www.virtalahde.com/ovet_ennenvalua2.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/ovet_ennenvalua1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/rappu1.jpg
..This is what the entrance looks like now. There's going to be a block of concrete in front of the doors. Those doors are only cosmetic, the real door is going to be the studio door.

http://www.virtalahde.com/rappu3.jpg
..The iron inside the concrete still needs to be lifted some 40mm upwards, and the lifters are in that sack.

http://www.virtalahde.com/kynnys1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/rappu2.jpg
..Here you can see the construction under the foundations. First there's a thick layer of crumbled rocks, I think they're about 50-60mm in size, max. Then we have two layers of styrofoam, total of 100mm. The edges of the foundations are insulated with polyurethane - you don't want your floor heating the cold outside air!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on September 25, 2010, 05:59:10 am
http://www.virtalahde.com/nostep.jpg
..I swear I didn't!

http://www.virtalahde.com/vastukset_takaoikea1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/vastukset_takaa_tikkaat.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/vastukset_takaa.jpg
..Here's a few good shots from the back. On the left side of the door you can see a roll of thick cable - that's the tomorrow's job for me. The 3-phase cable coming to the building was too thin for the floor heating, so I'm digging in a new cable from the house.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: bblackwood on September 25, 2010, 06:05:11 am
I absolutely LOVE the exterior building for this - can't wait to see where you take the finish of the interior of the studio. Are you going to go for a more rustic look overall or go for the difference of a really modern space?
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on September 25, 2010, 06:20:26 am
bblackwood wrote on Sat, 25 September 2010 13:05

I absolutely LOVE the exterior building for this - can't wait to see where you take the finish of the interior of the studio. Are you going to go for a more rustic look overall or go for the difference of a really modern space?


Thanks Brad, I love the looks myself, too.

The interior is going to be more modern, but still "soft" with natural colors and materials. No need to take the 1800's thing over the top.

I'm probably going to have a special kind of a cork floor, and the colours used are mostly white and oak-ish coloured wood with some red for good effect.

http://www.airshowmastering.com/tpmastb.html

Randy LeRoy's room looks really good to me in this sense.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: livingstone on September 25, 2010, 06:55:34 am
Hey Jaakko !!

nature is a great source of inspiration & energy to work with music

best luck with this one !!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: urm eric on September 25, 2010, 07:54:45 am
Viitalahde wrote on Sat, 25 September 2010 05:20

 the colours used are mostly white and oak-ish coloured wood with some red for good effect.



Good choice - we have light oak and red all through the Barn here: simultaneously stimulating and relaxing. I wish we had your lively water features though: there's a big pond, but it has no ambitions to move at all.

Really interested in the positioning you're trying there: facing the rising roof. I'll be keen to hear how it works out.

Cheers,

Eric
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: bblackwood on September 25, 2010, 08:44:25 am
Viitalahde wrote on Sat, 25 September 2010 05:20

Randy LeRoy's room looks really good to me in this sense.

Yah, that's a very comfy looking space, I like it.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: MoreSpaceEcho on September 25, 2010, 12:57:53 pm
bblackwood wrote on Sat, 25 September 2010 11:05

I absolutely LOVE the exterior building for this


same thing i thought. it's going to be nice watching this all develop. congrats Jaakko!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Jerry Tubb on September 25, 2010, 02:05:11 pm
Cool beans Jaakko!

It'll be fun watching you put this together.

Keep a little rustic on the inside too, adds to the charm.

JT
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Bonati on September 26, 2010, 05:52:38 pm
Hey Jaakko - looking great. I'm curious - what sort of timelines did you get from the acoustician for the whole project? I.e. how much estimated time for foundation work, room construction, room tuning, etc etc?

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: jackthebear on September 26, 2010, 07:32:58 pm
Bonati wrote on Mon, 27 September 2010 07:52

Hey Jaakko - looking great. I'm curious - what sort of timelines did you get from the acoustician for the whole project? I.e. how much estimated time for foundation work, room construction, room tuning, etc etc?




Not Jaakko but I imagine these will be time and $$$ dependent.......if you have the resources and financing to back you almost anything is possible in a frightenly short amount of time.......we managed to build 2 rooms from scratch in 13 weeks.......we went flat stick 18 hrs a day 7 days a week........and had a very sympathetic bank manager.......

The planning and permits took us almost a year.....

We're in the early stages of planning and building a new room at a different location as part of an expansion right now and I envisage a longer planing and permit battle......

I swore black and blue I would never do this again.....but I guess I'm a glutton for punishment......
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on September 27, 2010, 06:20:16 am
jackthebear wrote on Mon, 27 September 2010 02:32

Bonati wrote on Mon, 27 September 2010 07:52

Hey Jaakko - looking great. I'm curious - what sort of timelines did you get from the acoustician for the whole project?

Not Jaakko but I imagine these will be time and $$$ dependent.......if you have the resources and financing to back you almost anything is possible in a frightenly short amount of time


Josh & Tony,

I haven't spoke with the acoustician about timelines, but the construction workers' estimation is that this thing will be standing within about 6 weeks, and I don't really doubt it at all. From there, I will continue with the acoustics and measurements + tuning could perhaps take place in December.

I don't know if I'm too optimistic about the schedule of moving in in January, but it doesn't feel like that. The whole construction is surprisingly simple because it's a silent environment and there's no need to do soundproofing.

Of course this is yet to be seen. If the room magically turns out sounding like crap, it'll be tuned until it doesn't.

The concrete is coming in tomorrow. After that it'll dry for a couple of days, then the walls begin to rise.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: jackthebear on September 27, 2010, 07:30:15 am
Sounds good Jaakko and quite a reasonable goal to achieve not withstanding any unexpected hiccups along the way.

Being in environment which won't bring interference in or you doing so with anyone else is a great starting point.

Well you've made the all-important start brother......more power to you......
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Matt_G on September 27, 2010, 10:21:29 am
All the best with the new build Jaako! I'm in early planning stages for my new room as well. This one will be a complete build from the ground up. Designs are coming along just trying to work the local council angle to get the most space possible.  

Once things get approved & rolling along I'll post a construction thread too.

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: SafeandSound on September 29, 2010, 10:00:47 am
Looks great, all the best on the build, on a serious note though, make sure there are no local planning applications for wind farms, I know this is a problem in Sweden right now, causing massive uproar and dividing what were countryside neighbours . (they are not quiet, have you ever heard a 120 meter tall / 18m blades wind tower at 50m, frankly scary ! )
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 03, 2010, 10:30:46 am
It's time for the weekly update!

The foundations are done, and we've let it dry for the rest of the week because the nights have been quite cold. Once the basic frame is built and we'll be able to connect the 3-phase breaker box, the first thing to do is to connect the floor heating system and use it to dry up the concrete for good.

http://www.virtalahde.com/sisaankaynti_valettu.jpg
..This is how the entrance looks like now.

http://www.virtalahde.com/kynnys_valettu.jpg
..That missing piece between the two blocks of concrete will be done manually.

http://www.virtalahde.com/lattia_valettu_etupaa.jpg
..The front, those tubes are for cabling and there's also a hidden cableway to the machine room (more like a closet!) running under the floor.

http://www.virtalahde.com/lattia_valettu_takapaa.jpg
..The back. See that old wooden wall? We've been going forward and backward in ideas whether to keep it or not, but right now it looks like we'll be able to keep it. The wall will be the back wall of those small shelves on the left & right to the triangular bass trap/diffuser. I think it's going to look and feel excellent once cleaned up.

http://www.virtalahde.com/laitehuone_kaapeliputket.jpg
..The machine room to-be. Lots of floor heating cabling there.

http://www.virtalahde.com/maakaapeli_raudoitus.jpg
.."That's not a ground wire.. THIS is a ground wire."

http://www.virtalahde.com/ylinen_siivottu.jpg
..Wait, where did all that hay go?

http://www.virtalahde.com/poltto_1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/poltto_2.jpg
..The fire department didn't show up, even if we did a pretty good effort in smoking the whole neighborhood. The yard looks pretty ugly after all that landscaping, but once we've evened all that ash around and seeded in a new lawn, it's gonna be all green again.

The work with the actual frame starts tomorrow, and I'm really excited to see an actual structure build up.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: archtop on October 03, 2010, 11:39:49 am
I'm  glad you decided to use that wood wall, I really dig it.


If you were to try to make that happen in a "new build"  $$$$$$$$$$
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 11, 2010, 09:51:00 am
Time for an update!

What can I say, these boys are quick. The site already looks completely different, and at the early point of building the structure, there is a LOT of measurement going on, which can be considered as "slow" work. Phew.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_01_kynnys_valmis1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_01_kynnys_valmis2.jpg
..The missing piece of concrete is now done.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_02_ovi_levytys1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_02_ovi_levytys2.jpg
..The inside now looks like this. The brown stuff on the old walls is for stopping the wind blowing inside the building and also for keeping any residual water & snow leaking through the old wall. The material has been used in Finnish building for decades, and it's just about as optimum as it gets for the purpose.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_03_palkki1.jpg
..Ok, so what's this piece standing here for?

http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_03_palkki2.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_03_palkki3.jpg
..It supports the new, fat top bar from the left side of the room. My maximum ceiling height is going to be only a little lower than this piece of wood here.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_03_palkki4.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_03_palkki5.jpg
..It also supports the old roof, albeit very slightly. That old piece of log is a little bent, but if it decides to bend more, the new structure will hold it with ease.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 11, 2010, 09:52:27 am
http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_06_ylh1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_06_ylh2.jpg
..Did I already tell you how much I love this shape, with the upgoing roof and the max ceiling height? I think it's going to be great!

It's funny to compare the old, crummy structure against the new one. Depending on how you look, either one always looks like it's completely out of whack. Maintaining the specified inner dimensions was actually pretty tricky because the old structure for sure wasn't straight at all angles. But my carpenters made it work.

Just like mastering engineer's are professionals, carpenters are too. The skills they have are absolutely invaluable.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_07_etus0.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_07_etus1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_07_etus2.jpg
..Some pics of the front wall construction. The all-important ventilation space can be seen between the wind stopping material and the frame/insulation.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_08_bwp.jpg
..Wasn't this thing in The Blair Witch Project?

http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_04_sivuseina1.jpg
..The right wall is building up.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_05_hirsi1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_05_hirsi2.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1110_05_hirsi3.jpg
..And a couple of shots of how the joint between the old and new wall is coming together. The old wall can be thought of two "windows" punched the new wall. They will serve as the back of some shelves, and as long as everything is properly insulated from all of the edges, things are going to be fine.

That's it for this week!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: bblackwood on October 11, 2010, 10:24:18 am
Looking good!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Jerry Tubb on October 11, 2010, 01:28:33 pm
Love those ancient timbers, and the fact that you chose a wood frame, somehow fitting.

Watching with vicarious enthusiasm... JT
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 16, 2010, 03:29:23 pm
Well, things are progressing fast, and I was extremely delighted to see the shape of the room building up as the basic frame is pretty much done.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_ovelta1.jpg
..The place of the door is locked in.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_sivuprof_oikea2.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_sivuprof_vasen1.jpg
..The shape of the rising roof can now be clearly seen.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_etupaa1.jpg
..I believe the internal acoustic wall is going to go like that. The amount of wool behind the wall gives me chills.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_takanurkka_vasen1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_sivuprof_oikea1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_katto1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_katto2.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_katto3.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_taitos_lahelta1.jpg
..It's all built from strong beams of wood. This construction truly is a building inside of a building. Nothing else will do because it might get pretty cold during the winter, so no thin walls are accepted.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 16, 2010, 03:32:33 pm
http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_ovi_ylhaalta1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_etupaa_ylhaalta2.jpg
..I'm starting to feel the height here!

http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_ylapohja1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_ylapohja2.jpg
..I wonder if all this gives me bats in the attic?

http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_sivuseina_palkki_vasen.jpg
..That horizontal beam in the middle of the wall is at about my height, and I'm 184cm tall. I know the height doesn't show from the pictures, but I was *really* surprised how the internal height of 3,5 metres at the highest spot felt like. I just love it.

The clouds are of course dropping the height a little, but it's still over 3 metres, I think.

I'm thinking of the light here, and I want a lot. If I'd have a lot daylight-like light above the ceiling clouds, I bet it'd feel like I've got the sun shining down my neck while I'm working.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_takaseina1.jpg
..That's about the width of the upcoming back shelf, I believe.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_takaseina_rako1.jpg ..The plan has changed a little in that we won't be extending the old wall up, but building a new wall in front and just leave the wanted spots of the old wall visible (with necessary insulation around all the edges).

This does shorten the room a little, but this should only affect the exact listening spot.

http://www.virtalahde.com/1610_hirsi1.jpg
..Some people post pictures of gear.

I think old timber is far more interesting.




Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Larrchild on October 16, 2010, 04:52:54 pm
Nice that the sub-ceiling beam abuts the main log. Good idea for later.
Keeping some old wall is a decent compromise and retains a little original surface which seems diffusive anyway. So nice! Framing shows shape as you say. Are the Finnish Finish Carpenters the same crew?
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: mastertone on October 16, 2010, 05:17:01 pm
Very nice progress Jaakko!
What you are doing to that barn is really something else!
Im glad for you, this is really inspiring, as you know i have similar ideas leaving the city, its a few years away... and if i can come close or even half to what you are achieving here it would definitely  be worth it...




Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 17, 2010, 07:42:08 am
Larrchild wrote on Sat, 16 October 2010 23:52

Nice that the sub-ceiling beam abuts the main log. Good idea for later.
Keeping some old wall is a decent compromise and retains a little original surface which seems diffusive anyway. So nice! Framing shows shape as you say. Are the Finnish Finish Carpenters the same crew?


Yeah, I've been really pleased how the maximum space can be had and the geometry is good. Keeping the old wall visible really is an important feel factor to me.

The carpenters are indeed the same, throughout the job. I've been really happy about their work.

mastertone wrote on Sun, 17 October 2010 00:17

Very nice progress Jaakko!
What you are doing to that barn is really something else!
Im glad for you, this is really inspiring, as you know i have similar ideas leaving the city, its a few years away... and if i can come close or even half to what you are achieving here it would definitely  be worth it...


Thanks! And just go for it, don't be afraid when you see the opportunity.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Chris McDonnell on October 17, 2010, 08:01:53 am
This looks like a great build, and in a beautiful location too!

I'm sure it's going to be amazing when it's done, all the best of luck with it.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Samc on October 17, 2010, 10:04:43 am
I have two questions; aren't you concerned about water coming off the driveway in front of the building and causing problems?  I know you have a system in place to protect from the water, but neither the system or your foundation seem to go below the frost-line.  I'm also wondering how the styrofoam laying on the ground can/will prevent water from soaking the ground below them, or maybe I'm missing something.

My other question is about all the (untreated and unprotected) bottom plates that seem to be sitting directly on the concrete slab, is that okay?
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 17, 2010, 10:51:36 am
Samc wrote on Sun, 17 October 2010 17:04

aren't you concerned about water coming off the driveway in front of the building and causing problems?


Tried & tested during the spring, when the work hadn't even started. We had a lot of snow last winter, and all of it melted within a few weeks. I found practically zero water coming inside the building (or standing in front of the building), so my assumption is that the ground soaks it and it travels away deep below.

Quote:

I know you have a system in place to protect from the water, but neither the system or your foundation seem to go below the frost-line.  I'm also wondering how the styrofoam laying on the ground can/will prevent water from soaking the ground below them, or maybe I'm missing something.


First of all, the building has been standing steady on its place for decades with no underdrains and no renovation. That proves something. Last winter was also a great test with record-braking ground frost depths going metres down. Honestly, a lot of old buildings like this collapsed for good last winter. I'm pretty proud to see this one standing straight.

The underdrain thing is how they're build here, and they just seem to work. I don't know what else to say to that. The styrofoam on top is angled, and its purpose (besides from slight insulation) is to steer the surface water towards the underdrains. The soil around the underdrains is also changed in ths type of construction to soil that cuts the capillary action (water climbing up), but lets the water go through to the drains.

For deeper ground water there of course is no solution. The system keeps the surrounding of the building dry(er) so the water doesn't soak up the soil, freeze during the winter and break the building. The deeper water flows how it wants to, and doesn't freeze during the winter.

Quote:

My other question is about all the (untreated and unprotected) bottom plates that seem to be sitting directly on the concrete slab, is that okay?


Do you mean the base of the wooden frame? It's definately OK to be sitting on the concrete slab, perfectly normal. The slab is warm, dry and insulated, and the wood is protected from any outside rainwater and such.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 24, 2010, 01:03:54 pm
OK, just a few photos for today. The insulation on the angled roof is done, and it was a little bit tricky one to do.

The thermal insulation in that structure is done with polyurethane foam sheets, because they are much more effective in insulation vs. thickness. If it was done with wool, the ceiling height would've dropped a little too much.

http://www.virtalahde.com/2210_etupaa_oik.jpg
..You can also see the electricians have visited the site. Basic cabling has been run where I specified them to be at, nothing is connected yet.

http://www.virtalahde.com/2210_vinokatto1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/2210_kattopiuha.jpg
..This cable is above up desk, it's gonna be for my working light. I'm thinking of this one:

http://www.lamppukauppa.fi/tuotteet/riippuvalaisimet-yksiosa iset/grandis-punainen

http://www.virtalahde.com/2210_vinokatto_takakulma1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/2210_vinokatto_takakulma2.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/2210_vinokatto_ovi.jpg
..Looks well done to me! You can also see that some more of that brown stuff is installed on the upper back wall:

http://www.virtalahde.com/2210_takaseina1.jpg
..The room is now wind resistant from all angles!

The next step is to install the insulating wool all around the building. I think the basic drywall sheets can also be installed soon.





Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: mcsnare on October 24, 2010, 06:03:08 pm
Looking great!


Dave
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: mastertone on October 24, 2010, 06:19:35 pm
Nice progress!

Cool lamp. How will you do with the console? Sterling Mod. Or will you custom one?
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: resolectric on October 26, 2010, 10:10:05 am
Viitalahde wrote on Mon, 11 October 2010 14:51

...The brown stuff on the old walls is for stopping the wind blowing inside the building and also for keeping any residual water & snow leaking through the old wall. The material has been used in Finnish building for decades, and it's just about as optimum as it gets for the purpose. ...


Could you give a name for this material?
At first it looked like cork but now i see it's quite different. What is it?
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 31, 2010, 04:23:47 pm
Time for an update! First I'll show you a few pics of the insulation wool installation, my wife took the pics during the middle of the week. I knew some of the details would be hidden before this weekend.

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_villaa_ovi1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_villaa_etu1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_villaa_taka1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_villaa_taka2.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_villaa_vasentaka1_kork.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_villaa_hirsi1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_villaa_hylly2.jpg

..Looking good! I'm thinking how the insulation wool combined with the inner acoustics wool will both together work well as thermal insulation, too. This might be a pretty energy efficient build in keeping the place warm.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 31, 2010, 04:25:36 pm
Now this is where we are today. All the insulation is in place, much of the tar paper (the black stuff) is in place - much better stuff than just wrapping the place up in plastic.

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_ovi1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_oikeaetu1.jpg

..Notice the horizontal structure in the angled roof. This is for the upcoming drywall roof. We were also just talking about making sure this structure ventilates properly if it ever happens moisture builds up between the polyurethane and the drywall. The carpenter came up with a small, simple modification in the front that should take care of that.

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_oikeasivu1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_oikeataka2.jpg

..Two drywall sheets in place for demonstration. They have a 9mm gap between them - this (as well as *all* such joints will be filled with elastic Tremseal mass. This makes sure the specified sound isolation/air tightness properties will also stay the same in the future.

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_peraseina1.jpg

..There won't be any drywall in where that sheet and the wool package are. The triangular bass trap will be built there. Loads of wool = warm. And the bass stays in control! The height of the bass trap will be the same as the height of the two shelves, 180cm.

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_vasentaka1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_aukko1.jpg

..This where the used air will go out through a pipe. We'll be trying good old gravity-based ventilation for starters. If it won't be enough, it's easy to add something to the system to help it out. With proper muffling, of course.

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_hirsi1.jpg

..That thing is going to look awesome once finished. I'm thinking of having glass shelves there, possibly smoked glass. And they won't be holding one single lava lamp.

http://www.virtalahde.com/3110_katto_taka.jpg

We're a little bit behind the schedule, because some of the construction with the angled roof became a little tricky. but from here, the pace will only go up. Putting the drywall in place is pretty quick, and after that the construction for the inner frames such as the front wall and the machine closet begins.

I just ordered the floor material, along with other stuff. I came up with a cork floor - Wicanders Vinyl Comfort. Vinyl-covered cork floor, very nice printed wood-like texture with the softness of a cork floor.

  http://www.wicanders.com/client/documentos/brochuras/63146MT _Wicanders_Vinyl_Home-Com_INT_PQ_Crop_02_2010.pdf

Just about every laminate I held in my hands felt like crap, and a wooden floor is a bit tricky with floor heating.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 31, 2010, 04:32:02 pm
mastertone wrote on Mon, 25 October 2010 01:19

How will you do with the console? Sterling Mod. Or will you custom one?


Custom one. Finally decided on the design, pretty Sterling Modulari-ish, but a bit simpler and not as chunky.

resolectric wrote on Tue, 26 October 2010 17:10

Could you give a name for this material?
At first it looked like cork but now i see it's quite different. What is it?


Wind barrier would be the english term, and I think it's made from pressed wood fibres. If it wets, it dries up, and it doesn't loose its wind stopping qualities from being wet.

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Barry Hufker on October 31, 2010, 04:59:49 pm
Jaakko,

Forgive me for asking, especially if this has been asked before...

Your name is Viital
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on October 31, 2010, 05:07:55 pm
Barry Hufker wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 22:59

Your name is Viital
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: dcollins on October 31, 2010, 08:05:09 pm
Viitalahde wrote on Sun, 31 October 2010 14:07


It's dumb and confusing, but at this point, I'm just going to leave it like that.



I'm enjoying your build pictures but have always had a question:

How do you pronounce your name?  

When I read it my mental voice says "virtual head," but I don't think that is the correct way.


DC
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: domc on October 31, 2010, 08:19:54 pm
dcollins wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 10:05


When I read it my mental voice says "virtual head," but I don't think that is the correct way.



Even if thats not it...now it always will be when I read it - dag nab it
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on November 01, 2010, 07:58:37 am
dcollins wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 02:05

How do you pronounce your name?  

When I read it my mental voice says "virtual head," but I don't think that is the correct way.


Tricky question, let's try it out. Finnish language is not the easiest.

Vii-TaL'
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Andrew Hamilton on November 01, 2010, 09:59:21 am
Love the build report, Viitalahde.  Can you not just cover the rock wool with burlap or silk?  Or would it be too cold - even with the other wind barriers you've put up?  




Andrew
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Greg Reierson on November 01, 2010, 10:01:48 am
Viitalahde wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 06:58

 Finnish language is not the easiest.


I though all of the names ended is "nen" and everyone drove F1 and/or rally cars...


GR
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Patrik T on November 01, 2010, 02:04:24 pm
Regarding the name I think you need to drop this board a small soundfile.

For a swede is easy to nail the  Viiltar
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: dcollins on November 01, 2010, 07:29:25 pm
Viitalahde wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 04:58


Some people describe Finnish that you need to pronounce it as its written.



Then you should spell it "Luxury-Yacht"

Perhaps a sound sample like they have on Wikipedia would help.

Must be sampled 192/32 to really get the nuances, though. 44/16 never does get the umlauts accurately.


DC
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Gio on November 01, 2010, 09:33:10 pm
Viitalahde wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 07:58

dcollins wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 02:05

How do you pronounce your name?  

When I read it my mental voice says "virtual head," but I don't think that is the correct way.


Tricky question, let's try it out. Finnish language is not the easiest.

Vii-TaL'
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Barry Hufker on November 02, 2010, 03:11:40 am
Thanks for the name explanation and the pronunciation guide.  I find it fascinating.  And many thanks for sharing your construction adventure.

Barry

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: UnderTow on November 02, 2010, 02:04:49 pm

This all looks great! Just one comment:

Viitalahde wrote on Sun, 24 October 2010 19:03


..This cable is above up desk, it's gonna be for my working light. I'm thinking of this one:

 http://www.lamppukauppa.fi/tuotteet/riippuvalaisimet-yksiosa iset/grandis-punainen



Won't that shine in your customer's eyes if you ever have an attended session? It might also cause reflections on screens and/or dials. I personally prefer indirect lighting when possible.

Alistair
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on November 03, 2010, 04:56:28 pm
One of the carpenters sent some pics to my email yesterday - looks like things are chaning fast. Almost all of the drywall sheets were installed yesterday, and I heard the Tremseal work started today.

http://www.virtalahde.com/Kuva0529.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/Kuva0530.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/Kuva0532.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/Kuva0533.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/Kuva0536.jpg

Can't wait to see the place on friday!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on November 03, 2010, 04:57:54 pm
UnderTow wrote on Tue, 02 November 2010 20:04

Won't that shine in your customer's eyes if you ever have an attended session? It might also cause reflections on screens and/or dials. I personally prefer indirect lighting when possible.


I'm going to mostly use indirect light, too. And I did realize that lamp is huge when I actually thought of it. I'd still like to have something hanging above the desk. Gotta think.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on November 03, 2010, 05:09:08 pm
Andrew Hamilton wrote on Mon, 01 November 2010 15:59

Love the build report, Viitalahde.  Can you not just cover the rock wool with burlap or silk?  Or would it be too cold - even with the other wind barriers you've put up?


First of all, the room is designed to have some reverb left, and a little of this comes from hard drywall surfaces.

I guess you could make a house which is like a fluffy ball of insulation.. Never thought of that. But it's never done, so I suppose there's something to it. Drywall alone isn't an insulator, but it does prevent wind coming in (the wind barriers don't stop it all), and I suppose it helps in insulation combined with wool.

I'm not an expert on this, but I do know that 3 months from now, I'll probably have a situation in where there's a 50 degrees celcius of difference between the room temperature and the outside temperature. Room +20, outside -30. I'd better be sure.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on November 07, 2010, 04:19:32 pm
The drywall is done!

http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_etupaa1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_ovi1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_etuvas1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_vasensivu1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_takakatto2.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_takakatto1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_takaseina1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_hylly1.jpg

Apart from the spot where the triangular trap is coming in the back wall, the drywall installation is finished. All drywall seams are sealed with sticky Tremseal mass, which smells pretty dense.

The visible drywall surfaces will be the upper back wall, half of the upper side back walls, the walls around the doors, and partially the high ceiling. The Tremseal seams need a lot of further work to make the visible surfaces paintable, but it should work out fine.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on November 07, 2010, 04:20:54 pm
http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_kaapeli1.jpg
..Every cable hole got stuffed, too.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_sauma1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0711_sauma2.jpg

You can see from these close-ups the mass is pretty thick goo. I tried to break one of the cable seals by twisting the cable around, but the goo joint didn't mind at all. Very flexible stuff.

The next week continues with the inner structures for the acoustic walls.  
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on November 23, 2010, 03:27:34 pm
It's update time, finally. I felt too lazy two weeks ago to take some photos and put them here.

This week I'm working at the studio myself, and I'm going to take it as far as I possibly can. The plan is to paint *all* of the visible drywall surfaces and do all the messy work, so that the floor can be installed as soon as possible, as well as the electricity can be finished.

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_nurkka_oik1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_nurkka_vas1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_etupaa1.jpg

This is where we are today. Quite a lot of progress from the last time. All the internal acoustic frames are done, most of the wool is stuffed in, doors are in place and what not. The last bits of drywall are also in. There are a few ugly seams that I'll simply hide with nice pieces of wood.

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_etupaa2.jpg

The thickness of the front wall is 200mm, and it will be stuffed full. Those three vertical bars are for mounting the LCD screen. Right now I'm thinking of a 32", 42's seem too big for me. Or perhaps a 37".

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_vinokatto1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_vinokatto2.jpg

The Gyptone ceiling was put in today. Near the walls in the back we used plain old drywall sheets. Looks pretty nice, actually. Even better after finishing and painting.

The depth of the internal ceiling is 200mm, two layers of 100mm wool inside. The currently open area will be covered with 30mm rigid acoustic panels, which I will cover with fabric. I think I need to shave off from the back of the panels a little from where the frame beams are, it'd be nice to have it at the same level with the surrounding Gyptone ceiling.

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_laitetila_ovi1.jpg

This is the door to the machine room, or a machine closet. Lots of cables remaining to be connected. The floor heating is working, and it's working well. There's some missing insulation at the roof and the -10 degrees air outside is blowing through one spot in the old wall, but the floor heating is set to 16 degrees (internal temperature), and the real room temperature is actually too warm.

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_laitetila1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_laitetila2.jpg

Yes, it's a tiny one and you can't fit a cutting lathe there, but you can fit a computer there just fine. I'll probably make up a shelving system there, too. That hole in the wall will be sealed when the electricity is done.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on November 23, 2010, 03:29:24 pm
http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_takapaa1.jpg

This is the back wall now. Sorry for all the crap. The triangular bass trap is full of wool, and I'm actually quite surprised that I like its presence. I accepted the trap as a sort of a necessity, but now I'm liking it. It's interesting. I'll just have to try to control myself to not to pile up crap on top of it.

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_sivuseina2.jpg

This is the side wall frame, 100mm in depth and covered with the same stuff I'm going to use in a part of the ceiling. The diffusers will be mounted on top of it.

http://www.virtalahde.com/2311_sivurunko1.jpg

With the diffusers mounted, the depth of this thing is going to be enough to hold some sort of a light that shoots upwards to the wall. I think it could be cool. Another option could be these on both side walls:

http://www.lamppukauppa.fi/tuotteet/seinavalaisimet-moderni/ freya

I'll just have to stare at the room long enough to come into some sort of a conclusion.

The work continues tomorrow with the drywall surfaces. I'll be updating at least on sunday or so, perhaps earlier if things progress fast or something interesting happens like a bobcat invasion to the studio.

Until then - enjoy!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: mastertone on November 23, 2010, 05:28:42 pm
Very very nice progress Jaakko.

Will you fit a sofa in front of that triangular basstrap?
Is the "closet" for your computer machine vented?
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: mcsnare on November 23, 2010, 08:45:50 pm
Looking great! I'm very excited for you. I'd bet it's going to sound awesome. What kind of monitor setup are you planning on using?

Dave
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Andrew Hamilton on November 24, 2010, 03:24:52 am
Viitalahde wrote on Wed, 03 November 2010 17:09

...the room is designed to have some reverb left, and a little of this comes from hard drywall surfaces.

I guess you could make a house which is like a fluffy ball of insulation.. Never thought of that. But it's never done, so I suppose there's something to it.


Without creating an anechoic chamber, I think there's a lot to be said for making a control (or mastering) room a Reflection Free Zone.   A primitive root quadratic diffusor on the back wall and a wooden floor from the console to the back wall should be plenty live in a room of that size.   I tend to think that every other wall that is closer than about 30 feet needs to be absorptive or a combination of absorption and diffusion - such as the rooms at Masterdisk (with variously wide vertical panels spaced with burlap-covered insulation between them |_||_|__|_|||_|_||_ etc...).

Viitalahde wrote on Wed, 03 November 2010 17:09


Drywall alone isn't an insulator, but it does prevent wind coming in (the wind barriers don't stop it all), and I suppose it helps in insulation combined with wool.


Precisely how I imagine its insulating quality - wind-breakage, and heat-keepage.  (;

Viitalahde wrote on Wed, 03 November 2010 17:09


I'm not an expert on this, but I do know that 3 months from now, I'll probably have a situation in where there's a 50 degrees celcius of difference between the room temperature and the outside temperature. Room +20, outside -30. I'd better be sure.



"Baby, it's cold outside..."  


Pohjanmaan kautta,
    Andrew

Andrew
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on November 25, 2010, 02:14:00 pm
mastertone wrote on Wed, 24 November 2010 00:28

Will you fit a sofa in front of that triangular basstrap?
Is the "closet" for your computer machine vented?


No, the sofa appears on some drawings, but I'm going to fit just two chairs there, on both sides of the tip of the bass trap.

The closet will be vented, just a tiny pipe to the outside.

mcsnare wrote on Wed, 24 November 2010 03:45

Looking great! I'm very excited for you. I'd bet it's going to sound awesome. What kind of monitor setup are you planning on using?


Thank you!

The speaker setup is my nr. 1 concern at the moment. I'm trying out an ATC-ish three way speaker (12" ATC woofer and the dome mid + a Morel MDT-33 tweeter in a sealed cabinet), electronic crossover and a 3-way Hypex amp.

I started designing the system years ago, but came to the conclusion that it was simply going to be too damned big for my current room, so I halted it for a while. Now I decided to finish it because I still believe the plan is good, but of course I have not heard the system yet in my new room. I'm planning to do that on week 49.

If it happens that the system just doesn't sound right there, I'll have to figure something out quickly. I probably will try my current Questeds there for starters, or perhaps the bigger ones. The passive 3208's (?) could also work there, and I might be able to use the Hypex amp.  

Actually, I'm pretty sure the system will sound great there, but I'm trying to mentally prepare myself for the worst.

Andrew Hamilton wrote on Wed, 24 November 2010 10:24

Without creating an anechoic chamber, I think there's a lot to be said for making a control (or mastering) room a Reflection Free Zone.   A primitive root quadratic diffusor on the back wall and a wooden floor from the console to the back wall should be plenty live in a room of that size.


I can understand the logic behind that, and it's a good, proven recipe.

It comes down to personal preference and the room-speakers combination. The ultimate aim for me is a room in where I can forget the speakers and just receive a big window of sound I can step into. If I can find the right combination of room sound that helps in this transition and still provides enough accuracy for doing my job, I'll be a happy boy.

Technically, the design of my room is based on a good mix of absorbtive/reflective surfaces (50/50 mix) in the front and back with diffusers (look like some sort of QRD to me) in the back side wall. A small part of the reverb comes from the walls around the doors, but mostly from the upper back wall and the upper side walls. This is further controlled with the ceiling clouds.

We'll soon hear what the room really sounds like, and in case I find it too lively, I have a plenty of 30mm Ecophon panels for further damping.

For some reason, I remember the RT60 estimation floating around 0,38, which seemed surprisinly low to me when you look at the design. If I want to increase it, there's an option of leaving one of the ceiling clouds off.

Andrew Hamilton wrote on Wed, 24 November 2010 10:24

Pohjanmaan kautta


Cheers!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: William Bowden on November 26, 2010, 09:24:11 am
Great thread, I'm late to the party as usual and this is a fantastic escape from all those newbie questions over at the err, 'other forum'.

I'm curious to know what crossover you're using or planning to use. I'm also interested in running my C4s using either bi-amping or even tri-amping (probably a bit over the top) and I'm going to do some experiments over Xmas if the wife will let me.

I also like a room with some life in it, not sure mine's 50/50, but I've always gone for the theory that most domestic rooms have a lot of live surfaces and I don't think working in semi anechoic rooms is either comfortable or a good reality check. You can always pad it down later anyway.

Like many others I love your location, having a mastering studio in my garden is one of the joys of my life; and being able to pop outside in the sun and listen to the sound of the world is a good break for the old ears.

I await the next photos with anticipation...

The King
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on December 06, 2010, 04:14:41 pm
I believe I promised to do an update a week ago.. So I make no such promises anymore.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0612_etupaa1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0612_etuoik1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0612_lattia1.jpg

Check out my Hi-Fi floor! Right now it's installed up to where to doors are at, from there some evening out was needed and the stuff settled in for the weekend. I love that floor so much, but it was stupid expensive.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0612_katto.jpg

I just put the Ecophon panels in, they will be covered with white fabric. If I find that boring, I'll put a layer of some sort of a thin fabric on top of it.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0612_takaoik1.jpg

You probably noticed the color looks different. All white. I start out with white, and then add colors as needed. The front will be red - found a really good looking fabric for it, as well as the bass trap in the back.

The ceiling clouds will most likely have some red in them, too. They're gonna look great hanging from there.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0612_takavas1_diff.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0612_takavas3_diff.jpg

These things I did this weekend. Mounted on top of those Ecophon panels covered with fabric. Screwed with long screws to the wooden frame behind the panels.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0612_diff1.jpg

And this is how they look like close up. Just an hour ago I began to think that I could light up those fabric-exposed gaps with warm white LED's. They could be mounted pointing down on that piece of wood I'm going to put of top the diffusers. So many options!

http://www.virtalahde.com/0612_takavas2_diff.jpg

I found out I screwed up a little. I specified a wall outlet there, but there's nothing above it to attach that shorter diffusor on.

There's some wood around the wall outlet, so I think I'll add a frame of similar wood around it and then screw down the bottom end of the short diffusor to this frame.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0612_hylly1.jpg

The frame of the shelf thing on the back has been deepened now.. Only needs white painted plywood or similar to the top, bottom and the sides.

The floor will be finished next week, and I'll try to have the electrician here next week, too. The next weekend I'm extending until wednesday, and I will be working my ass off to finish as much as possible.

All the remaining fabric will be mounted and the rest of the wood put on. These will be just pieces of wood cut to length, so it's a little quicker.

I've asked to have the ceiling hanger frames here by next weekend so that I could paint & finish them and hang them after the weekend (with some help).

The move-in will happen during 2nd week of January, and I'm sure there will be quite a bit of detail things to do, like hiding ugly seams away with pieces of wood. But it's a nice job to do with the speakers playing in the room.

I'm already getting some hints of the upcoming acoustics, and it feels really good in there.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on December 06, 2010, 04:22:46 pm
William Bowden wrote on Fri, 26 November 2010 16:24

I'm curious to know what crossover you're using or planning to use.


Right now I'm using an old ATC crossover that came from a custom installation. It sounds great, but I'll be building a crossover I designed for these speakers within two weeks. I think it will be even better. Nevertheless, the old ATC xover needs some service if it happened I wanted to really use it.

William Bowden wrote on Fri, 26 November 2010 16:24

Like many others I love your location, having a mastering studio in my garden is one of the joys of my life; and being able to pop outside in the sun and listen to the sound of the world is a good break for the old ears.


Sounds great to me, and I'm sure I'll be enjoying it myself. Right now we have no sun, it's winter and the short days we have are kind of grey. But there's a lot of snow already and it's a whole new world again. I like the winter.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Podgorny on December 06, 2010, 05:43:44 pm
Tell me more about the Echophon panels. I looked at their website, but couldn't find the panels you're showing.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on December 07, 2010, 02:34:33 am
Podgorny wrote on Tue, 07 December 2010 00:43

Tell me more about the Echophon panels. I looked at their website, but couldn't find the panels you're showing.


The exact product name is Ecophon TAL-M, with the "M" standing for the shape of the edges/the proposed attachment system. I haven't glued them - I simply used screws to mount them.

The designer specified the coated & ready Ecophon Focus panels for the room, but I didn't feel like having 600x600 panels with their edges on the ceiling. Same for the side walls. So I went for the TAL panels instead and coated them with fabric. They're 10mm thicker than the Modus panels, but otherwise the same.

I think they're made of glass wool, meant for industrial applications and they're covered with some sort of felt that keeps the glass wool fibres from flying around.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on January 03, 2011, 05:01:56 pm
A month passed so quickly, and not a single update! I was actually going to do one on 23rd December, but I catched a pretty nasty cold for the holidays and even warming up the sauna from -25 degrees a 100 degrees up was a bit of a struggle in that condition.

This is what my room looks like, today.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_etupaa.jpg

There's still cosmetic work to hide out all those ugly seams, but the acoustics, according to the plan, is finished. As well is the electricity and the ventilation. So it's technically a fully working room.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_etupaa2.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_etupaa_oik.jpg

That black thing is the wall mount for the 32" LCD tv. The wooden parts are similarily toned as the rest of the wood around the house.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_etupaa_lahi.jpg

Close-up of the diffusor pattern and the fabric behind it. Looks excellent, if I may so say!

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_lattia1.jpg
http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_lattia2.jpg

I've probably preached about the floor enough already, but it really looks and feels excellent!

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_saha.jpg

I found this rusted saw when we were still digging the surrounds of the building 3 months back. I think I need to hang it somewhere in the studio. It sucks as a saw but rules as a decoration item.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_lamppu.jpg

I didn't buy that big red lamp I was talking of earlier on. It's too big. This was just a cheap and simple lamp, but I kind of liked it so I bought it. I need more lamps!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on January 03, 2011, 05:03:27 pm
http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_taka1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_taka2.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_taka3.jpg

This is the triangular bass trap now.. Looks great, and does a nice trick to the eyes as you move around.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_kattoelem1.jpg

The ceiling clouds - we installed three of them. The 4th one was an optional one, and for some reason we couldn't have fit it in anyway. The two in the back aren't yet aligned correctly, because the electrician needed to be able to install the lamp sockets on the ceiling.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_kattoelem2.jpg

And how the ceiling things look from below. They will be aligned so that the next one is partially covering the other one. After I've aligned them right, I'll also add some safety wires just in case one of those chains fail. They shouldn't, though.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0601_hylly.jpg

The shelves - only need some paint and some decorational wood. And the shelves too, duh.

I also had my new desk in the room for a while during the holidays, but I wasn't a 100% happy about it so I sent it back to the carpenter for modifications. He did a really good job, the desk looks gorgeous, but I'm just being a bit of a dick about the details here.

Earlier on, I planned to move in for good after testing the room for a while. The build has taken a little longer than I predicted, so I'm skipping that and moving into this room next week. My last session is booked for Thursday this week. After this, I'm taking two weeks off for setting up the new room and doing at least some of the remaining cosmetic work, starting from the front.

The truth is that I'm getting pretty tired in living two lives instead of one, so the move has to be done now. Once I have everything in one place, it's going to be a non-brainer to finish the room and have some fun doing it.

I have no idea when the next update is here, but most likely you'll see my room set up there - or at least at the testing stage. Until then.. Enjoy!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: compasspnt on January 03, 2011, 05:43:00 pm
Looking great, congrats!

Maybe be careful of the rusty saw (encapsulate or seal it?). Is rust contagious?
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: mcsnare on January 03, 2011, 05:57:00 pm
Outstanding!! Thanks for the update.

Dave
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: mastertone on January 04, 2011, 07:07:06 am
Damn! Looking good Jaakko!

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Gold on January 04, 2011, 12:40:19 pm
compasspnt wrote on Mon, 03 January 2011 17:43

Looking great, congrats!

Maybe be careful of the rusty saw (encapsulate or seal it?). Is rust contagious?




If you need a coffee table you could put the saw in the middle of a clear resin block. It would look sweet.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Peter Beckmann on January 04, 2011, 05:12:13 pm
Looks great Jaakko. Bet you cant wait to get set up in the new space.

compasspnt wrote on Mon, 03 January 2011 22:43

Looking great, congrats!

Maybe be careful of the rusty saw (encapsulate or seal it?). Is rust contagious?


No, but tetanous....

Paul's idea of a resin coffee table with the saw embedded sounds pretty cool

Peter
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: NelsonL on January 05, 2011, 08:58:41 am
Gold wrote on Tue, 04 January 2011 09:40

compasspnt wrote on Mon, 03 January 2011 17:43

Looking great, congrats!

Maybe be careful of the rusty saw (encapsulate or seal it?). Is rust contagious?




If you need a coffee table you could put the saw in the middle of a clear resin block. It would look sweet.


This is the actual machine that I did my first paying sessions on, I like that it has a second life as a useful object:

http://www.readymade.com/file_uploads/6340/reel-to-reel-coffee-table__large.jpg
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: NelsonL on January 07, 2011, 08:29:26 am
PS, Jaakko your build out looks amazing-- I've been (quietly) enjoying the updates a good deal.

I hope my coffee table image isn't killing the thread vibe.

Best,

Liam
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on January 09, 2011, 05:03:17 pm
I wouldn't worry about the saw too much. I might aswell not hang it anywhere, or hang it somewhere out of reach.

Yesterday I disassembled my old room and moved everything in. Plenty of work to do, first sessions booked for the last week of January (well, actually I have two albums for 3rd, unofficially that is), but I should be fine. I'll finish the front end first, put all of the stuff in place and the finish the rest.

I might put my DAW in the room first, the machine room needs some work too.

Anyhow, now that I'm in no hurry and going nowhere from my little ranch, I believe I'll be much more efficient in finishing this.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on January 12, 2011, 03:44:42 pm
http://www.virtalahde.com/1201_testi.jpg

Just one picture for teasing.

I wanted to have a first listen at the room and just tossed a few things together, temporarily. All I can say is that the room sounds extremely good, and the first impression is that it does what asked for in the first place.

I am going to tell you more about the speakers later on, but right now I tell you it's a 12" ATC bass + ATC mid with a Morel tweeter in a 100L closed cabinet, active crossover and a 3-way Hypex amplifier (the big black chunk behind the console).

My playback system gives me a big picture, a sound I can step into and that engages me the right way. I don't think the mental adaptation is going to be that tricky at all. The bass sounds extremely tight, and a quick sweep proved there's good response down to 35Hz. Only minor dips somewhere above 60Hz and 150Hz, nothing big.

The stands are a temporary mock-off, just to experiment with the height and positioning. I think I'm going to just bite it and order a pair of Sound Anchors stands. The height is probably going to be 23", these things sound the best when I'm ever-so-slightly above the center of the mid dome.

As you can see, my desk came back from modifications. Now it's perfect and I'm a happy man.

The work continues..
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: bblackwood on January 12, 2011, 04:06:22 pm
Looks and feels GREAT, Jaakko! Congrats!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: jdg on January 12, 2011, 04:54:23 pm
a m a z i n g
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: SafeandSound on January 20, 2011, 05:59:47 pm
What about the comb filtering at the monitoring position Jaako?

I do not like your choice of wall paper, you should have kept it neutral colours like me,(beige/cream) it will date quickly (already looks like 1977) and be tricky to remove with the wood on top.

Good luck though, yawn.

I owed you one, we can all take a joke, can't we?

Razz
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: TotalSonic on January 21, 2011, 12:28:50 am
Awesome work Jaako!!!  Looks beautiful - I'm seriously envious.

Best regards,
Steve Berson
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on January 21, 2011, 03:21:59 am
I took some measurements yesterday and also tweaked the crossovers for best L/R uniformity, and a slightly better tonal balance. Now they sound extremely accurate. I might keep the old ATC crossover after all, just needs a recap and I'll also get rid of the pots when I've determined the crossover is done.

The waterfall plots of the room look extremely good, and exactly like what I'm hearing. Very uniform decay, nothing surprising going on. The bass is dry and deep, and while the calculated response of the speakers should be at -3dB/70Hz (with a 12dB/oct rolloff), the positioning against the wall gives me a good response down to 35Hz.

The desk of course gives its own problems, but a compromise has to be made because I could not work any other way. The new desk is much smaller than the previous one.

I'm off to buying some chairs today. Thanks for the nice words! My calendar has been filling up fast, and I'm surprised to get new customers who want to drive 2,5 hours to see the place.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: dave-G on January 21, 2011, 07:55:50 am
Looking great there Jaakko,  congrats!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: SafeandSound on January 21, 2011, 09:28:20 am
The space does look very "tight", have you got enough distance from
the monitors for the drivers to integrate at monitoring position? Very big speakers for a very small space.

Just observations on the outcome.

I wish you well.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: bblackwood on January 21, 2011, 09:53:37 am
SafeandSound wrote on Fri, 21 January 2011 08:28

The space does look very "tight", have you got enough distance from
the monitors for the drivers to integrate at monitoring position? Very big speakers for a very small space.

Just observations on the outcome.

I wish you well.

You can tell that from these pics?

I mean, we can't all have palatial spaces like you, but c'mon...
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: SafeandSound on January 21, 2011, 12:25:22 pm
Lol,you are right Brad my studio is a decent size for the job at hand, though I would not call it palacial, it's optimal.

I am just suggesting that I am glad my speakers not cramped in which in the photo it does indeed look to be as anyone can see for their very own eyes. Amazing how a space turns into a small box when the treatment has been installed. (been there before)

People should not expect graces (lets call them jokes) that are not spared for me is what I am saying. I don't forget things when people have taken the p*ss so when the time is right I return the complement in full.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: dave-G on January 21, 2011, 12:51:47 pm
SafeandSound wrote on Fri, 21 January 2011 12:25

Lol,you are right Brad my studio is a decent size for the job at hand, though I would not call it palacial, it's optimal.

I am just suggesting that I am glad my speakers not cramped in which in the photo it does indeed look to be as anyone can see for their very own eyes. Amazing how a space turns into a small box when the treatment has been installed. (been there before)

People should not expect graces (lets call them jokes) that are not spared for me is what I am saying. I don't forget things when people have taken the p*ss so when the time is right I return the complement in full.

Somehow, that concept of "p*ss" reciprocity, in this thread, on this forum ... well, it seems a bit short on that feeling of "here's a guy who'll be posting here for a long time".

Just sayin'.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on January 21, 2011, 01:42:04 pm
SafeandSound wrote on Fri, 21 January 2011 16:28

The space does look very "tight", have you got enough distance from the monitors for the drivers to integrate at monitoring position? Very big speakers for a very small space.


The speakers are a little over two metres apart, could be 2,3m. Don't remember the last distance I went for, and I'll still probably be nudging them for the better when I get my Sound Anchors stands here. That might take 3-5 weeks, unfortunately.

The drivers integrate perfectly, and I could actually be a little closer. However, the room feels and measures the best from the current position I'm at.

I'm pleased how the designer understood that I want a slightly livelier room and I'm going to use speakers that have a very wide dispersion and a good polar response. The sweet spot is huge.

SafeandSound wrote on Fri, 21 January 2011 19:25

Amazing how a space turns into a small box when the treatment has been installed. (been there before)


Funnily enough, that didn't happen here, altough I was expecting it to happen. I think my room is about 23 square metres, same size as my old room, but it's a lot more cubic metres and the place just *feels* big. Remember, the design also allows some bass to go through the walls.

My first room was an apartment room, damped, much like yours. Yes, it began to feel like a small box after treatment, but what can you do when it's all concerete walls and all you can do is to kill as much echo as you can.

SafeandSound wrote on Fri, 21 January 2011 19:25

People should not expect graces (lets call them jokes) that are not spared for me is what I am saying. I don't forget things when people have taken the p*ss so when the time is right I return the complement in full.


http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Internet_Tough_Guy
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Jerry Tubb on January 21, 2011, 01:50:53 pm
 
Quote:

http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Internet_Tough_Guy


Hahaha funny stuff, so much posturing on the net.

Your room is looking great Jaakko, congrats!

Gee I like the red wallpaper and all the natural wood.

Cheers, JT
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: SafeandSound on January 21, 2011, 01:56:51 pm
A picture is worth a thousand words. Laughing
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Gold on January 21, 2011, 05:00:47 pm
Looks great Jaakko! It must feel nice to get the exact speakers you want. I know you have been working on them a long time.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: mcsnare on January 21, 2011, 11:29:29 pm
I'm loving the look of the new room! It's really coming along nicely.

Dave
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on February 03, 2011, 03:53:31 pm
It's time for another update!

I've been working in the new room for two weeks now, and while there's still a lot of cosmetic work to do (including painting), and the cabling is not a 100% done yet, things are beginning to look quite good and I'm able to work.

The first attended session in this room was today, and it's always great to meet new people. The next attended ones are on Saturday and Tuesday, so I'm not even near going crazy from being alone in the room all day.

Aside from the cosmetic work, I'm really going to need to figure out the lights, as I'm not at all happy with them. I have a lot of nice things planned - small spots behind the speakers, pointing upwards, separate, hidden lights for the shelves on the back..

I've really just been sitting down in the room and getting a good feel of what I really want. The same thing with cosmetic stuff, really.

Sorry for the blurry pictures! I ain't much of a photographer, and now that the bright construction lights are gone, the shutter times went over the roof and my poor hand just can't keep it steady.

I'm getting a professional photographer here, and also having a new website made. Probably in March or so.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_etukuva_vaaka.jpg

So, the 32" LCD screen is there, I love it. Much better than having a smaller monitor closer to you. On the right you can see my old DAW - I keep it there because I have a couple of projects I'm revisiting soon, and it's just much easier to run them from the old DAW. The machine room needs a shelving system, right now all I have there is my new DAW and an UPS on top of it.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_etuoik_vaaka.jpg

How do you like my new desk? I think it's gorgeous, the guy who did it did a really good job. I didn't go for a Sterling Modular Plan A, because the stock models are just too damned chunky for me. I want space for my feet under the desk, and I love some rounder shapes, too.

I could have ordered a custom desk (like Darius did), but since this desk costed about the same as the stock Plan A would have, I saw no reason in that.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_etuoik_pysty.jpg

Yep, the front end feels really spacey, even if the angled ceiling is pretty low at the very front of the room.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_poyta_takavas1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_poyta_takaa1.jpg

I have some rack space in the back, mostly for PSU's. The only thing there is my 4-channel Jung regulator PSU. Two channels for the Barry Porter EQ and one for the Foote Control Systems P3SL.

The power cable mess is very much temporary. My Furman P-1400 AR-E isn't installed yet. There's also going to be an outlet on the floor for the desk.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_kaiutin1.jpg

The right speaker and the studio mascot.. I really wish to have my Sound Anchors here soon.

I really, really love how the whole system works, the room and the speakers. They tell me exactly what I want, and the jobs I've done in the new room have went really well. They're also fun to listen to - and now a bright sounding record or a midrange poke doesn't piss me off (like it did in the old place), now I just hear what it sounds like.

The speakers are very dynamic and reveal compression and sibilance problems well. I'm really picky with compression and need to hear everything. EQ adjustments feel easy, too.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_vehkeet.jpg

Blurry photo of what I have in there right now.

Left, from bottom to top: Barry Porter EQ - Knif Audio Pure Mu compessor - FCS P3SL compressor (prototype) - Gyraf Audio G10 compressor (very early prototype I put together in 2003 or so).

Right, from bottom to top: Passive transfer console - LCEQ, a passive EQ with tube gain make-up - Crane Song HEDD192 - Weiss DAC2.

There's going to be a few changes:

The passive console is going to be replaced really soon. I have all the parts, just need to design the front panels and order. It's going to be a little simpler - a 2k5 bridged-T Shallco/Marchand attenuator for monitor volume, monitor/process source selectors, dim/mute/mono -switch, three inserts (the current one has 6). 4HE, and as you can see, the space is already reserved.

There are going to be two Weston model 862 VU meters, right now I'm thinking of putting them next to the Weiss DAC2 and angle them properly for a good vision. They fit that space well, tried & tested.

A 2HE tranny box.. Got all the parts already.

The LCEQ will get an external power supply. The mains transformer has developed a slight mechanical hum, and tightening the lams didn't work. This will also move the power switch to an easier location.

I really need a 3rd EQ, a simple one. The BAX EQ is cool, but I can't resist designing an EQ of my own. It might be all passive, not sure yet.

As you can see, it's a simple set-up, and I have no plans to collect too many more compressors & EQ's. I like simplicity.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_takaa1.jpg

The back side.. I'm still negotiating with my wife about that trunk, which belonged to her great grandmother. I believe that's about the right location for it, but she begs to differ.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_takavas1.jpg

There's a Studer B67 MKII. Don't use it much to tell you the truth. The ugly frame was custom made for the Finnish National Radio (YLE). I need to do something about it, because it rings like a bell sometimes.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_kattoelem1.jpg

I got the ceiling things finished.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on February 03, 2011, 03:54:49 pm
When we started, it was still early autumn and things were pretty green.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_talvi1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_talvi2.jpg

Now it's winter.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on February 03, 2011, 03:59:35 pm
Gold wrote on Sat, 22 January 2011 00:00

Looks great Jaakko! It must feel nice to get the exact speakers you want. I know you have been working on them a long time.


Thanks! Indeed I have worked for a long time on them.. Feels good to be rewarded. I'm sure I won't stop with crossover development, but once I've serviced and cleaned up the old ATC crossover, it's gonna serve as the standard I'm trying to beat.

mcsnare wrote on Sat, 22 January 2011 06:29

I'm loving the look of the new room! It's really coming along nicely.


Thanks, Dave. Two completely different world we have here!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: bblackwood on February 03, 2011, 04:02:31 pm
Awesome update, looks amazing. Love how personal it is.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Garrett H on February 03, 2011, 04:36:37 pm
You might be able to dampen the Studer to prevent it from ringing.  That would allow you to keep her and not have the ringing be a distraction.

Thank you again for the wonderful photos and updates!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Peter Beckmann on February 03, 2011, 05:31:26 pm
Looking great Jaakko

Some thin sorbothane glued to the Studer's panels on the inside should damp it down. I had a rack shelf that used to ring and that's how I stopped that.

Amazing to look back at the first pictures you posted and see how far you've come.


Peter
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: ggidluck on February 03, 2011, 05:51:47 pm
Man, you guys get a lot of snow!

It's great to see everything coming together. I love to see threads like this. It gives me ideas.

Did you need to do something to drive the video display from a longer distance?

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: TotalSonic on February 03, 2011, 06:22:26 pm
bblackwood wrote on Thu, 03 February 2011 16:02

Awesome update, looks amazing. Love how personal it is.


A very big plus one on all of the above!!

Best regards,
Steve Berson
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on February 04, 2011, 01:59:57 am
TotalSonic wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 01:22

bblackwood wrote on Thu, 03 February 2011 16:02

Awesome update, looks amazing. Love how personal it is.


A very big plus one on all of the above!!


It's nice to hear you're seeing it looking peronal, because that's what I want it to look like. Cool.

Garrett H wrote on Thu, 03 February 2011 23:36

You might be able to dampen the Studer to prevent it from ringing.


Peter Beckmann wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 00:31

Some thin sorbothane glued to the Studer's panels on the inside should damp it down. I had a rack shelf that used to ring and that's how I stopped that.


Yeah, that's what I need to do. Thin sheets of bitumen are also great for this, appliable with a heat gun. The inner walls of the speakers a treated like this. It was fun to compare the un-treated, but well braced cabinet to the damped one. Now all I get is a stone-like "thuck" as I knock in the cabinets.

Peter Beckmann wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 00:31

Amazing to look back at the first pictures you posted and see how far you've come.


Indeed! I also like to look at the first pictures and try to remember there's a yard somewhere.

ggidluck wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 00:51

Did you need to do something to drive the video display from a longer distance?


It's a HDMI connector I used, all digital and coming straight out of the DAW. My older DAW doesn't have a HDMI output, and when I use a 5 metre VGA cable for that, you can clearly see shadows on the picture.

I'm a little dumb with TV's. This is my first flat TV, haven't bought one earlier because my TV waqtching is down to zero, pretty much. But, is the HDMI standard a little slow? The frame rate isn't too good when I scroll through the timeline, and I think it was much better when connected with VGA.

Not that it bothers me, I actually shut down the TV for most of the time, but I'm just curious.

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Tomas Danko on February 04, 2011, 01:37:48 pm
Viitalahde wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 06:59

TotalSonic wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 01:22

bblackwood wrote on Thu, 03 February 2011 16:02

Awesome update, looks amazing. Love how personal it is.


A very big plus one on all of the above!!


It's nice to hear you're seeing it looking peronal, because that's what I want it to look like. Cool.

Garrett H wrote on Thu, 03 February 2011 23:36

You might be able to dampen the Studer to prevent it from ringing.


Peter Beckmann wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 00:31

Some thin sorbothane glued to the Studer's panels on the inside should damp it down. I had a rack shelf that used to ring and that's how I stopped that.


Yeah, that's what I need to do. Thin sheets of bitumen are also great for this, appliable with a heat gun. The inner walls of the speakers a treated like this. It was fun to compare the un-treated, but well braced cabinet to the damped one. Now all I get is a stone-like "thuck" as I knock in the cabinets.

Peter Beckmann wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 00:31

Amazing to look back at the first pictures you posted and see how far you've come.


Indeed! I also like to look at the first pictures and try to remember there's a yard somewhere.

ggidluck wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 00:51

Did you need to do something to drive the video display from a longer distance?


It's a HDMI connector I used, all digital and coming straight out of the DAW. My older DAW doesn't have a HDMI output, and when I use a 5 metre VGA cable for that, you can clearly see shadows on the picture.

I'm a little dumb with TV's. This is my first flat TV, haven't bought one earlier because my TV waqtching is down to zero, pretty much. But, is the HDMI standard a little slow? The frame rate isn't too good when I scroll through the timeline, and I think it was much better when connected with VGA.

Not that it bothers me, I actually shut down the TV for most of the time, but I'm just curious.



Flatscreen TVs tend to come with quite high latency. On many units there is a special mode for playing games, where it turns off some functionality in order to improve response. Try and see if you can find it.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: ggidluck on February 04, 2011, 03:12:25 pm
A friend was telling me that there are newer tv's coming out that run at a higher clocking rate. And the difference is noticable.

Also LCD's don't update the screen as fast vs plasma displays.

I will likely have to go VGA to HDMI, so probably I can put a box in between that will convert and act as a repeater. This should give a little extra length on the cabling.

I came across some baluns the other day that allow you to use
CAT5 to go however long you need to go. That might be the way to go in a big room.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: jdg on February 04, 2011, 04:28:36 pm
my large LCD TV i use in the studio looks terrible for movies and video..
good thing i just do audio Smile
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: dave-G on February 06, 2011, 08:35:14 am
jdg wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 16:28

my large LCD TV i use in the studio looks terrible for movies and video..
good thing i just do audio Smile

Actually -- how's that working out as a monitor?

As a major-league myope, I squint to read the tiny text and lose the cursor frequently on screens that are much closer.  Is your big-ole screen decently legible at distance?

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Waltz Mastering on February 06, 2011, 10:05:46 am
The studio is looking great Jaako.

The only thing that's throwing me off a bit is the color of the green chair clashing with the marine blue out board piece...other than that..kudo's

Love the console design... who built it?

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on February 06, 2011, 11:56:58 am
Waltz Mastering wrote on Sun, 06 February 2011 17:05

The only thing that's throwing me off a bit is the color of the green chair clashing with the marine blue out board piece...other than that..kudo's


I have a feeling that the marine blue thing is not going to be long there. My use for it comes and goes, and now I haven't used it in a long time.

The green chair I bought from an used office supplies store. It's a pretty damned expensive Kinnarps chair, and the green was the only color they had. I decided to take it since it was just so good to sit on. I know it deviates a little from the color scheme, but doesn't look all that bad. Except for the clash, maybe.

It's true that small text on that LCD screen is a little difficult to read. I might experiment with resolution settings a little more to help this. 32" is still pretty much the perfect size, because more always means a larger reflective surface - and it'd look kind of dumb, too.

I placed it pretty low. Feels comfy.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: jdg on February 06, 2011, 12:15:30 pm
dave-G wrote on Sun, 06 February 2011 05:35

jdg wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 16:28

my large LCD TV i use in the studio looks terrible for movies and video..
good thing i just do audio Smile

Actually -- how's that working out as a monitor?

As a major-league myope, I squint to read the tiny text and lose the cursor frequently on screens that are much closer.  Is your big-ole screen decently legible at distance?




its OK for reading email. but i do catch my self leaning forward at times
i say a 50+ incher would be even better. (the LCD i have is 48inches)
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: bleen on February 06, 2011, 12:50:23 pm
jdg wrote on Sun, 06 February 2011 09:15

i say a 50+ incher would be even better


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgjQbni4ZqE...
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on February 06, 2011, 02:26:32 pm
Waltz Mastering wrote on Sun, 06 February 2011 17:05

Love the console design... who built it?


Lauri Vartola: http://lauripoika.fi/

He did a really good job there. The design is mostly mine, gave him most of the dimensions and gave some artistic freedom in few details.

I haven't preached yet enough how big an improvement a small footprint desk really is. My previous desk was designed for both mixing and mastering (in case someone wanted to mix in the same room I used), and it was obviously huge:

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs239.snc3/22 661_290984058180_278311633180_3587750_5836305_n.jpg

I also only had 2x 4HE in front, and that meant I had most of my stuff on the right and was working off the sweet spot most of the time. Not fun at all.

Now, having everything centralized, things feel just so much easier.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: domc on February 06, 2011, 05:30:56 pm
dave-G wrote on Sun, 06 February 2011 23:35

jdg wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 16:28

my large LCD TV i use in the studio looks terrible for movies and video..
good thing i just do audio Smile

Actually -- how's that working out as a monitor?

As a major-league myope, I squint to read the tiny text and lose the cursor frequently on screens that are much closer.  Is your big-ole screen decently legible at distance?



same issue here
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: MoreSpaceEcho on February 06, 2011, 07:29:05 pm
Quote:

I'm still negotiating with my wife about that trunk, which belonged to her great grandmother. I believe that's about the right location for it, but she begs to differ.


i hope you prevail. that trunk makes the room!
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: eric broyhill on February 07, 2011, 03:31:09 am
Very cool of you to take the time to post your progress, really like everything your doing and agree the chest is perfect.

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: William Bowden on February 08, 2011, 12:17:52 pm
Viitalahde wrote on Fri, 04 February 2011 07:54

When we started, it was still early autumn and things were pretty green.

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_talvi1.jpg

http://www.virtalahde.com/0302_talvi2.jpg

Now it's winter.


Seeing this makes me think I'm in the wrong hemisphere, we've just had the typical february heatwave and it was 41 degrees outside...

The room is looking lovely and that curve on the rear of the console looks like a work of art. A great way to dispense with the old problem of a flat reflective surface too. I predict many happy hours safe from the world in your little studio, sometimes I wish I could take such a spartan approach to gear, but there's always some shiny new bauble attracting my attention!

Now I must do some files for Wim, he's been very patient with me.

Good one Jaacko, I salute you.

The King
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: ggidluck on February 08, 2011, 12:56:58 pm
I see a couple of chimneys in your house... but how are you heating the studio building?
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on February 10, 2011, 07:43:20 am
William Bowden wrote on Tue, 08 February 2011 19:17

Seeing this makes me think I'm in the wrong hemisphere, we've just had the typical february heatwave and it was 41 degrees outside...


Uhh. The comfort side in me likes warm, but not hot. That's hot!

William Bowden:

The room is looking lovely and that curve on the rear of the console looks like a work of art. A great way to dispense with the old problem of a flat reflective surface too.


To tell you the truth, I first specced that curve purely for aesthetical reasons, then figured that it possibly can't be worse than an angled flat surface.

William Bowden:

sometimes I wish I could take such a spartan approach to gear, but there's always some shiny new bauble attracting my attention!


Whatever works for you! I've always liked a minimal approach in just about everything. There's still a few odd pieces coming in, but in terms of EQ and compressin, I could just go on with these for ages.

ggidluck wrote on Tue, 08 February 2011 19:56

I see a couple of chimneys in your house... but how are you heating the studio building?


There's a floor heating system installed in the concrete slab, check out the first two pages of this topic. Has worked well so far! I like to keep the temperature a little below 20 degrees, myself.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: jackthebear on February 10, 2011, 04:50:36 pm
Once again Jaakko,

My sincerest congratulations goes out to you.......this is a remarkable achievement and you should be very proud of what you have created here........enjoy it in good health brother!!!

I hope this will serve as an inspiration to others that despite what many doomsday peddlars post on the internots.........when you back yourself you can achieve pretty much whatever you set your mind to.....

Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Viitalahde on February 11, 2011, 03:15:27 pm
Thanks Tony, that means a lot to me!

I'm not a genius by any stretch, but I just like to think things through when we're talking about long term investments - let that be a new piece of equipment or a new studio. I always have a target set up to few years into the future, and this is what I shoot for. Thinking things through is also a vital part of any business, IMO, as well as taking risks.

The first tastes of the idea of having a small mastering room in the countryside I had during summer of 2001, back when I knew practically nothing about mastering. Later on, I simply figured what I needed to do to achieve the goal, and went for it.

Of course, I have a new goal in mind already, or perhaps a few smaller ones. Never stop - and take care of the old goals, too.
Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: jackthebear on February 11, 2011, 06:45:48 pm
Viitalahde wrote on Sat, 12 February 2011 07:15

Thanks Tony, that means a lot to me!

I'm not a genius by any stretch, but I just like to think things through when we're talking about long term investments - let that be a new piece of equipment or a new studio. I always have a target set up to few years into the future, and this is what I shoot for. Thinking things through is also a vital part of any business, IMO, as well as taking risks.

The first tastes of the idea of having a small mastering room in the countryside I had during summer of 2001, back when I knew practically nothing about mastering. Later on, I simply figured what I needed to do to achieve the goal, and went for it.

Of course, I have a new goal in mind already, or perhaps a few smaller ones. Never stop - and take care of the old goals, too.


That's a pleasure Jaakkoo,

Geniuses are made.......not born......your philosophy and approach is genius brother.....

I've believed for a very long time now that mastering / life etc is first and foremost a mental game.......once you've got that down.the rest just manifests.....


Title: Re: Virtalähde Mastering, Finland - the build thread
Post by: Dave Rose on March 05, 2011, 08:19:01 am
Well said! What's you next goal? A Mastering Studio on top of a sky scraper?