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Author Topic: New Neumann TLM 49  (Read 48694 times)

Klaus Heyne

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #15 on: April 06, 2006, 04:05:13 pm »

Regarding the headroom of the new mic: your statement is not sensical. The K47 capsule is only marginally less hot than the K67 (ca. 2-4 dB less)
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Klaus Heyne
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Schallfeldnebel

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #16 on: April 06, 2006, 04:06:31 pm »

Tim wrote:"The higher self noise is probably on account of the fact that the K47 capsule doesn't have as hot an output...."

You are right, if we compare the M147 which has 12 dBA selfnoise ref. to 1 Pa. Still 0.5% distortion at 114 dB SPL is a rather limited headroom value. This is about the same as the M147.

Is there a tube inside, powered with 48V ? Only the transformerless output stage is mentioned, I cannot find anything about the first stage, except from that the TLM49 sounds warm.

Erik Sikkema
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Bill Mueller:"Only very recently, has the availability of cheap consumer based gear popularized the concept of a rank amateur as an audio engineer. Unfortunately, this has also degraded the reputation of the audio engineer to the lowest level in its history. A sad thing indeed for those of us professionals."

Tim Campbell

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #17 on: April 06, 2006, 05:01:38 pm »

That is not sensical, regarding the headroom of the new mic. K47 capsule is only marginally less hot than the K67 (ca. 2-4 dB)

Klaus excuse my nit picking, but doesn't this mean you agree with me. This capsule has lower output and so requires additional gain. None of us said this was a terribly noisy mic. On the other hand none of us are sure what kind of an amplifier is used to achieve this additional gain adding to the noise of the mic.
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Sean Eldon Qualls

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #18 on: April 06, 2006, 05:02:14 pm »

no ac701, fet mic in general, cardioid only, not much to do with an m49. they'll sell quite a few of them to home and project studios at that price though.
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Sean Eldon
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J.J. Blair

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #19 on: April 06, 2006, 05:56:53 pm »

Well, it certainly shows that if nothing else, Sennheiser / Neumann has a genius for marketing!  This will certainly keep them in the black.
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Schallfeldnebel

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #20 on: April 06, 2006, 06:15:55 pm »

I keep having questions about the low 114 dBA SPL headroom of this microphone, and I did not read anything about an attenuator. The U87 does even do a better job. (117 dBA standard and 127dBA SPL with pre-attenuator.) The old U47FET had more headroom, 137dBA for 0.5% THD, and only 6dB more noisy than the TLM49.

Erik Sikkema
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Bill Mueller:"Only very recently, has the availability of cheap consumer based gear popularized the concept of a rank amateur as an audio engineer. Unfortunately, this has also degraded the reputation of the audio engineer to the lowest level in its history. A sad thing indeed for those of us professionals."

Klaus Heyne

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #21 on: April 06, 2006, 06:37:26 pm »

This whole conversation is pretty silly, given than no one seems to know anything  aside of what is publicized so far.

But here is a daring theory:
Maybe the low headroom, i.e. propensity to distort, is intentional?
Maybe the goal was to immitate some type of overdrive behavior that was deemed by the designers to "sound attractive"?

Maybe this was a deliberate departure from Neumann's usual 'clean'-philosophy, into the terrain which the Neumann/Sennheiser management by now must be painfully aware of:

Users want sounds that connect emotionally.  A sound which, judging from the countless responses on this and the Neumann forum, customers largely don't believe they are getting from current "clean" products...?

Then, of course, the big question remains: can you engineer that kind of emotional attraction into a (prosumer) mic design through emulation? Or do you actually need a characterful mic with characterful components to begin with?
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Klaus Heyne
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Lars Farm

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #22 on: April 07, 2006, 05:34:35 am »

Klaus Heyne wrote on Fri, 07 April 2006 00:37

Then, of course, the big question remains: can you engineer that kind of emotional attraction into a (prosumer) mic design through emulation? Or do you actually need a characterful mic with characterful components to begin with?


I don't get it. Please explain. How is characterful mic defined? How is characterful components defined?
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maxdimario

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #23 on: April 07, 2006, 07:45:50 am »

lowering the standards in order to sell in volume...
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danickstr

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #24 on: April 07, 2006, 07:59:35 am »

character is comprised of those things that make a mic not exact in its sound reproduction.  Distortion, harmonics, circuit noise and coloration, eq curve.  there is no telling what combo will work for an app, unitl you try it.  this mic may work for someone.  maybe they can get some market share back from Studio Projects (SP.)
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John Monforte

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #25 on: April 08, 2006, 02:16:00 am »

The press release is not yet two days old and already people in this forum are complaining how Neumann is selling out by building a mic with cheap components that is noisy and distorted. The guffaws are deafening.

I, for one, will reserve all comments of the merits of this mic until after I have heard one.

I will be interested to see if the sonic character is unique and well colored. I don't want a mic that sounds identical to either a U47 or M49. I already have those. There are many good things you could do with a K47 and unfortunately all the boutique brands seem to offer is their attempt at duplicating Neumann's old mics.

I am holding on to the hope that the sound is right, the mic is well built, and the price combines to give real value to the user. Wouldn't that be great?

If the only correct answer is a U47 (or M49) then this mic will surely disappoint. I am longing for some creative thinking in mic design.
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Schallfeldnebel

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #26 on: April 08, 2006, 10:03:31 am »

I agree with John Monforte it is silly to judge a thing you have not heard yet. But, if this is a transistorized design, and the upper limit of headroom is on a 114dBA SPL, where predecessor types with K47 membrane had a 137dBA level for 0.5% distortion (U47FET), I keep questions, also when I do not see a pad. I wonder what happens when you put this mike in front of a Marshal tower or bass drumm. Is it possible to create a first stage with FETs having the same characteristics as with tube design?

Erik Sikkema
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Bill Mueller:"Only very recently, has the availability of cheap consumer based gear popularized the concept of a rank amateur as an audio engineer. Unfortunately, this has also degraded the reputation of the audio engineer to the lowest level in its history. A sad thing indeed for those of us professionals."

Gustav

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #27 on: April 08, 2006, 11:44:59 am »

What neumann has at the site about TLM circuits in the PDFs make me think it is a unity gain amp.  3.2ma across 3.4K (phantom resistors in parallel) is about a 11 volt drop leaving 37v for the microphone(the spec has 48 +-4 so it could be as low as 33Vdc).  37V is on the low side so I would guess it has the cmos DC to DC converter inside like in the 103 letting them set the voltage to what they want and a 15volt section for the TLM part.

Like posted above PDF reads like no voltage on the back of the capsule because of the more super cardiod pattern the m7 can be more a true cardiod with a voltage on the back.

This is funny the gefell 930 with a M7 or M9 with a solid state transformerless output.  The TLM 49 is a K47 with a TLM with a different grill for I would guess a different sound.

Gustav
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J.J. Blair

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #28 on: April 08, 2006, 01:47:23 pm »

I'm going to point out here, that if you look at the schematic of the M147, you'd expect it to be a mic which isn't going to sound so great.  I have to say though, I was rather surpised at how nice the mic sounded, even though it was limited in its functionality.  I've already contacted Dawn about getting a TLM49 sent to me.  Based on my experience with the M147, I'm going to go into this with a little less prejudice than I had with the 147.  I might be surprised again.  Who knows?
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They say the heart of Rock & Roll is still beating, which is amazing if you consider all the blow it's done over the years.

"The Internet enables pompous blowhards to interact with other pompous blowhards in a big circle jerk of pomposity." - Bill Maher

"The negative aspects of this business, not only will continue to prevail, but will continue to accelerate in madness. Conditions aren't going to get better, because the economics of rock and roll are getting closer and closer to the economics of Big Business America." - Bill Graham

Jørn Bonne

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Re: New Neumann TLM 49
« Reply #29 on: July 20, 2006, 10:59:10 am »

It's been 3 months. Has anyone had a chance to work with the TLM49 yet? How does it compare on vocal to the classics AND to the M147/M149. What are your impressions?

J
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