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Author Topic: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?  (Read 1761 times)

Glenn Bucci

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Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« on: December 02, 2016, 07:19:43 am »

Their web site states the Chandler Limited REDD Microphone was designed to handle a variety of source material, including: vocals, strings, piano, drums, bass guitar, electric and acoustic guitars.Features available from the microphone body, include: REDD.47 Mic Amplifier, providing nine gain selections, from +4 to +33db in the ‘NORM’ position, extended gain and punch in ‘DRIVE’ mode for more tonal and coloration possibilities, switchable Cardioid/Omni patterns, 10db Pad, and Phase reverse. Continuous output and low-contour control are accessible from the high-quality external power supply.

I am not as smart about electronics as some here, but a common sense approach is not to put a mic amplifier with 9 gain settings on the mic as this can cause issues.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmrRuT_SA-s
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gtoledo3

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2016, 11:34:47 am »

I have seen some references that make me think that the amplifier is actually all inside the mic and not in the PSU, since they keep referring to the redd as being the actual mic amplifying circuit.

Strikes me as odd, since I can't imagine fitting two full size EF type tubes in the mic body and having it be reasonable...fit wise, or heat wise.

So that makes me wonder if they have turned one stage of the Redd circuit to solidstate, or a submini. Either would be a bit of a concession.

Or maybe it really all is stuffed in the PSU.

The ambiguous nature of the marketing material is a turn off in not answering these sort of questions. It makes it more about vague allusions to the Beatles, with a piece of gear never ever used by the Beatles.
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soapfoot

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2016, 11:55:52 am »

You could lose everything before the grid of the EF86, which is a lot, including the input transformer. Just inject the high-impedance capsule signal right into the EF86.

At that point, you could stick the E88CC in the power supply with little or no penalty, if you wanted to. Or maybe you could squeeze both tubes in there... when you remove everything before the EF86 grid, parts count gets pretty low.

Not sure what this is trying to solve, but I won't comment negatively until I've heard it.
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gtoledo3

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #3 on: December 02, 2016, 12:57:10 pm »

Sure. I'm only commenting about the ambiguity of the marketing materials so far. Which I will criticize, since they already exist and hit on some pet peeves  ;D
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klaus

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2016, 08:20:06 pm »

Quote
The REDD.51 console and its REDD.47 line amplifiers left their unique and exceptional sonic character on Beatles records recorded at Abbey Road Studios’ Studio Two during 1964-1968
So it says on the Chandler Company's product page.  And that may be correct, for all I know, but what bearing does this have on the mic pre's used at Abbey Road at that time, which were Siemens-branded, TAB-made V72 and V76? THEIR circuitry does not fit inside a microphone. A line amp is one thing, a mic pre another.
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Klaus Heyne
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gtoledo3

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2016, 11:22:10 pm »

Hmmm. Redd47 *line amp*. I see.

I had mistakenly thought they were talking about the redd *preamp* that was a stand in for the v72, but probably without an input transformer (as Brad had speculated about it probably not having).

Huh. Even more confused by it now  :)
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soapfoot

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2016, 11:31:36 am »

the REDD.47 "line amp" is was indeed used as a mic preamp in the REDD.51 desks, according to the "Recording the Beatles" book.

Telefunken V72 were also in use earlier on, according to that same source (I cannot recall the transition date, and do not have the book in front of me-- it's at the studio). The REDD.47 was EMI's attempt to improve upon the V72 for use in-house (whether they succeeded or not sonically is up for obvious debate, but they certainly did not succeed in terms of reliability, as the REDD.47 in cassette form ran notoriously hot).

Of course, to attribute the "exceptional sonic character" of Beatles recordings to a mic or line amp is probably a bit misguided, making the whole point moot.
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klaus

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2016, 12:55:24 pm »

I still don't get it: two miniature EF804s working in a small mic housing with no heat sinking?

And the philosophy as a whole is also not my cup of tea. We went through the concept of delivering line level/pre-processed sound right out of the mic with Neumann's Solution D. But doesn't locking into a fixed pre amp sound reduce the engineer's creative choices?
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Klaus Heyne
German Masterworks
www.GermanMasterworks.com

soapfoot

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2016, 01:09:28 pm »

It doesn't sound like a good idea to me either, Klaus.

It seems more like "a solution in search of a problem."

But not having tried it, I won't condemn it out of hand.
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gtoledo3

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #9 on: December 05, 2016, 04:02:35 pm »

I was doing an internet search to refresh my memory on some things, and thought it was interesting how Oliver had described a setup with v72/v76 going *into* the Redd47 amp. And also a reference to the Redd being basically out of a Siemens handbook.

http://repforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/topic,5272.msg49344.html#msg49344

Of course that was awhile before the Beatles book came out.

I would speculate that the output stage of the mic in question may have been turned solidstate or might use a submini to save space/reduce heat. It could be done without a heinous impact on the sound in a telefunken V series, so maybe it would work with a Redd circuit too.

I'd think that with a ticket price like there is, that someone would want to know these details before even moving forward to attempt to try one out. It's a weird era though, I suppose.

The one thing I guess it may "solve" is that - as Brad had hinted at - two transformers can probably be lopped out. The typical mic output transformer and the mic preamp input transformer can probably be eliminated, with only one output transformer needed. So, cheaper.
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broncoblair

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2016, 04:37:10 am »

Adam from Chandler is coming by my studio tomorrow... If he permits, I'll record some things. I may have to wait to put them out there till they start shipping but I'll be happy to report back !
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broncoblair

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #11 on: December 15, 2016, 05:22:14 am »

Adam from Chandler stopped by the studio today and we shot out the new Chandler REDD mic with my Telefunken USA U48. I can't post any audio but I can describe some things.

On vocal. Immediately noticeable extended low end compared to my U48. That could be many factors with my U48 since it's made by Telefunken USA, I have shot my 48 out with other vintage U47's and it held its own, the low end between my Telefunken USA and other vintage U47's was never an issue. The REDD seems to have quite a nice bump down there. The midrange was sweet but not as detailed as the U48. There was a higher extended top end that exceeded the top end on my U48 (mine has a Thiersch PVC M7). It wasn't the type of high end perhaps you would get on an M269 comparing to something like a U67, but something maybe a little lower like 8-12K. The vocalist reacted to the mic being very impressed. He's someone I've done 2 records with always using the 48 for vocals.

On acoustic guitar, very much the same. A larger amount of low end than my U48, even a few feet back. It didn't sound like too much low end, having recorded acoustics with large diaphragm tube mics, knowing they can be boomy.

The DRIVE feature is nice. It's a subtle but effective tone that pushes the tube preamp. I can see it being very useful on something like a mono drum room or front of kick mic or a bass cab. The vocal with the DRIVE engaged was cool too, just more subtle than I expected.

All in all a very impressive microphone. ...(speculative sentence removed, KH) I certainly intend to have one or 2 !

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Plush

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #12 on: December 17, 2016, 08:47:23 am »

It says "Abbey Road" on the microphone. I don't like that because this mic has nothing to do with Abbey Road studios. There is ZERO relationship to the studio.
I am not interested in this mic concept.
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Jim Williams

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #13 on: December 17, 2016, 11:51:03 am »

I wouldn't let the politics stop me from auditioning it. I'd rather keep an open mind, that way I might discover something useful.
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gtoledo3

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Re: Chandler Redd microphone, any one see one in action yet?
« Reply #14 on: December 17, 2016, 01:53:27 pm »

What is the hole down by the base, above the switches? Is it a small vent?
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