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Author Topic: To the vinyl cutters - clipped waveform  (Read 7096 times)

Matt_G

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Re: To the vinyl cutters - clipped waveform
« Reply #15 on: February 24, 2011, 09:29:58 am »

interesting topic.. is there a general rule in terms of maximum RMS that should be adhered too? I guess what I'm asking is, providing the EQ is well balanced how much level is too much? & at what point is it counter productive?

I'm assuming that if a client wanted mastering done for a dual CD & vinyl release that it's still best to cut 2 versions? One with less or very little level/limiting/clipping for vinyl & one with the usual treatment for CD release?
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Matthew Gray Mastering

Brisbane Australia

Allen Corneau

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Re: To the vinyl cutters - clipped waveform
« Reply #16 on: February 24, 2011, 10:56:17 am »

Matt_G wrote on Thu, 24 February 2011 08:29

I'm assuming that if a client wanted mastering done for a dual CD & vinyl release that it's still best to cut 2 versions? One with less or very little level/limiting/clipping for vinyl & one with the usual treatment for CD release?



That's what I do.
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Allen
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Allen Corneau
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Gold

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Re: To the vinyl cutters - clipped waveform
« Reply #17 on: February 24, 2011, 11:21:42 am »

That's what I do too. Because it sounds better not because it cuts better.
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Paul Gold
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On the silk road, looking for uranium.

bblackwood

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Re: To the vinyl cutters - clipped waveform
« Reply #18 on: February 24, 2011, 11:35:40 am »

Matt_G wrote on Thu, 24 February 2011 08:29

I'm assuming that if a client wanted mastering done for a dual CD & vinyl release that it's still best to cut 2 versions? One with less or very little level/limiting/clipping for vinyl & one with the usual treatment for CD release?

When given the option, this is the ideal solution. Not always possible, however.
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Brad Blackwood
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Jerry Tubb

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Re: To the vinyl cutters - clipped waveform
« Reply #19 on: February 24, 2011, 11:46:03 am »

bblackwood wrote on Thu, 24 February 2011 10:35

Matt_G wrote on Thu, 24 February 2011 08:29

I'm assuming that if a client wanted mastering done for a dual CD & vinyl release that it's still best to cut 2 versions? One with less or very little level/limiting/clipping for vinyl & one with the usual treatment for CD release?

When given the option, this is the ideal solution. Not always possible, however.


Yep we do this quite often, leaving the version destined for vinyl fully dynamic.

Must be morphogenetic resonance amongst real mastering engineers, finding the same solution, independently.

JT
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Terra Nova Mastering
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Matt_G

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Re: To the vinyl cutters - clipped waveform
« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2011, 07:01:32 am »

Thanks for the response. It's what I've been doing to date as well but it's always nice to hear confirmation that this is the best solution to deal with things.

Fortunately with the way I have my workflow model set up, it requires very little additional work to provide the client with both formats in one pass. One of the advantages of Pro Tool's abundant routing options.  

Paul -> so if the only reasons to avoid clipping/limiting for a vinyl release is for the usual reasons we prefer to avoid it & not an actual physical limitation of cutting itself as you seem to indicate; what sort of RMS levels can be achieved with the right mix/cut? I'm assuming it is still a ways under what's achievable on the CD format?    

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Matthew Gray Mastering

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Gold

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Re: To the vinyl cutters - clipped waveform
« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2011, 11:34:04 am »

Matt_G wrote on Fri, 25 February 2011 07:01


Paul -> so if the only reasons to avoid clipping/limiting for a vinyl release is for the usual reasons we prefer to avoid it & not an actual physical limitation of cutting itself as you seem to indicate; what sort of RMS levels can be achieved with the right mix/cut? I'm assuming it is still a ways under what's achievable on the CD format?    




There is no relation between analog and digital levels so I'm not sure how to answer that question. If you are talking about crest factor then peaks don't limit the level in the same way they do in digital. Playback cartridges don't like large crest factors though. I don't think the ear particularly likes them in recorded music either. Probably has as much to do with distortion in the electro mechanical parts of the playback system as the ear.
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Paul Gold
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On the silk road, looking for uranium.
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