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[redfro]

It was more of a feel thing...

[djwayne]

On second thought, I wouldn't use the effect sends to route to an outboard eq, I could use the channel inserts provided with each channel. To quote from the Mackie Manual, "The Channel Insert Jack allows you to insert external processing equipment (such as a compressor, gate, you name it) into the main signal path of the input channel strip....."

[Greg Youngman]

I've used a 32x8 five days a week for a number of years.  Never a problem.  Still burning the original meter lamps!  I've had some great sounding music come out of this room.  Some people gripe of the EQ.  I've found that if you do anything additive you need to pull back on your levels.  The signal can flat-top rather fast even with a 2 or 3 dB boost (especially the highs).  Remember... poor workmen blame their tools.

[Kurt Foster]

djwayne wrote on Fri, 02 June 2006 08:41

On second thought, I wouldn't use the effect sends to route to an outboard eq, I could use the channel inserts provided with each channel. To quote from the Mackie Manual, "The Channel Insert Jack allows you to insert external processing equipment (such as a compressor, gate, you name it) into the main signal path of the input channel strip....."

That's whut I'm talkin' 'bout Willis, and it only took you one day to read the manual and come up with the correct answer.  

Greg Youngman wrote on Fri, 02 June 2006 12:24

Remember... poor workmen blame their tools.

True but on the other hand, most of the serious Craftspersons I have come across use the best tools they get thier hands on.

Use what you got but don't fool yourself that it can't get better, because in most cases, it can.

[djwayne]

I notice YOU didn't say nothin bout any old stinky inserts.

And it only took me about 5 minutes to go with inserts over effect sends, two minutes to double check the manual, and posted when I got around to it.

The eq's on the 8 bus are good enough for my needs, and I rarily use the inserts anyway.

The new ONYX mixers have a "Perkins EQ". So maybe that will make you happy ??

"Put a professional into a room of equipment, and he'll deliver to you a good mix. Put a monkey into the same room, and you can imagine what'll happen."

[Fibes]

djwayne wrote on Fri, 02 June 2006 16:22

I notice YOU didn't say nothin bout any old stinky inserts. And it only took me about 5 minutes to go with inserts over effect sends, two minutes to double check the manual, and posted when I got around to it. The eq's on the 8 bus are good enough for my needs, and I rarily use the inserts anyway. The new ONYX mixers have a "Perkins EQ". So maybe that will make you happy ?? "Put a professional into a room of equipment, and he'll deliver to you a good mix. Put a monkey into the same room, and you can imagine what'll happen."

Look man, there are those of us who see people as they are not how they see themselves.

Personally I wouldn't use the inserts on the Mackie for one main reason; anyone care to guess why?

[djwayne]

Yes it's always good to have the best tools available, but most people have to work within their budget. Do you really need a $1,000 hammer to drive in a nail ??

The Mackie 8 bus was a big expense for me at the time, and has worked out great for me, and still is working out for me for the forseeable future. The size is perfect, not too big, not too small, tons of routing options. Like I've said, I use it for a keyboard mixer for my keyboards and synths, and I also use it to control my 5.1 surround system. I also have a DA-88 all connected and ready to use if I need it, so the Mackie is like the grand central staion of my home studio. It doubles as a very nice patch bay, as I rarily have to change cords around. It really does connect everything in my studio together nicely. It's also connected to my 1010LT card, so everything in my studio is also connected to my computer. Soooo if I want to route something from a DA-88 into Audition 2.0, I just have to press a couple of buttons and I'm there. I also have soft synths on the computer that will play out thru the Mackie into my 5.1 system...Using the MIX B mixer, I can route anything into my headphones, at any level I want, so having the Mackie 8 bus, for me, ties everything together quite nicely.

[floodstage]

djwayne wrote on Fri, 02 June 2006 15:41

Yes it's always good to have the best tools available, but most people have to work within their budget. Do you really need a $1,000 hammer to drive in a nail ??

I use a $450 propane gas powered hammer when I frame rooms, and a different $400 hammer (also propane gas powered) hammer to do finish work.  If those hammers sold for over $1000 ea, I'd still buy both of them.  That's how much of a difference a really good tool makes.

I can build a nice rack cabinet or frame a room with cheap tools, or I can do it faster and with more precision using better tools.

[djwayne]

Use whatever ya got, and get whatever ya can afford.

"You have to go to war with the weapons you have."

[John Ivan]

Fibes wrote on Fri, 02 June 2006 15:32

djwayne wrote on Fri, 02 June 2006 16:22 I notice YOU didn't say nothin bout any old stinky inserts. And it only took me about 5 minutes to go with inserts over effect sends, two minutes to double check the manual, and posted when I got around to it. The eq's on the 8 bus are good enough for my needs, and I rarily use the inserts anyway. The new ONYX mixers have a "Perkins EQ". So maybe that will make you happy ?? "Put a professional into a room of equipment, and he'll deliver to you a good mix. Put a monkey into the same room, and you can imagine what'll happen." Look man, there are those of us who see people as they are not how they see themselves. Personally I wouldn't use the inserts on the Mackie for one main reason; anyone care to guess why?

I don't know your reason but, mine is the channels didn't seem to "behave" the same way after I inserted something, even if it was hard bypassed. It seemed mushy to me. My console has two inserts per channel all on balanced send receive jacks {4 jacks for two inserts.} and inserted devices are invisible when bypassed. It seemed like they didn't buffer the I/O correctly? I don't know.

Also, I found what others did regarding the mix bus. It sure did come apart when there were a lot of channels running.

Having said that, all in all, we made some pretty good recordings on that thing and got used a lot. I was careful about level and lived with a little bit more noise.

They work, they're cheap, and if you get it for free? Maybe you can sub mix a bunch of synths or verb's or something.

[Kurt Foster]

djwayne,
I've used several various Mackie mixers in the past. I did some tracking and mixing for Elmer Lee Thomas years ago at Sharkebite when they were still in Oakland on their 8 Buss.  I recorded the Nik Turner Space Ritual at the Great American Music Hall in SF using my SR24vlz. I've recorded several bands using a 1604vlz that my best friend left to me when he passed away. I have to say everything turned out great. But I also have stuff I've recorded using a 4 track and an old Bi Amp mixer for front end that still sounds good to me. On the same page there's a project I did back in '79 with a cassette deck and a TEAC mixer that I still listen to from time to time.

Along each step of the way, I thought I was doing pretty good for myself. In the back of my mind I always hoped that someday someone would notice the work I had done squeezing the most from what I had, like "WOW, That's amazing work you did in spite of what you had to use." (but that never happened). So I know where this mind set comes from.

But I still remember the first time I got to track a drum session on a Trident mixer. As I was trimming the inputs and adjusting the EQ on the kick drum a realization came to me and I said, "Ohhh! Now I get it!"

Yes use what you have, go to war with whatever weapons you have and all that.  But don't be so close minded that you blind yourself to the horizons that are there waiting for you to discover. In a lot of ways, I envy you because it was such a rush for me when I first heard the difference a really nice console with great pres can make. It's like a woman giving you her virginity. That's an experience that you can only have once in a lifetime. Lucky you, you still have in front of you.

[djwayne]

Kurt Foster wrote on Sat, 03 June 2006 06:24

djwayne, I've used several various Mackie mixers in the past. I did some tracking and mixing for Elmer Lee Thomas years ago at Sharkebite when they were still in Oakland on their 8 Buss.  I recorded the Nik Turner Space Ritual at the Great American Music Hall in SF using my SR24vlz. I've recorded several bands using a 1604vlz that my best friend left to me when he passed away. I have to say everything turned out great. But I also have stuff I've recorded using a 4 track and an old Bi Amp mixer for front end that still sounds good to me. On the same page there's a project I did back in '79 with a cassette deck and a TEAC mixer that I still listen to from time to time. Along each step of the way, I thought I was doing pretty good for myself. In the back of my mind I always hoped that someday someone would notice the work I had done squeezing the most from what I had, like "WOW, That's amazing work you did in spite of what you had to use." (but that never happened). So I know where this mind set comes from. But I still remember the first time I got to track a drum session on a Trident mixer. As I was trimming the inputs and adjusting the EQ on the kick drum a realization came to me and I said, "Ohhh! Now I get it!" Yes use what you have, go to war with whatever weapons you have and all that.  But don't be so close minded that you blind yourself to the horizons that are there waiting for you to discover. In a lot of ways, I envy you because it was such a rush for me when I first heard the difference a really nice console with great pres can make. It's like a woman giving you her virginity. That's an experience that you can only have once in a lifetime. Lucky you, you still have in front of you.

Yawn... I have used some much "bigger and better" boards, and was not impressed. I would hope that a "bigger and better" board would sound good enough to justify the additional costs, but I was not impressed with what I heard. It was good, but for the huge amount of extra money, just not worth it. Sort of like having a pretty girlfriend who's spoiled rotten and insists you take her to the most expensive restaurants, running up your credit cards until you're maxed out, then leaves you for another guy with more money, and calls you a bum, because you don't keep giving her more money. The Mackie doesn't ask for much, and is very easy to please.

Regarding the Mackie, I did numerous sound checks and pink noise test to see how it effected the sound and was pleasantly surprised that no major adjustments were required. The only minor problem I encountered, was if the faders were really pushed up, The Mackie would add some board noise to the music, but keeping the faders at a medium level, the board noise goes away. Other than that, it's a fairly clean sounding board.

[Fibes]

Quote:

My console has two inserts per channel all on balanced send receive jacks {4 jacks for two inserts.} and inserted devices are invisible when bypassed.

Bingo.

[John Ivan]

Oh well, yeah,, sure,, they pass 20-to-20 and if you gain stage them right, they don't make much noise BUT BUT BUT!!

It's worth it to me to have EQ's that sound GOOD on every channel. It's worth it to me to have a mix buss that doesn't sag when 32 tracks of audio and 12 channels of synth and 12 channels of effect returns are dumped on the buss. It's worth it to me to have every single in and out on balanced connections. It's worth it to have access to the channel strips one at a time so if something dies, I can pull ONE channel and keep working.


These are things that change the sound of my work for the better and it's hard to put a price tag on them. I would pay what ever I had to, {if I could} to have these features.The console is still the center piece of what I do..

For me, the best mixer Mackie ever made was the 1604 with the newer pre's. It seems to be the right size and the mixes I did on one of those were better than the 8 buss mixes I did.

But yeah, use what you have and if you don't hear a big difference, then there is no reason to change anything.

JI................................

[djwayne]

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have a shiny new expensive board, but it's just not in the financial cards at this time, and the "clients" I get here in Ohio....well let's just say they're not rolling in dough.

I mean I have to really justify every nickle spent, as it's out of my pocket. Some pro studio's have unlimited budgets and quality is their only concern. Around here, buying a used $300 mic pre-amp is considered a major purchase, and must be carefully thought out and discussed before hand.

My studio is basically for my own personal use, and it is working out well for me. It's just what I wanted. I really don't want a slew of people coming to my studio, most are considered to be more trouble than they're worth, so I'm not trying to impress clients. They can take their pennies down the street to the guy that has the shiny new board with automation.