R/E/P Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: TFK M15 24-track practicality?  (Read 11710 times)

JGreenslade

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 824
TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« on: January 25, 2005, 02:17:16 PM »

Hello to all,

Every now and again I see 24-track M15s come up for sale, and I was wondering, are they as practical a proposition as say a Studer 820 / 827?

I know a handful of people who keep parts for 2-track TFK machines, but the 24-track seems to be a rare bird.

Could you take on an M15 24-track as a long-term machine, bearing in mind service / parts etc? Has anyone here used one? I'm guessing it probably sounds at least as good as a Studer?

Cheers,
Justin
Logged
Audio is a vocational affliction

"there is no "homeopathic" effect in bits and bytes." - HansP

Barry Hufker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8228
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2005, 01:15:03 PM »

Justin,

I don't know the full story on this machine but I do know that when the Telefunken decks were being made, at least the 2 tracks were incredible machines that Studer couldn't touch in quality.  As I understand it, the machines were built very well and because the tape recorder division was part of a much larger company, they sold the decks at a loss!  That only last a few years until the rest of the company figured out what was happening.  Telefunken then spun the company off and it quickly went bankrupt.  There was still a large demand for machines of this type and Willi Studer was convinced he could make one as good as Telefunken.  He made a special model for German broadcasters and studios but quickly realized he was going to lose a lot of money so he canceled the model.

Now having said all this, there is a site where you can get Telefunken parts.  In fact I believe this gentleman owns **all** the remaining parts stock.  The site is:www.hilpert-audio.de/

This is the guy who probably can give you the best advice.

Barry
Logged

JGreenslade

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 824
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2005, 01:37:01 PM »

Thank-you Barry for the useful link, and the background Thumbs Up  

To tell the truth, I do not think I will buy a 24-trk M15 any time soon, but the info will be useful for future reference.

I have been looking into a 1/2" M15 2-trk machine for some time now, and the Hilpert link will be useful. He might even have some heads for my TFK tape echo as well : - )

Thanks,
Justin
Logged
Audio is a vocational affliction

"there is no "homeopathic" effect in bits and bytes." - HansP

RMoore

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4584
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2005, 02:29:47 PM »

I know an engineer who I believe has one, in Japan (!) - I will see him this week in London & can ask..
All the best,
Ryan
Logged
People's Republic of Ryan

http://www.myspace.com/twilightcircus
 http://www.youtube.com/user/Ryonik
 
By the end of today, another day is gone forever. You will never get it back.
We must never let up for a second. Work harder at every single thing - Terry Manning

 You miss 100 percent of the shots you never take - Wayne Gretzky

Oliver Archut

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1125
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2005, 02:14:03 PM »

AEG-Telefunken built the first production tape machine the K1 and stopped with the last version the M15 design. Here again a story way to complex to put it up in a short mail/posting. In my experience the M5/10/12 and 15 frames chassis either set up as a 2 or four track  (5/10) or the twelve track M12 and the 2/4/12/24 track set up M15 works better than any Ampex, Studer and the like.
Problem was like with a Tele stuff the high price tag, but technological level was never reached by any of the competitors.
The tape machine division was closed at the same time than the ELA division, remaining interest were sold to the Fernseh GmbH a subdivision of Bosch.

There are several people/dealers that ended up with some of the remaining parts/stock, but Tele machines never left germany/europe, so if you do not have a frequency converter/ variable drive, you end up with more problems aside trying to come up with the standard replacement parts, technicians that can keep them running, etc.

Attached a pic of the first K1 machine...

Best regards,

 
Logged
Oliver Archut
www.tab-funkenwerk.com

We are so advanced, that we can develop technology that can determine how much damage the earth has taken from the development of that technology.

Oliver Archut

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1125
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2005, 02:24:52 PM »

Here is a nice pic of the design team at the AEG Kabelwerk Operspree R&D lab, were the first tape machine the K1, the first condenser mic the CMV1 and other mile stones in audio history were developed. George Neumann worked there before starting his own company.
The pic includes Braunmuehl and Weber, the same gentleman that invented the Braunmuehl/Weber capsule or better known as M7, as well as the high frequency bias for the magnet tape, etc. etc.
Logged
Oliver Archut
www.tab-funkenwerk.com

We are so advanced, that we can develop technology that can determine how much damage the earth has taken from the development of that technology.

bushwick

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 624
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2005, 12:13:50 AM »

Hi.

I remember seeing one at John French's place (JRF Magnetics) and I am sure he would have some info for you regarding the feasibility of maintaining one should you even be starting with a properly functioning machine. In most things it is bad to generalize, but all but put that aside when it comes to the older german audio technology. To extend that to the recording devices, to their top of the line devices, I am sure you can assume that when properly working, they would sound as good as the best you've heard.

Again, you ought to talk to John, he might have more experience with tape machines than anyone in the US.

If I remember correctly, he said that the wearable part of the headstack on those machines was by comparison very thin. At this point in the analog studio situation, any machines is only really worth what the heads are worth. With a machine with worn heads, or in this case even brand new heads, you have to think about replacement cost. I am going to venture that it is really not worth your time or money to get involved unless you need a new child in your life. If you are married or have a girlfriend, you better ask first.

Best.
Logged
Joshua Kessler
bushwick  studio
brooklyn, ny
www.bushwickstudio.com

YZ

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 868
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2006, 10:17:23 PM »

Oliver Archut wrote on Thu, 27 January 2005 17:14

(...)Tele machines never left germany/europe (...)
 


I remember seeing a pair of M15/24s and an M15/2 at a studio in Manhattan in 1985; can't remember the name of the studio but they had a Harrison 4832 console.

Also there was a studio in S
Logged
regards,

YZ

synthi

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 36
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2006, 10:12:01 AM »

I have a M15-2 here, nice machine  Cool

I`m looking for the test/alignment/adjust procedures for the M15, Oliver, do you have the info?

Thanks!

Synthi
Logged

Oliver Archut

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1125
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2006, 07:46:05 AM »


Hello Synthi,

sorry can not help you with tape machine information, I have a few infos on real early stuff like pictures, a few schematics (only tube electronics).

Best regards,

Oliver
Logged
Oliver Archut
www.tab-funkenwerk.com

We are so advanced, that we can develop technology that can determine how much damage the earth has taken from the development of that technology.

Barry Hufker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8228
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2006, 03:33:42 PM »

Synthi,

You really do need to click on the Hilpert link.  They have everything for Telefunken machines.

Barry
Logged

synthi

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 36
Re: TFK M15 24-track practicality?
« Reply #11 on: December 15, 2006, 04:19:14 PM »

Tghanks a lot Oliver and Larry,

I`ll check Smile

Best Regards,

Synthi
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
 

Site Hosted By Ashdown Technologies, Inc.

Page created in 0.095 seconds with 20 queries.